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General => Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing => Topic started by: Lisa in California on Thursday 01 September 22 10:36 BST (UK)
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Susannah Vaus was born in 1829 in Albury, Surrey, England. She was my gggrandmother; her parents were born in 1797 in Shipley, Sussex. She had quite a few siblings. Susannah and her husband sailed to Canada c1857.
I am Canadian and live in California, USA. My DNA results are through Ancestry. I have yet to find any matches with any Vaus (Vaux, etc.) descendants from Sussex or Surrey. Nor have I found any matches from Susannah’s mother’s side and none from her grandparents. Note: the other surnames are very common and I have not finished looking at those matches.
I understand that matches result from individuals actually taking DNA tests, but I am wondering which could be more likely, please?
1. There was a whoopsie somewhere along the way and I don’t actually have a true Vaus ancestor. :-[
2. Given the generations between Susannah and me, and possibly other Vaus descendants having not yet taken DNA tests through Ancestry, that could be the reason why I have yet to find DNA matches.
I look forward to reading any comments about my dilemma. Thank you, Lisa
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Looking at the fifteen surnames of my own GGgrandparents (so just four generations back), among my Ancestry matches, only one of those names has passed down to living relatives who have also tested with Ancestry.
So going by that, I don't think it should be assumed that you don't have matches connected with your Vaus ancestors. Also, not everyone has a tree linked to their result, not everyone's tree is complete back to all ancestors born in the late 18thC, and not everyone's tree is accurate.
It might be worth using the search for birthplaces of your matches' ancestors to see if any are connected to Albury or Shipley.
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Thank you, Galium. I have been researching for a friend and a year or two ago I finally found out why his uncommon grandfather’s surname never had any matches — the man was not his biological grandfather.
I couldn't sleep last night and suddenly remembered the above and panicked about the possibility that my Vaus’ weren’t actually mine. ;)
I have searched for just Shipley and Albury and there are at least several matches but I didn’t delve any further to see if my match is through our Shipley/Albury ancestor or if we were related some other way and they just happened to have an unrelated ancestor from that area. (I hope that makes sense.)
Thank you for your comments and suggestion. I realize there could still be a hiccup with my ancestors but I’m not as panicked now.
Either I am experiencing a problem on my end with Anc*try or they have a problem but since last night when checking family trees for matches, I get a “something went wrong” message so at this time I cannot check trees and DNA numbers.
Note: a relative has a very detailed list of Vaus names, dates and relationships from 1797 through 1851. I used this “family bible” style paper when I became interested in genealogy and it almost perfectly matched historical records. The list is the main reason why I care about my Vaus line…an ancestor took the time to record births and deaths and explained how the people were related to each other.
Thank you again, Galium.
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Hi Lisa,
You're correct, the DNA matches are to the persons who did the test & what info. they have in their trees whether correct or not & many can be unreliable in my experience.
I have similar to Galium & very little matches on my maternal side, only one of the surnames in those lines to date.
The trouble is with descendants, they tend to follow their paternal lines initially which leads to many different surnames (via marriages) unattached to our own lines.
I find the biggest problems are lack of trees & of those who have trees, they don't go back far enough.
DNA sites have a habit of fooling people into thinking their family tree will magically appear when they do the test!
We know this isn't the case, hence the lack of trees or like many (as I've found) trees go no further than g/parents i.e. info. they already know which doesn't need further research.
Many people don't know how to 'research' or expect it to be free & give up at the 1st hurdle i.e. certs. which need to be ordered/paid for.
Have you tried the LEEDS METHOD?
https://www.danaleeds.com/dna-color-clustering-the-leeds-method-for-easily-visualizing-matches/
Annie
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Hi Annie, you brought up very good points. I was concerned because I actually have been very lucky finding matches for a number of my ancestral lines, but no apparent Vaus connections — I, possibly unnecessarily, jumped to conclusions. It is comforting to read that I don’t necessarily have a problem.
