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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: kinky d on Tuesday 07 June 22 03:22 BST (UK)

Title: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Tuesday 07 June 22 03:22 BST (UK)
I have a missing GGGrandmother Vulenza Booth  she seems to vanish from NZ records in about 1905/6 in Masterton NZ electorail rolls. I found this passenger list that seems to be her it right age and birth date did she stay in Sydney or move on  to another state or back to UK she was born in Cornwall  St Neot. She was married in 21 Aug 1871 Devon, Plymouth UK Vulenza WELSH  maiden name to Abraham BENYUNES  but took off in 1873 to NZ and married William BOOTH 14 Oct 1875 in Christchurch they together  till 1905/6  then she goes poof, I have everything on family but her.

Name  Booth
Age   66
Immigration Date   1917
Immigration Place   New Zealand
Immigration Place (Original)   Sydney, New Zealand
Departure Date   27 Mar 1917
Birth Year (Estimated)   1851
Arrival Port   Sydney
Departure Port   Auckland
Ship Name   Victoria

Cheers kinky d

Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Jamjar on Tuesday 07 June 22 03:30 BST (UK)
Related thread: https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=850252.0

Jamjar
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Wednesday 08 June 22 03:00 BST (UK)
yip that  last  thread I put up.

cheers kinky d
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: shume on Tuesday 14 June 22 03:28 BST (UK)
The original passenger manifest lists Booth under female so its possible, as the date of birth is correct, that it is her (but not confirmed)
Do you know when William Booth died and did she leave NZ after that? It was during WW1 so unlikely she could get a passage back to England  then. Did she have chn or family living in Australia that she could go to in 1917?
shume    australia
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: shume on Tuesday 14 June 22 09:12 BST (UK)
Just a further update ? on Vulenza Booth.
An Ancestry tree has her husband William Booth admitted to Auckland Charitable Aid Board in 1924 and dying in 1934( buried with his parents d 1896) at Linwood cemetery. The funeral arranged by Mrs W Dick who was his daughter Eliza Mary Booth who married William Dick in 1903 at Linwood.
Although you may already have all of this, it does point to either Vulenza leaving him and/or predeceasing him but where? Vulenza is not buried with him.

shume
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Tuesday 14 June 22 11:39 BST (UK)
I can not find a  death  anywhere in NZ  for her, it possible  her oldest son  william henry is in  OZ  but I waiting  on a death  cert for  here in NZ that may be  him  in 1924, as when  dad  dies  he only   child  that  they dont  know  where   he  is. I know   william was in  Auckland in 1907  as picked  up  by police. Eliza and William DICk are my GGgrand parents, so I will double  check all their  kids  and see if the dad William  stays with  them  till he goes to the  hospital  in 1924  or after but had trouble  with  electoral rolls ie  finding right  rolls in time span.  If   cert that coming  is  wrong  one  then will have to  look for  William Henry in OZ he  born  20 Aug 1876 Christchurch, New Zealand, as  other blokes  by  same  name I have sorted  and not  mine.
Between Vulenza and  william henry  I have  had a   big headache  lol
cheers  kinky d
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Saturday 18 June 22 02:04 BST (UK)
Hi finally got cert  for  william henry booth  and he died 1924 NZ  so if  it vulenza in 1917  going to  sydney, it not to family. I have all the rest  of  this family group except Vulenza, I hoping fresh eyes  may find  her.

cheers kinky d
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Thursday 23 June 22 11:34 BST (UK)
Hi kinky d

Where did you source the details for "Mrs BOOTH - age 66 "   ship Victoria - departing Auckland - 27 Mar 1917 -- arrival port, Sydney ... from ??

shume  ... has also commented on "original shipping manifest listing Mrs BOOTH ... "  ??

The only passenger list I could find for this Victoria voyage (arriving Sydney about 31 March 1917) lists "Mrs BOOTH -- a female passenger" but no age given for any passengers ??  [Source:  ancestry - Unassisted Immigrant Passengers to NSW ]

I only ask because there also appears to be a "Mr A C BOOTH"  amongst the male passengers for this voyage ??

