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Hello group,
I'm hoping someone can help tracing the birth or marriage record of Lydia Jones.
I'm trying to identify the father of Lydia, who is shown in the 1871 census aged 17, single, on board the 'Atlantic' boat in Grindley Brook, Shropshire, listed as niece to it's 74-year old owner John Jones.
John is my 3rd gt grandfather, born around 1796 in Froncysyllte, so, if the census is correct, Lydia's father is probably a younger brother of John. Unfortunately, I've not been able to identify John's birth record or parents, so any siblings remain unresolved so far.

The 1871 census states Lydia is born around 1853 in Llangollen (which often covers Froncysyllte as well in this era). Later censuses show her married to a William Morris and settled in Chester in 1881, her birthplace listed simply as N. Wales, and in Ellesmere 1901 stating birth in Corwen. Their eldest child is shown born circa 1873, suggesting they were married between 1871 and that year, but I've not found a marriage record. I've not traced her in the 1891 census either, or the 1861, which is missing for Froncysyllte.
I've several DNA matches descending from this household, which confirms Lydia's connection to my John Jones, however, the identity of her father is eluding me. I can't find a marriage record for her and William Morris, nor a reliable birth record.

There is a possible birth entry for 1853 Mar qtr Wrexham 11b 327, however, I noticed a 20 Apr 1874 Wrexham marriage of Lydia Jones to Thomas Pierce that could be this individual, listing her as a daughter of Edward Jones, a miner... not much to do with the canals. As the 1871 census states my Lydia's birthplace as 'Llangollen' (which would include Fron, like John) more likely her birth district is Corwen, or an independant chapel birth rather than Wrexham. Also there's a Brymbo 27 Dec 1852 baptism to a John & Ann Jones, but it's a miner's family, and a little early for Lydia's claimed age in 1871. 

Finding her birth record or her marriage document to William Morris would help to identify her father, can anyone help?

There is another theory - that she was in fact the granddaughter of John Jones, not his niece as stated in the 1871. As there's a significant age gap between them (74 and 17) this makes sense, but why would the census state her twice as niece then? Regardless, it still leaves the identity of her father unresolved. John Jones had two sons who could be candidates - John (bapt. 8 Feb 1824 in Cysyllte, Llangollen, boatman with his parents aged 15 in the 1841 census), and Richard (bapt. 4 Oct 1833 in the Glan yr Afon Chapel, Llangollen, and also a boatman with his parents aged 18 in the 1851 in Vron Vian, Cysyllte). Both of these I've traced up to teenage years, but not thereafter.

Some trees on Ancestry have listed Lydia's father as Richard, born 1836 (rather than 1833), but with no documentary evidence.

Very grateful for any help!

Hi everyone, I'm struggling a little with an 1881 census entry for 5 Russell St, Cefn Mawr, Ruabon district. Here we have the household of Daniel Evans:

Daniel Evans (25) Head
Hannah Evans (30) wife
Emily A. Evans    (6) daughter
William Evans    (4) son
Emily Rogers    (51) widow, mother-in-law
Edward Rogers    (14) brother-in-law
Sarah Edwards    (76) widow, grandmother
William H. Lloyd (17) nephew

My connection is the Grandmother Sarah Edwards, also Daniel's nephew William H. Lloyd, who also appears in the 1871 census living in his grandparent's house (Edward & Sarah Edwards, in Sion Cottage, Cysyllte).

I'm finding it hard to confirm the connections though.
The most likely 1871 census for Daniel Evans shows him as the youngest child of Godfrey and Anne Evans, who, according to the census, were born circa 1806 and 1812 respectfully. This makes both of them too old to be the offspring of Sarah Edwards, born circa 1805/06, which seems to rule out Daniels' family as connected to Sarah, so I assume "grandmother" refers to wife Hannah's family.

Hannah's maiden name must be Rogers, judging by the brother-in-law and mother-in-law listed. If Hannah was born circa 1851, I've not found any Emily=Evans marriage that might identify her father, or confirm mother Emily's maiden name, the only 1871 census entry that I found that matches shows a Hannah working as a servant in Pendleton, no indication of parents. Also no sign of an 'Emily Rogers' in the earlier censuses. I did find a possible 1871 entry for Hannah's brother Edward, living with parents Robert & Emma Rogers in Brymbo, but that's a fair distance from the Ruabon area, I'm  not convinced.

All this leaves me wondering how my confirmed ancestor, the 'grandmother' Sarah Edwards, is connected to this family. The only grandparent route left would be Emily Rogers' mother, i.e. Emily was originally Emily Edwards. As Emily was born circa 1830 she would be a suitable age to be Sarah's daughter. Research so far has identified daughters of Sarah and husband Edward Edwards as Harriet (B.1832, I believe married Edward Roberts), Sarah (1838, married Edward Williams) and Ann (1842), but I've not found any records indicating a daughter Emily though. If I could pin down Emily's maiden name it would help to confirm!
 
If Sarah's youngest daughter Ann survived to adulthood, perhaps she was the mother of William H Lloyd, but I've not had any luck tracing his birth, or an Ann Edwards marriage to a Lloyd.

William H Lloyd, 'nephew' of Daniel Evans, was born circa 1863/64 and clearly a grandson of Sarah Edwards in the 1871 and 1881 censuses, but no sign of his parents at all. As the family worked on canal boats perhaps this parents were frequently away, but I've not found any specific likely parents. He's probably the William Lloyd shown in Cefn in 1891 at 26 Mount Pleasant, aged 27 and with wife Elizabeth. He's definitely family, but where does he connect!