While I’ve been researching “forever”, I am still a beginner with DNA things and just don’t/can’t absorb the little details. ;)
I’ve not heard about the Leeds Method but will check the link shortly.
Thank you as well, Annie, for your help. RootsChatters are amazing.
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As you know I am also researching the name VAUS but we haven't found a link.
The most distant VAUS relative with a DNA match that I have found was born in 1798. The amount of shared DNA is 7cm. Ancestry no longer shows smaller matches because they are less accurate. How much DNA is passed on to a child by each parent can vary considerably which, over the generations, can give a wide variation in shared DNA.
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Hi Bearkat, it’s good to bump into you again. I think your Vaus’ were from the London area and had something to do with water? If so, it has been a long time since I’ve compared our ancestors. I will compare our families again, perhaps this time I might notice something helpful.
It’s good to read that your match has such a small amount of shared DNA. Good for me, not necessarily good for you. ;D
My most beloved ancestral lines seem to be the ones that are difficult to find.
Thank you for your comments, Bearkat. They, too, are helpful.
I have to run outside for a bit; sorry for dashing off.
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I have found that the London VAUS had links to Lewes, Sussex but possibly only by marriage.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01rt5/
The last two results.
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It is easy to assume the worst when doing DNA testing, hence why it can mean some studying to interpret the results correctly, and you then find you are related, or on occasions you may find you are not related after all.
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I’m back. I inadvertently chose the hottest week of the year to move some garden rocks. I wanted to finish the project today and finish this morning before temps reached 105° (40 Celsius?).
Bearkat, I definitely will have a look around. From what I’ve found, my Vaus folks stayed in and around Shipley (c1715-1820s). No jaunts to Lewes. ;D
coombs, you brought up a good point. While I’ve spent an incredible amount of time checking DNA for some of my ancestors, I really haven’t thoroughly checked my Vaus, Cooper, etc. ancestors. Perhaps if I spend the same amount of time looking for Vaus connections, I might have similar (positive) results, or at least find out that there isn’t a connection. Thank you for making me think about what I have and haven’t done.
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Hi coombs. If you are still here, do you mind if I ask if your Jupp ancestors were from the Shipley area? Perhaps Jupp was a somewhat common name, but I’m almost positive I’ve run into that name before. Perhaps during the very early 1800s or late 1700s?
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Hi coombs. If you are still here, do you mind if I ask if your Jupp ancestors were from the Shipley area? Perhaps Jupp was a somewhat common name, but I’m almost positive I’ve run into that name before. Perhaps during the very early 1800s or late 1700s?
My Jupp family came from Horsham. Timothea Jupp born c1680 to William Jupp.
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I possibly have seen your family then. I looked through my Vaus binder (contains birth, marriage and burial photocopies that were printed at least 20 years ago) after I wrote my question and there were at least two Jupp births on the same pages as my Vaus folks.
I just looked through the binder again and see:
Baptisms
October 4 1778, Eliz., daughter of Charles and Hannah Morgan
November 29 1778, Henry, son of John and Eliz. Jupp
Sarah Morgan, a daughter of Charles and Hannah, married one of my Vaus ancestors. William Vaus (born 1761) lived in Horsham at the time of his death. If John and Eliz. were your ancestors or connected to your family, perhaps our ancestors knew each other and possibly attended the same church.
William Vaus’ father, also named William Vaus, was a church warden at St. Mary the Virgin Church in Shipley. I was told that he and another fellow donated a bell to the church.
It’s been years since I’ve really researched my Vaus’ but I am almost certain that there is a connection to a Jupp person. Maybe I can find it in my binder. On the other hand, I suppose there could have been two or more unrelated Jupp families living in and around Horsham. Especially since your Jupps were in Horsham 100 years before the above records.
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I agree with all previous comments and suggestions. Something else you might like to consider is uploading your raw data to FTDNA, Living DNA and My Heritage. This will broaden your Vaus horizons and may pick up matches who have tested with other companies. Some people find Gedmatch useful as well.
