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Messages - lilith28

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Channel Islands Lookup Requests / Jeanne Mychiell and Ralph Richardson on Jersey Island
« on: Tuesday 01 February 11 19:23 GMT (UK)  »
Seeking information about Jeanne Mychiell, b. 1462- d.1503, Jersey Channel Island  (dau of John Mychiell b. 1440- d.1462, possibly died in Cote d'Or, France) and her husband Ralph Richardson b. 1455- d.1520.  They married on Jersey, rented land, and had three sons on Jersey Island, Thomas, Edmund and Nicholas.  Ralph and John are mentioned in the Armorial.  I'd like to find out more about Jeanne and Ralph and their ancestors/descendants so any help would be greatly appreciated.

2
Glamorganshire / Still more Lloyd enquiries
« on: Wednesday 04 August 10 07:35 BST (UK)  »
It's been a while but I'm still looking for information regarding my Lloyds.  I am interested in tracing an Amos Lloyd, b 1781 in Wales, -m- Hannah Holden Dec. 1837, and d. 1868. Hannah was born 1778 - 1781. 

I believe them to be the parents of Richard Lloyd b. 1815 who -m- Mary Trapp in 1836 and d 1886. They were the parents of Daniel Lloyd  b 1839 who -m- Emma Evans 1860 Cardiff and died 1917 Bristol. They were the parents of David Lloyd b 1872 who -m- Louisa Currier and d 1933. These Lloyds come from the Glamorgan area although David married Louisa in England and settled there.

Any information about Amos and Hannah, especially confirmation they are Richard's parents, and info about their ancestors would be greatly appreciated.

Also does anyone know what railway would be the most likely to have employed them?

3
Sussex / Re: Harbour-Cooper in Sussex
« on: Wednesday 28 July 10 20:44 BST (UK)  »
Ancestry. com...yes I am...

4
Sussex / Re: Harbour-Cooper in Sussex
« on: Wednesday 28 July 10 20:32 BST (UK)  »
It says Certified copy of an entry of marriage given at the General Register Office May 2003.

How does this differ from the one you have seen? Where can I see that one? Online?

It's tricky being 3,000 miles from the source!  :)

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Sussex / Re: Harbour-Cooper in Sussex
« on: Wednesday 28 July 10 19:41 BST (UK)  »
I will try to answer some questions, or perhaps present new ones. Here are my thoughts:

#12 Re: Mary Smith's name. She was born a Smith. When she married Richard Harbour she lists herself as a widow, still using name Smith. Logically she 1) Married a man with same name 2) married a man with different surname but reverted to maiden name after his death or 3) lived with a man she never married at all then passed herself off as a widow to be more socially acceptable (ie had a child, or didn't want to be labeled as a fallen woman)

#28 Scratching through William Frederick H. Cooper's name on the marriage certificate. This isn't on the certificate I have. No name changes at all. The one I have is also witnesses by his sister Amelia HC Peeke and her husband Richard Peeke.

#29 Richard Harbour listed as Richard Harbour Cooper on Amelia Harbour Cooper's certificate, This is the first time I have heard of that being done. I know of no reason he would be listed that way UNLESS the person filling out the information did it because it was Amelia's last name and he thought it must be Richard's as well? Is this online for me to see?

I do know that William Frederick Harbour Cooper's daughter told my mum that he told her he chose to add the name Harbour to his Cooper surname because he liked the name.

I think the Cooper was his Mum's name and though Richard may have been his bio father he may not have been the legal husband of the mother Amelia.  Richard is after all listed as a bachelor on his marriage to Mary Smith. Would he have been required to put divorced if he and Amelia had been? Wouldn't he have put widower if she had died his legal wife?

See? More questions! Thanks to everyone for helping with this.


6
Sussex / Re: Harbour-Cooper in Sussex
« on: Wednesday 28 July 10 00:47 BST (UK)  »
WOW! All I can say is thank you ALL for your interest in my topic and for the effort you're putting into solving these puzzles for me. Here is the info that I can give you from BMD certificates I have in hand:

Richard Harbour, 30, Bachelor, Baker, son of Joseph Harbour, Gardener, Battle, married Mary Smith, 34, Widow, Servant, dau of William Smith, Baker, Battle , Oct. 184? , Parish Church, Battle.