     ~    Lu
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Saturday 25 June 22 00:28 BST (UK)
Hi Lucy   I thought I had the  site in my list    so will find it again
cheers kinky
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Saturday 25 June 22 01:58 BST (UK)
Hi kinky d

Do you also have the printout (or other) copy of death of William BOOTH 1934 ??

     ~  Lu
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Sunday 26 June 22 00:43 BST (UK)
Hi lucy yes he died NZ 1934  in Auckland   Vulenza only one  I have know info on, have her  until 1905/6   then I found passenger list for 1917   no male  on list  just Mrs Booth what I put up  on first post is what I copied just didnt get an image silly me lol

cheers kinky
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Sunday 26 June 22 06:34 BST (UK)
This is the source of the "BOOTH - aged 66 - to Sydney from Auckland - 27 March 1917 - Ship: 'Victoria' "  you copied from  > >   (@  FamilySearch)

https://www.familysearch.org/search/ark:/61903/1:1:KGMJ-RGD

  ... and it does look to be the word "Mrs" entered for that surname - even though it is not included in the transcription.

     ~  Lu

Edited: to add date
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Sunday 26 June 22 07:01 BST (UK)
This is the  > "Mr  BOOTH" on the same voyage -  ship 'Victoria' - from Auckland - bound for Sydney - 27 March 1917.

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-X3FQ-YKF?i=3&cc=1609792

On the other list I mentioned earlier, this man's name was given as  > " A. C.  BOOTH " > :
From these two FamilySearch records it can be seen that >

*     "Mr BOOTH" was aged 23 and was travelling in the Saloon class.

*     "Mrs BOOTH - aged 66 years - was in the Steerage class.

Seems therefore that they were probably unrelated. 

    ~   Lu
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Sunday 26 June 22 07:12 BST (UK)
Just a further update ? on Vulenza Booth.
An Ancestry tree has her husband William Booth admitted to Auckland Charitable Aid Board in 1924 and dying in 1934 ( buried with his parents d 1896) at Linwood cemetery. The funeral arranged by Mrs W Dick who was his daughter Eliza Mary Booth who married William Dick in 1903 at Linwood.
Although you may already have all of this, it does point to either Vulenza leaving him and/or predeceasing him but where? Vulenza is not buried with him.

shume

Kinky d  ... I know you already have this information   ;)

 ....  but just offering a correction to the above (stated as being from an ancestry tree) >   
New Zealand records show that this William BOOTH who died in 1934 is buried at Waikumete Cemetery, Auckland (Auckland was also the place of his death).
[Linwood Cemtery is in Christchurch NZ.]

Record of Waikumete Cemetery, Auckland >

BOOTH - William
Buried 23 October 1934
Catholic - C - Row 20 - Plot 85

NZ Death Index (online)
1934 / 15440 - BOOTH - William - 82 years

    ~  Lu
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: sparrett on Sunday 26 June 22 07:22 BST (UK)
Andrew Cameron BOOTH was a farmer   in Marohemo in 1919.
At the same given address was Catherine BOOTH, a widow.

It looks as if this man did end up in NSW
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/CHP19620102.2.73

So not likely the right sighting for your person.

Sue
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Sunday 26 June 22 07:29 BST (UK)
Eliza  Mary   dick is   my  great nana, I have  hunted  every  cemetery  in NZ  and not found   her but I keep looking  lol just in case.  Lucy   I have no   male booth  b1894   so   must  be  someone elses .
thank you  Shume and Lucy fresh eyes  may crack  it  Vulenza only one of the family missing  now.

Cheers kinky d
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Sunday 26 June 22 07:30 BST (UK)
Thanks for that Sue ... l hadn't yet got around to tracking down "A C BOOTH".   :)

Yes, I would say you've found the correct man ... and we can now eliminate him as having had no connection to "Mrs BOOTH" a steerage passenger on the same voyage.
Good work Sue.