With FTDNA and My Heritage there is a fee involved to unlock their useful tools. I recommend you do this.
Nearly all of my matches come through the female lines, so surnames have changed upon marriage, often through several generations.
I believe Ancestry now split matches into maternal and paternal sides. I haven’t tested with Ancestry so don’t know if this is useful or accurate, but I would normally suggest testing another known Vaus descendant or someone from other family lines, so you can compare matches to eliminate matches from other branches and determine which are from the Vaus line.
It is also worth revisiting matches’ trees periodically. I did this a couple of weeks ago and it led to hitting the biggest gold mine imaginable. ;)
Good luck.
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Hi Ruskie. I actually logged in to Gedmatch earlier today and became frustrated with my lack of knowledge regarding moving around the site.
I will read more of your comments later, hopefully.
We live in drought stricken California. We just found out that a fire started near our town. It is evening here, so aircraft probably won’t be able to help extinguish the flames. I hope to be online again tomorrow.
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That’s very worrying Lisa. Stay safe.
Added: I don’t get along with Gedmatch either but some seem to - they probably have more patience than me.
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Thank you, Ruskie. We moved to the “foothills” a couple of years ago.
Sorry, I’ve been pacing and started to reply to give me something to do while we wait for updates. The fire is spreading a bit so I better stop.
Hopefully, they can contain it tonight.
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Do you have a plan if the fire spreads? People in the path of bushfires here are generally advised to pack up and be ready to leave. :(Timing can be crucial.
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We evacuated last year. We are trying to pack a few things. Mandatory evacs have started. So far, not close to us. One advisory is near us.
We will not stay if it gets close.
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Hope all is OK, Lisa.
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Please pop back when you can and let us know how you are.
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Hi Ruskie and Bearkat; thank you for your concern. We do not yet have a mandatory evacuation so we are still at home and are taking turns napping.
We moved “here” 2 1/2 years ago (a rural area in California). Last year, we evacuated due to a close by fire so several hours ago we already knew what we needed to grab and toss into our vehicle. We have a few little things left to grab should we receive an advisory to leave. So now we are just waiting for any updates.
We were receiving automated phone notifications for evacuation updates but those stopped a few hours ago so hopefully things are looking better.
As I just finished typing the above, we received notification that forward progress has been stopped. Hopefully, the wind doesn’t change again.
Thank you again for thinking of me. I hope to write again later today. Lisa
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Shipley is not far from Horsham but the surname Jupp is actually quite common in Sussex.
I also have Davey, Dinnage, Botting and Bett ancestors from Horsham.
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Shipley is not far from Horsham but the surname Jupp is actually quite common in Sussex.
I also have Davey, Dinnage, Botting and Bett ancestors from Horsham.
Thank you for letting me know, coombs. Mumford is not a common name (in North America, at least), yet the surname used to be common in Essex, England. I think there was some sort of law mandating that Mumford males must be named James. ;D. It’s funny how some surnames were/are regional.
I believe I’ve also seen Botting on my ancestors’ printouts (baptism pages). However, I don’t remember seeing any Davey, Dinnage or Bett surnames. I think I’ve looked at the pages too many times in the past to be able to remember Botting and Jupp. ;)
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Update regarding the fire: we believe the forward movement of the fire is still contained. Evacuation orders and advisories are still in effect.
We don’t know yet if any homes were lost during the night but so far they’ve done a tremendous job which I imagine is extremely difficult to begin with and they also have to contend with the current heat wave in California.
We remain packed and ready to go.
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Thinking of you Lisa & family. Don't forget me as an already known DNA match with you . Came across something interesting today re our matches in common on gedmatch, and I'm not sure if we have discussed this in the past
Reason I've only just seen this thread, I have been very ill with Omicron and complications since end of July , and am just catching up on e mails etc
Message me on my e mail when you are able please and stay safe
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Hi lemur41. Thank you for contacting me. :) I will send an email when I can (tonight? maybe tomorrow?). I will also check gedmatch for our results (I think comparing two tests was fairly straightforward). I’m so sorry to hear about your illness. I hope you are over the worst and feel much better very soon. I am thinking of you and sending positive thoughts.