Elizabeth Harbour b 10 May 1848 dau of Richard Harbour and Mary Smith Harbour, Battle.

Emma Harbour, b 4 Aug 1844, dau of Richard Harbour and Mary Smith Harbour, Battle

William Frederick Harbour Cooper, age 25, son of Richard Harbour, baker, married Mary King, 20, dau of George King, labourer,  19 Nov 1865 St Mary Magdalen Bermondsey Surrey.

Birth certificates for: George William Harbour Cooper 5 Jan 1874 Bermondsey;  Rosa Harbour Cooper 12 Sept 1875 Bermondsey; Albert Harbour Cooper 18 Oct 1883; William Frederick Harbour Cooper and Mary (King) Cooper

Birth Certificates for Annie Louisa Harbour Cooper Feb 1872 Bermondsey; Alice Amelia Cooper 5 Nov 1877 Bermondsey; Alfred Arthur  Cooper 13 Feb. 1879 Bermondsey; Frederick William Harbour Cooper and Mary (King) Cooper

As you can see WFHC name was transposed to FWHC on some certificates.

Richard Harbour, age 72, Baker, d 19 June 1885, Battle, Sussex., Mary Harbour Widow present at death.

William Frederick Harbour-Cooper, age 51, Tanner, d. 23 Oct. 1891, Bermondsey. Son of Richard Harbour.

Mary (Smith) Harbour , age 81, widow of master baker Richard Harbour, d. 22 Jan. 1891 Tunbridge Wells with her dau Emma Harbour in attendance.

1881 Census William F. H Harbour Cooper, his wife Mary, and children: Annie, George, Rose, Alice, and Arthur are listed as Harbour. Census left off the Cooper although all the children went by Harbour Cooper or just Cooper.

Possibly Richard Harbour had children by an Amelia Cooper but never married her, thus Amelia Harbour Cooper and William F. Harbour Cooper came about? The Cooper won't have come from Richard because his last two children are Harbour only.  Does this sound logical?

7
Sussex / Re: Harbour-Cooper in Sussex
« on: Tuesday 27 July 10 11:49 BST (UK)  »
Thank you very much for the help. Sorry to be so much trouble, but have been researching online for the past 16 hours and am totally loopy by this point. Can't see straight let alone do the math!

Glad you found Amelia the mother. Cannot understand why young Amelia and William have Cooper as their last name. Rchard's name Harbour is something they choose to add.  Some of William's children used Harbour-Cooper and some did not. Amelia and William's younger siblings by Mary Smith only use the Harbour, so Cooper must have been their mother Amelia's name. Perhaps she and Richard weren't  actually married?

Thanks so much for all your help. I've got a long way to go but this is a good beginning.

8
Sussex / Harbour-Cooper in Sussex
« on: Tuesday 27 July 10 07:55 BST (UK)  »
Joseph Harbour married Emmy Sands in 1799, Lewes, Sussex. Their son Richard Harbour, b 1813, worked as a baker in Battle. In  Oct. 1844 he married Mary Smith, "widow," b. 1810, daughter of William Smith, in Battle. Richard and Mary had two daughters, Emma Harbour (b 1876) and Eliza Harbour(b1878).  There is some mystery about two previous children, Amelia Harbour-Cooper (b. 1863, Lewes) and William Frederick Harbour-Cooper (b. 1866) William and Amelia are either the children of Richard Harbour and a woman named Amelia Cooper, or they are the children of Mary Smith and an unknown Cooper male. who later added the Harbour to their Cooper surname because they liked the name. Either Richard or Mary is the step parent of these two. Does anyone have any information regarding this, particularly something confirmed by birth or marriage certificates? Or can you point me in the right direction to search? Any information about the Harbour, Smith, Cooper or Harbour-Cooper family will be greatly appreciated.

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