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Messages - proberton

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1
Scotland / Re: Looking for my ancestor Christian Robson of clan Gunn (I think!)
« on: Tuesday 11 June 24 05:16 BST (UK)  »
If any one is still searching the topic of this thread, I just found a Familysearch result relating to the marriage of Robertson to Anna Seitsef, daughter of Major Alexant Seitserf on 14 Jan 1851. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-L9SV-5WHY?view=index&personArk=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AQL9Z-LH1D&action=view

I saw the entry and thought I'd report back here in case it was of interest. It includes the original type written entry.

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Berwickshire / Re: Hume of Greenlaw/Greenknowe/Stichill
« on: Tuesday 07 May 24 05:25 BST (UK)  »
Hello PMcK, proberton and others,
I'm new here having joined RootsChat today. Walter Hume (1781-1864), son of Thomas Hume and Janet Coltherd, was my 3rd great-grandfather, so following this discussion with extreme interest. Cheers.

Hi DFH, welcome aboard! I was just about to reply to PMcK when I saw your post. Wondering if you (or you PMcK?) could verify Walter marrying Janet Eddington as per the Clan Home research here https://clanhomefamilytree.com/familygroup.php?familyID=F21090&tree=2 cheers!

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Berwickshire / Re: Hume of Greenlaw/Greenknowe/Stichill
« on: Monday 06 May 24 03:23 BST (UK)  »
Sorry for the late reply.
Just wanted to say thanks again to all of you for having a look at this. If I find anything further, I'll let you know! 🙂

Hi PMcK, I think you originally said your family  came via Walter Hume. Is that Walter son of George and Roda who married Isobel Purvis, or Walter brother of George? Cheers, Paul.

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Berwickshire / Re: Hume of Greenlaw/Greenknowe/Stichill
« on: Thursday 25 April 24 11:59 BST (UK)  »
Tree and record on Ancestry.
Thomas Hume Baptism Date
26 Oct 1748 Baptism Place
Gordon, Berwickshire, Scotland
Father John Hume

Above not on SP, only record there that year but no Thomas there +/- 10 years..
ALEXANDER HUME 15/05/1748 GORDON
Father GEORGE HUME.

I agree I also think the father of George was more likely to be George.

I wonder if below is Janet?

JANET COLTHERD 19/06/1753 GRAITNEY OR GRETNA
Father WALTER COLTHERD

Colin

Hi Again Colin,
This was where I hit a wall. I vaguely remember a couple of Janet Coltherds within a plausible date range. I'm going over some of my old stuff now.
Cheers
Paul
Edit- been back over some of my stuff. I have the ScotlandsPeople extract for the marriage of Thomas Hume and Janet Coltherd. 18 October 1778.

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Berwickshire / Re: Hume of Greenlaw/Greenknowe/Stichill
« on: Thursday 25 April 24 04:44 BST (UK)  »
I had a look at that tree also, Colin. Of note is that none of the children for him were called Thomas or Janet. I can't see anything so far that would connect this George to Scotland with confidence www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/30154681/person/232342610780/facts

This George Hume is listed from at least 1819-1843 here https://londonwiki.co.uk/LondonPubs/Cripplegate/GrapesWhiteCross.shtml showing as Brewer and Victualler at The Grapes, 24 White Cross Street Cripplegate. He must have been in London by 1808 when he married a Sarah Royce. Christenings of two daughters, Mary and Elizabeth, in 1812 listed him as a Victualler.

The 1841 census shows him at White Cross Street with his two sons. Although he died in Reigate, Surrey, his burial was actually in the Parish of St Giles without Cripplegate on 24 October 1844.

Is he the son of Thomas and Janet though?

Monica

Hi Monica,
Thanks for weighing in! As I said to PMcK in my response his post near the top of the thread - it was an educated guess. None of this ultimately demonstrates this George Hume is born in Scotland, son of Thomas and Janet Coltherd. It all fits, but there's no definitive proof my theory was right. George and Sara Royce have a son Walter, potentially perpetuating George's brothers name though. It's still a mystery, but this much is for sure - Genealogy is a team sport! Cheers, Paul.