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Once things settle down here I will resume following up on suggestions, reading the link, checking matches with Bearkat and lemur41, etc. Thank you all again for your suggestions and comments. :)
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One of my parents has very few matches descended from siblings of a gt-grandmother who was born in London in the 1830s (parents from Wiltshire and Sussex), but lots of matches and obvious segments via the Scottish gt-grandfather, her spouse. The Scottish matches trace back to the gt-grandfather's maternal grandfather who was born in 1774 - he was one of about a dozen children.
It's clear that more DNA from the Scottish ancestors on this branch has been passed down than from the Wiltshire/Syssex branch.
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hurworth, your comment is very interesting. I wonder if your DNA “results” might be what has happened with my DNA situation.
According to the latest DNA update, the ethnicity estimate is
32% Scottish, 38% Ireland, 15% England & NW Europe for me
38% Scottish, 29% Ireland, 21% England & NW Europe for my brother
and little bits and pieces equaling 100%.
I know that the estimate covers more than just Scotland, etc., but I have yet to find any Scottish ancestors (one gggmother was born in Belfast, Ireland but I don’t believe my known ancestors lived in the area covered in the Scottish region - that is another thing that I will put on my list of things to check).
Getting to the point, out of my four gggparents, I have several matches with Mumford descendants (Mumford married Vaus) several matches with the other gggfather (Stuart) and at least one match with the other gggmother (Fowley).
I only know for certain that James Stuart was born in Sligo, Ireland, c1815 (Sarah Fowley was born in Sligo, but I don’t know anything about Sarah’s parents). However, we aren’t positive where James’ parents were born. Perhaps more Scottish DNA was passed down, possibly cancelling out a large percentage of the Vaus DNA and over time, the percentage grew even less.
If I correctly read your comment and correctly applied it to my ancestors, the above could be one reason I have not yet found Vaus descendants.
Thank you for explaining your situation. It has really made me think!
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I wasn't thinking of the ethnicity estimates. My parent tested at FamilyTreeDNA and uploaded to MyHeritage, so we are able to actually see the segments that we think were inherited from various ancestors (based on shared segments with known cousins).
My other parent shares no DNA at all with a 3C1R - there's absolutely nothing amiss in either lineage though. The uncle (3C) of the person who doesn't match, is a weak weak. Yet 4th cousins from this line (going back a generation to siblings of the mutual gtgt-grandmother who was born about 1800) share more DNA than the 3C. It's just the way things DNA is passed down. A 5C (descends from the gtgt-grandmother's maternal uncle) popped up on the matchlist recently too.
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Just a quick post to say glad you are safe Lisa, and hopefully conditions will improve there soon.
Will let this thread get back on topic. :)
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I wasn't thinking of the ethnicity estimates. My parent tested at FamilyTreeDNA and uploaded to MyHeritage, so we are able to actually see the segments that we think were inherited from various ancestors (based on shared segments with known cousins)…
Thank you, hurworth for the explanation. After I catch up on things that have been mentioned, I really do need to take time to play with gedmatch and possibly check out other sites.
A few years ago, my sister-in-law and her two sisters had their DNA tested and they received noticeably different results. It is strange how DNA is passed down but I suppose it is similar to siblings having different hair and eye colour and other visual traits.
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Just a quick post to say glad you are safe Lisa, and hopefully conditions will improve there soon.
Will let this thread get back on topic. :)
Thank you, Ruskie. There is still an active fire but evacuation orders have been lifted so that’s a huge relief for everyone. Hopefully, the worldwide fire, flood and excessive heat issues will soon diminish.