   ~  Lu
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: mckha489 on Sunday 26 June 22 07:43 BST (UK)
Eliza  Mary   dick is   my  great nana, I have  hunted  every  cemetery  in NZ  and not found   her but I keep looking  lol just in case. 

isnít this her?

https://www.aucklandcouncil.govt.nz/cemeteries/Pages/RecordDetails.aspx?recordId=51F900924D71DAB30593E39FCC8ECCC8
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Sunday 26 June 22 07:43 BST (UK)
Thanks for your update kinky d.       

Yes, very aware that it is Vulenza you are looking for ... but just adding in other bits and pieces for clarification as well as for elimination -  which may be helpful for those who are assisting in this search.
There is a lot to work through and not everyone has access to all records and nor do they necessarily have background details of this BOOTH family.

    ~  Lu


   
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Sunday 26 June 22 07:47 BST (UK)

isnít this her?

Mmm ... my thought was that kinky d was referring to "the Vulenza BOOTH" (whose daughter was Eliza DICK).    Perhaps I've got that wrong ???

    ~  Lu
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: mckha489 on Sunday 26 June 22 07:51 BST (UK)
Oh you mean Ďherí referred to Vulenza! Not Eliza Mary who is the subject of the sentence.
You are probably correct. 😀
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Sunday 26 June 22 07:59 BST (UK)
Eliza  Mary   dick is   my  great nana, I have  hunted  every  cemetery  in NZ  and not found   her but I keep looking  lol just in case. Lucy   I have no   male booth  b1894   so   must  be  someone elses .
thank you  Shume and Lucy fresh eyes  may crack  it  Vulenza only one of the family missing  now.

Cheers kinky d

Hi mckha   ... should have added (for clarification  ;)) that last line ... "Vulenza only one of the family now missing".       Perhaps kinky d should have the last say on this ???    ;D
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Sunday 26 June 22 08:24 BST (UK)
Hi kinky d

You said earlier you'd only found Vulenza BOOTH on NZ electoral rolls up to 1905-06.

In fact, she is still shown on a roll in 1908.     At same Masterton address > Queen Street > with husband Wiiliam, grocer ... and son, John Francis, painter.

Even though the details for all, are the same as for 1905-06 Masterton roll, it would seem that alterations / updates, have been made to the 1908 roll, as persons recorded have been allocated new (registration) numbers.     
[ On checking the "Removals from Main Roll - 1908 - Masterton"  ... No. 434 - [ = BOOTH - John Francis - painter ] has been removed.   He appears to have then transferred his registration to the Taumarunui roll and is living at Raetihi with his wife Bridget. ]

   ~  Lu
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Sunday 26 June 22 09:08 BST (UK)
Electoral rolls  - helpful sometimes ... but not always accurate :

Kinky d ... from what you've said previously, William BOOTH (Vulenza's husband) was already in Auckland by 1907   
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/NZH19071125.2.24

And 1908
    https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/NZH19080828.2.102
(later sent to Pakatoa Island )  Earlier offences (as inebriate) before courts in April / May 1908.

No sighting of Vulenza BOOTH  at this time and seems his family weren't in the picture either (according to his comments in court).
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Monday 27 June 22 00:43 BST (UK)
Sorry if I confusing  you all, sometimes what I think to write not what comes out on post, ok so she still in  masterton in 1908  I missed that.  I have no idea why family not in picture while William in Auckland, I have him going into the  hospital in 1924  and  death with Eliza burying him.
 
Been going back   on my tree and only  one of family that  did end up in Australia is  illget  child of John Francis booth  Claude Francis O'HAGAN b 1901  Wellinton NZ  died 11 Jul 1996  NSW.  It a possible  maybe or I  clutching at straws lol as I couldnt find when Claude went to Australia.

I greatful of your patients with  me as I stumble round in my posts to you

kinky d
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Monday 27 June 22 03:24 BST (UK)
Hi kinky d

... thanks for your post with updates ... and for clearing up the confusion.   :)

As I said earlier, the electoral rolls are not always accurate - sometimes people did not notify that they were moving elsewhere in the country ... and some just stopped registering to vote for whatever reason.       And there are those (especially women) who wished to change their identity if they were say, living in a new relationship. 