6
Berwickshire / Re: Hume of Greenlaw/Greenknowe/Stichill
« on: Thursday 25 April 24 04:27 BST (UK)  »
Tree and record on Ancestry.
Thomas Hume Baptism Date
26 Oct 1748 Baptism Place
Gordon, Berwickshire, Scotland
Father John Hume

Above not on SP, only record there that year but no Thomas there +/- 10 years..
ALEXANDER HUME 15/05/1748 GORDON
Father GEORGE HUME.

I agree I also think the father of George was more likely to be George.

I wonder if below is Janet?

JANET COLTHERD 19/06/1753 GRAITNEY OR GRETNA
Father WALTER COLTHERD

Colin

Hi Again Colin,
This was where I hit a wall. I vaguely remember a couple of Janet Coltherds within a plausible date range. I'm going over some of my old stuff now.
Cheers
Paul

7
Berwickshire / Re: Hume of Greenlaw/Greenknowe/Stichill
« on: Thursday 25 April 24 04:24 BST (UK)  »
I guess this is the family, have you traced the parents?

THOMAS HUME/JANET COLTHERD married 18/10/1778 GREENLAW

GEORGE 31/12/1779
WALTER 20/09/1781
WILLIAM 23/03/1783
ALISON 16/03/1786

Colin

Hi Colin, Food get here. I've responded to PMcK's original response more fully, but that's what I found previously.
Cheers,
Paul.

8
Berwickshire / Re: Hume of Greenlaw/Greenknowe/Stichill
« on: Thursday 25 April 24 04:23 BST (UK)  »
Hello,
I realise this is a long shot, but I just discovered your post about the Hume family of Greenlaw. I've been trying to trace the family through Walter Hume, the brother of George. Please could you give me some more information about George? How did you manage to trace him from London to Greenlaw?
I'm also interested to know more about his career in brewing.

Hope that you see this. I realise that your post is almost 9 years old!  :)

Hi PMcK, Between Colin and yourself you've recreated what I eventually found. Linking George to Thomas H and Janet Coltherd was a hunch in the first instance. I'd based it on the account in George Hume's Thirty five years in Russia .  I them looked at the death records and went trawling through Scotland's People. Ultimately I found the siblings that Colin located. I never found any link to the Humes of Marchmont or anything like that. The subsequent research here really does shore up what was mostly a theory. You asked about the brewey side of things- I looked a couple of times but hit a brickwall. I'm rather galvanised by the discussion you've created here. I haven't looked at some of this stuff for ages - I can't even find where I'd located a free online version of 35 Years in Russia. I'll post more once I've done a bit more of a recap. Thanks for bringing it up after all these years!

9
Scotland / Re: Looking for my ancestor Christian Robson of clan Gunn (I think!)
« on: Tuesday 30 May 23 12:49 BST (UK)  »
Roberton is definitely a locative surname, literally the "ton" or "town" of Robert. The etymology very distinct from Robertson. Nesbit in A System of Heraldry Vol II makes the case for Roberton going back to c1220 with charter evidence. Most academics such as GSW Barrow in The Kingdom of the Scots, and others such as  AA Duncan, Lauran Toorians, Richard Oram, and more recently Alex Fleming in Scotland and the Flemish People, 2018 Birlinn Books all cite  Robert the brother of Lambin Fleming as the progenitor the Roberton family. They were Roberton of that Ilk, of Earnock, of Bedlay. Completely separate to Robertson.

As for the Swedish connection, both Nesbit and Stoddart cite Matthew Roberton following the Marquis of Hamilton to Sweden (via Germany I think). They actually cite Robsalm, but I found "af Robsahm" but in either case I agree it's incongruous that the name evolved to an equivalent of Robertson.What piqued my interest was the heraldic reference where the Robsalm arms were described as "a helm on a  field with a plume" topped with an anchor which very much echoes the Roberton arms "quarterly, 1st and 4th gules a close helm argent, 2nd and 3rd Argent a cross crossed fitchee gules" crest, an anchor proper. Robertson were "gules three boars heads or".

That's stating what I know based on the work of others. I'm at a loss as to what happened to the Robertons who left Scotland with the Marquis but if you're interested in collaborating, I'm keen to find out.

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