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Not sure yet how far back autosomal DNA can take you but the generations multiply the further back you go, so you will have 64 great, great, great, great grandparents. And 132 5xgreat grandparents, so unless the line is the paternal line or maternal line, inheriting DNA from one of your other 132 5xgreat grandparents is a very small chance. Such as a mother,s mothers, mothers, fathers, mothers, mothers, father's father for example.
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Good point and one that I hadn’t considered prior to this week, Coombs, thank you. That could explain why I have not yet found Vaus or the parents, grandparents, etc.
Thanks to all of the comments, I now understand more about how DNA works. In addition to how DNA is inherited, how many descendants have taken tests, etc., I believe there is still a chance to find descendants from this branch. While scrutinizing my “6” generation chart (I typed my own chart in 1993 and still prefer my tattered pieces of papers to an electronic version) :o I realize that I’ve been concentrating (sometimes heavily) on other surnames and DNA matches. I now consider this to be a challenge and will spend time searching for this branch of my tree.
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When I was shown to be a DNA match with Lisa 6 years ago we communicated briefly, but didn't know on which family lines we matched. And we only had a couple of co-shared matches who didn't respond.
We have a few more now, I can see a much wider picture and I think that the match ( 5 generations to MRCA) is going to be along my line with unusual surnames and in my tree will go back to around 1790's- 1800.
Which would hopefully answer Lisa's original query, and confirm a comment made on this thread. I don't have a lot of close family members who have tested, which on Gedmatch up to a 3,000 match comparison shows quite a lot with me @ around 4 or 5 generations to MRCA.
If we do get a response I'm sure one of us will update for you all
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Hi lemur41. Sorry for the delay in writing. Among other things, I’ve been trying to cope with our latest heat wave.
I will try to have a look around now, but no promises as I stumble through the process. ;)
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Lise
Will send you a pm with all the dates/locations I want you to look at. I hope you've managed to crack searching on Gedmatch, but no matter if I give you details with PR's etc, you can have a look
I obviously can't write anything on here re our actual Gedmatches.
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Hi lemur41. I was looking at the tree that you mentioned a day or two ago. I only glanced at it but it doesn’t match up with my information. We can continue this by pm so I don’t clutter up the thread. ;)
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Think we have to try contacting that match and some of the others. I meant to do some of it in April when I contacted you but life happens to all of us, and I think both you and I have had it in spades recently .
Personal Data protection is my thought, I'm sure some people will be following your thread and will not worry about a bit of clutter
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lemur41, I stepped away from looking at the matches and it logged me out. I will resume later as it is 1:30 am.
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Easy to do I sometimes log myself out moving from one set of tool matching to another. I curse everytime I have to go back throught the e mail/password log in
Will be later this pm before I've typed everything up for you and no rush to reply to me
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I've a single DNA match through one very unique surname on my fathers side to a 5th grt grandfather same surname born 1729 and the match in my paternal cousin line same surname to living 6th cousin 12cm.
Very rare I know but proves it is possible.
Simon
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Wow, that’s amazing. I imagine you were thrilled to find the match! Thank you for sharing, Simon.
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Until I began to understand how DNA is past down I was quite nonchalant about it. But now realise the chance was so remote. Yes, it's really blown me away!
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I have a number of DNA matches that tie up with 18th century ancestors including some who appear to be 6C. However, going that far back many matches will not show.
My wife and I are descended from the same individual, born in 1751 but are only a 4cM match according to GedMatch. Her ancestor married an Entecott and she has 6 DNA matches (on Ancestry) to that line who are either 5C or 6C. I also have one match to that line (a 5C) but they do not show as a match to my wife!
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Hi Lisa,
Not going to be much direct help, but if you have been focusing on particular names/lines. you might want to check out the 'ANCESTRAL TREES' tool on the DNA Painter site. You can enter a basic tree, but then start flaging people that you have DNA matches to confirm. the Fan chart then gives you options to visualize which lines you have no matches on so far, or have not focused on so prehaps need to look at :-)
Richard