It may be that Vulenza had moved away from Masterton before 1908 ???    William certainly had, because there's evidence of him being in Auckland from 1907 at least (and he's not in a position then to provide for his wife.)

*   Were any of Vulenza's other children in Auckland from 1905-06 ??    

Eliza DICK and husband are in Taranaki (1911) then Waikato (1919-1922 e/rolls) and by 1925 living in Auckland.

It does not seem from NZ records that Vulenza has died here (NZ)  before that possible sighting on the passenger list in 1917 to Sydney.   So we have to keep on trying to locate her in Australia.

*    As well as Claude O'HAGAN, do you think there could be other grandchildren of Vulenza who could have gone to Australia (even for a short time) ??

Vulenza is aged 66-67 years, in 1917.   That was considered very old in those days.    If she was off to Australia to live, she would undoubtedly need the support of others - friends/family ?
Also, 1917 was during WW1 -- lots of restrictions going on -- who would have paid her expenses, her fare to Sydney etc ??      Seems odd too that she might have been using the surname BOOTH if she was "escaping" New Zealand for any reason ??
I've also tried searching for her using her second given name of "Mary".   (No luck with that so far).

       ~  Lu
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Monday 27 June 22 03:41 BST (UK)
This is Claude F. O'Hagan returning to Australia in 1968 having spent 3 months in UK ??  (Only has travelling from Southampton so not clear exactly where's he's been).

https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/ViewImage.aspx?B=12183203&S=467

He appears firstly on AUS electoral rolls in 1934 at Tully > Herbert > Queensland - Occ.  Farmer.  There until 1941 and in 1943 in New South Wales where he marries.

Death :  11 July 1996 aged 94 - late of Sutherland NSW.  Notices in 'Sydney Morning Herald' 16 July 1996.  wife - Rona Mary O'Hagan died April 1991 :

https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/WDT19051026.2.14
  > custody case of the child, Claude F. O'HAGAN

Edited to add further info.


Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Monday 27 June 22 11:14 BST (UK)
Hi kinky d

Slight progress   ;D  ...  at least this sorts out where Vulenza and William BOOTH were at the beginning of 1905.

Went back over notes for John Francis BOOTH (their son), when you mentioned his illegitimate son, Claude (b. 1901).   Aside from the newspaper article re: custody of this son, placed at one time with JFB's sister Mrs ERICKSON* (correct sp. is ERIKSON*), there was also later mention of his divorce from wife Bridget who'd deserted him and their children. 
[My note :  Did wonder if Vulenza had a part in raising these kids ??   But maybe not.    JFB seems to have married again about a year after divorce.]

Anyway .. there's a marriage printout on an ancestry tree for John Francis BOOTH to Bridget TUOHY -- 28 January 1905 - at the Registry Office, Auckland.   
The witnesses were   >  W.  BOOTH - Auckland -  father of the Bridegroom and Vulenza BOOTH - Auckland.

There could be any reason that William and Vulenza BOOTH were on the e/rolls 1905-06 and 1908 at Masterton ???
Vulenza not to be found on NZ rolls after 1908 and ... William BOOTH does appear (also) on the Auckland > Manukau e/roll in 1908 -- BOOTH - William - Pakatoa Island, labourer :

[ *  "Mrs ERICKSON" = Alice nee BOOTH married Edward ERIKSON - Nov 1900 - Reg. Office, Wellington.  Witnesses - x 2 seemed they might be clerks of Reg. Office staff ??  ]

I am doubtful that Vulenza BOOTH would have gone off to Sydney to be with grandson Claude O'HAGAN.  He was born late in 1901 so was only 16 in mid 1917.   [Seems his mother may have had a marriage while Claude was quite young ?  Have found a woman I think might be his mother,  travelling a bit to and from Australia and other parts, but nothing to confirm. ]

