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Messages - jones9

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1
Heraldry Crests and Coats of Arms / Finding the arms of Llywelyn Ddu of Cymmer
« on: Saturday 20 August 16 12:58 BST (UK)  »
Dear all,

I realise Welsh heraldry is a rather niche area, though I'm trying to find out what the blazon/arms were of Llywelyn Ddu, Baron of Cymmer-yn-Edeyrnion (various spellings).

In Lewys Dwnn's heraldic visitations (see below, page 125) he says that the arms of Dafydd ap Morgan of Crogen (in Merionethshire) were quarterly those of Owain Brogyntyn (argent, a lion rampant sable), and those of Llywelyn Ddu - but there's no indication as to what these are!

https://dcms.lds.org/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE89727 (page 125)

2
Merionethshire / Re: Dwnn visitations - Trying to find relationship (Branas Uchaf family).
« on: Saturday 20 August 16 12:52 BST (UK)  »
David,

Many thanks for your reply. Yes I have come across these wills - Maurice Jones' son Gabriel Jones married Ellen ffoulkes (John ffoulkes of Cilan's heiress) and that's how Cialn ended up with that family - Catherine and Watkin both died young - Ellen ffoulkes was born around 1630-40.

I think ffoulke Morgan must have been Maurice's maternal uncle, through a sister that is unnamed. The visitations only mention one child (ffoulke Morgan) of Morgan ap Robert's second marriage to Jane ferch Thomas...and I'm sure there must have been another daughter but just can't find anything to prove it!

Nevertheless many thanks for your help!

3
Wales / Re: Help translating this sentence from Welsh...
« on: Saturday 20 August 16 10:56 BST (UK)  »
Thank you both for your replies....interesting thank you!

The extract comes from a welsh pedigree here: https://archive.org/stream/archaeologiacam41assogoog#page/n212/mode/2up (page 162)

Morris Jones was I think the first member of this family to change from the old patronymic system to 'Jones' as a heritable surname.

So I am quite sure Moris ap Sion (or John?) ap Rhydderch was the brother of Morris Jones....but does seem very odd to have had two sons by the same name? Perhaps if they were born 20 years apart, then Morris ap Sion died young and Sion ap Rhydderch had another son called Morris after him? - or would it be possible to have two sons called morris at the same time (I know this is not unheard of though extremely rare! - perhaps if by different wives?)

4
Wales / Re: Help translating this sentence from Welsh...
« on: Saturday 20 August 16 09:29 BST (UK)  »
Thank you that's a great help - grammatically would the 'who died childless' clause refer to Moris ap Sion or Moris Jones?

Also seems odd that two brothers would both be called 'Moris'!!!

5
Wales / Help translating this sentence from Welsh...
« on: Saturday 20 August 16 00:59 BST (UK)  »
Could anyone help me translate the below sentence please?

"Sian a briododd Moris ap Sion ap Rhydderch o Llandrillo yn y Dernion brawd hynaf i Moris Jones ac a fuont feirw heb blant."

Thank you in advance!!

6
Merionethshire / Dwnn visitations - Trying to find relationship (Branas Uchaf family).
« on: Friday 19 August 16 17:34 BST (UK)  »
Dear all,

I have found that in the will of ffoulke Morgan (1636, Cilan, Llandrillo) he refers to 'Maurice Jones' as his nephew and I am having in difficulty in finding out exactly how.

ffoulke Morgan's pedigree is well documented in Dwnn's visitations (vol.2, p. 126) in which he is the son of Morgan ap Robert of Branas Uchaf and his second wife Jane ferch Thomas ab Ieuan ap Robert Chwith. For a visual pedigree of Dwnn's visitations see: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/2:2:3ZDW-981

He is the only son recorded on the visitations and I had wondered perhaps if he had a second John, the father of Morris - though this is not recorded in the pedigree.

The only possibility from the visitations seems his half-sister Anne who married a John David ap John, though it is hard to pin him down.

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks in advance!

7
Armed Forces / Re: 3/4th South Lancashire Regiment (WW1)
« on: Tuesday 12 April 16 17:49 BST (UK)  »
Ady,

Thanks for your reply and this link!

He was born in 1892, so would have been in his 20s during WW1 and was a railway worker which I don't think was a vital occupation. I can't find any medal cards that match up (though several exist for 'W.O. Jones's) unless he was in a different regiment prior to 1918 (unfortunately the only information I have regarding his involvement in ww1 is that he was on the absent voters lists in 1918 as belonging to "3/4th Lancs"

8
Armed Forces / 3/4th South Lancashire Regiment (WW1)
« on: Tuesday 12 April 16 17:26 BST (UK)  »
Dear all,

I learn from the absent voters' lists (1918) that my ancestor, W.O. Jones, was serving in the '3/4th South Lancs.' I do not think any service records survive for him, but am hoping I will be able to find out more about his army career from regimental records, etc.

From what I can gather the 3/4th were based in the UK and only deployed to Ireland as a reserve battalion. Since he was a young man in his mid-20s I would have expected him to be deployed - is it possible he was previously in a regular battalion of the regiment and then transferred to this battalion following an injury perhaps?

Would be grateful if anyone has any suggestions for finding out more about his army service!

Thank you,

Jones9

9
Cymraeg - Welsh Language / Re: Help reading/translating this welsh pedigree in the Welsh Language
« on: Wednesday 18 November 15 20:33 GMT (UK)  »
Roger,

Thank you for this information and I will reply to this properly in the next few days once I have access to my notes at home, however I seem to remember that this David Lloyd is the uncle of the David Lloyd who inherited Hendwr so all part of the same family.

Regarding David Lloyd, I had wondered if he was maybe a nephew(-in law) of John Jones, perhaps if his wife was a Gwen Lloyd - though can't prove this...perhaps a marriage for John Jones and Gwen would prove this.

I have looked through the will of William David alias Jones, and though his wife is an 'Alles'(?), is this definitely the same man as John Jones' son-in-law?

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