     ~  Lu
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Tuesday 28 June 22 00:05 BST (UK)
Hi Lucy  thank you. I didnt find  bit  with  Alice Erikson nee booth in paper but did find  claudes mum suing for support in 1904. The Dick family  there as my nana Vulenza Elizabeth Dick born    Masteron,she Vulenza granddaughter that could be a reason.  Yes  some of Vulenza kids in Auckland I do know some grndkids born n Auckland.  Vulenza skipped out on first marriage  which was 1871 in Devon she came NZ 1873 and married William Booth  so could have done it again?.

cheers kinkt d
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: Lucy2 on Tuesday 28 June 22 03:24 BST (UK)
I didnt find  bit  with  Alice Erikson nee booth in paper but did find  claudes mum suing for support in 1904.
Hi ... no, she was only named in article as "Mrs ERICKSON";   Spelling was wrong so when correcting it to ERIKSON, I also gave her first name, Alice and brief details of who she had married.

The Dick family  there as my nana Vulenza Elizabeth Dick born    Masteron,she Vulenza granddaughter that could be a reason. 

*     Can you expand on this please because I don't understand what you mean ??   "being a reason " ??


Hi kinky d

Could you answer the questiuon in blue above please  ?

Yes, was aware of Vulenza's first marriage in England.
But thinking of the possibility that she was the lady on the boat going to Sydney in 1917 seems really strange given the circumtances of the times (war) - plus her age - and if she was running off with another man say, or even just abandoning her family in NZ, would she have used the name "BOOTH"  ??   Too many questions  ???  ::)

Really about the only thing that can be done now (having not found her in NZ or AUS), is to branch outwards and look to see what members of her immediate family were doing  - where they were living  etc.     ???    It's a long-haul doing that but often people can be found through their children.

Finding out where she was in January 1905 at son's wedding ... and knowing what husband William was up to in 1907 and 1908, is helpful up to a point.

*    Please explain what the story is with William BOOTH going to hospital in 1924 ??

*   What was he doing between 1908 when he was sent to Pakatoa Island by the court, ... and 1924 when he's admitted to hospital ??

*    And is he released from hospital ... or does he stay there until daughter Eliza buries him in 1934 ??

*    Do you or any fellow researchers, actually have the printout or certificate for death of William BOOTH (1934) ??

    ~   Lu
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Wednesday 29 June 22 02:49 BST (UK)
Ok   when I found the  info on  Claude it was  from  his mum asking for  support , I  never found the   bit you did on  Aunty Alice Erikson having Claude and  maybe   vulenza  and william   in Masterton  for birth of  some of  grandchlidren  is what I meant. John Francis  moves to Auckland and then Eliza Mary Dick. I am   going back   to  electoral rolls  to  try and  trace  William to  1924 as I  not  sure where he was after  the  stay at island

Cheers kinky d
Title: Re: Is This Vulenza BOOTH
Post by: kinky d on Thursday 30 June 22 01:01 BST (UK)
Hi Lucy , I have william in 1925 in the   hospital  and next  time I  know it him is  living with  William Walker DICK and Eliza Mary Dick nee Booth in  1931 151 Balmoral rd Auckland  as a gardener this from electoral  rolls. Not finding how long William was in the hospital or when he went to  daughter Eliza's.

cheers kinky
Got this from a cuz
William Booth 22 Oct 1934, St Joseph's Home,
Ponsonby Auckland. W Little, Undertaker. Born Ireland. Came to NZ over 70 years ago. Aged 82. occupation
Gardener. Cause of Death, renal sclerosis. Seen by Dr C.Murphy 20 Oct 1934. Buried Waikumete 23 October
1934 by J Mansfield, Roman Catholic, officiating minister. Married Christchurch aged 21 yrs to Valenza Welch,
no widow. Surviving children, M 53,48.40 F 55,50
His funeral was arranged by Mrs W. Dick, 151 Balmoral Road on 23 Oct 1934. Cost £21. To be held Tuesday 2pm. Coffin Cheap, Hearse only, Wife entered on Cemetery records as Linda Burns.