If anyone can help to identify Sarah Edwards' connection to the family of Daniel Evans, and/or the identity of William H Lloyds' parentage, I'd be very grateful!

Hi, I'm digging for details to confirm a Jones family of Cysyllte (i.e. Froncysyllte ).

The 1851 Census lists John Jones (Boatman, aged 54), with wife Jane (49), and children Sarah (20), Richard (18), Ellen (14), Ann (14), Mary Ann (10), Margaret (8 ) and Jane (3) - all are listed as born in 'Vron, Llangollen' (i.e. Froncysyllte).

The 1841 Census shows John and Jane, both aged abt 35, with 6 children John (15), Elizabeth (15), Richard (9), Mary (7), Ellen (4) and Ann (2). Also in property appears to be a Rafe(?) Williams (30) and Sarah Jane Williams (12), all born in county.

In the parish register for Glan-Yr-Afon Independent chapel (viewable on Ancestry) of Froncysyllte / Llangollen, there's a baptism for a daughter Elizabeth - "Elizabeth, daughter of John Jones Rocker, in the township of Cysyllte, by Jane his wife, former Williams, was born Feb 1st baptized June 13th 1822 by Wm Williams", this is too old for the Elizabeth in the 1841 census above (though I'm aware the 1841 numbers were rounded up or down), so I'm wondering if she was a child who died in infancy before 1826... or is she a different family (the censuses state John was a boatman, not a rocker- i.e. rockman). 

However the 1841 census with the two Williams lodgers hint that John's wife Jane may have been a Williams before marriage? If so, then the Glan-Yr-Afon record seems feasible for their eldest daughter.

There is another Glan-Yr-Afon baptism record for a Mary Jones "Mary, Daughter of John Jones, Cysyllte (Carrier) by Jane his wife (formerly Williams), was born Sept 14th 1828 and baptized Feb 9th 1829 By Thomas Jones." - this time the father's occupation does match, though again it's too old for the Mary mentioned in the 1841 census, which suggest an 1834 birth for their daughter Mary, so another infant death with later born sibling with the same name perhaps?

The Glan-Yr-Afron records do however have exactly matching entries for son Richard ( "Richard son of John Jones ???try ???ian boatman by Jane his wife (formerly Williams) was born January 2nd 1833 and baptised October 4th 1833. by Thos. Jones").

This leaves me with some conundrums -
1) Were the baptisms of two children with matching name, but incompatible birth dates, all the same family? Were the census birth dates just wrong?
2) If these are the correct family, why does the Glan-Yr-Afon set not have baptisms for their other children John, Elizabeth, Sarah and so on? - I've not traced any of their births.
3) Hints point to Jane's family name may be Williams, (Richard's baptism seems to nail it), but I've not found any records clearly confirming their marriage, or a birth for Jane (or for husband John for that matter!)
4) I've not traced the "Rafe" & Sarah Jane staying with them in 1841, were they family, or just lodgers? Was the Sarah Jane the same as the Sarah listed in 1851?

Any thoughts, help with these greatly received!

Hello forum! I've a look-up request to confirm details of Catherine Toms of Blockley. First, for the marriage of William Haynes (or Haines) and Catherine Toms, 24th July 1786 in Blockley. FindMyPast had a reference to it as a marriage to William Harris, I'd like to clarify the details.

Assuming the marriage is correct, I've a tricky problem identifying Catherine Tom's birth too. A transcript list of Blockley parish records posted online shows two Catherine Toms births in the Blockley records:

20th April 1764, to John & Mary Toms
3rd January 1768, to John & Elizabeth Toms.

There is one burial mentioned:
"TOMS, Catherine, Female, no details who died of SMALL POX", Aston Magna 21 Aug 1779. 

So which of the two births does this child death correspond to? Baptism/burial notes of other siblings indicate John & Mary Toms (nee Jobson) lived in Aston Magna, though John & Elizabeth may have lived there too. In fact it could be the same John who remarried an Elizabeth after the death of Mary, though I've not found a record either for her death or a re-marriage.

I don't have access to the actual records, just a list on here: http://www.allthecotswolds1.com/ , so any help greatly appreciated!

If Catherine Toms in fact didn't marry William Haynes, I need to find out who did! Baptisms of his children state Catherine as their mother's name.

Many thanks!

Looking through parish records I'm really curious about what seem to be a series of untimely deaths in Kencot. My research indicates William Shayler of Langford (born 1741/2) married Sarah Dyer of Kencot on 15th October 1774. The couple had four children, all of which died in infancy except the last - Ann Shayler (born & died 1775), Sarah Shayler (born 1776, died the following year 1777), Richard Shayler (born & died 1778), and William (born 1781, who thankfully survived until 1865). Infant mortality isn't unusual, but the curious thing is that mother Sarah seems to have died in 1782, the year after William's birth, and her husband in 1783, being buried on 23rd March that year.

Now, I could be making the wrong assumptions, but if this is correct baby William's entire family died in a 7 year period, leaving him a 2-year old orphan. I know he stayed in the area, as his two sons were later born in Langford, but who would have raised the child in the 1780's? I've not traced any other Shayler's in Langford at that time.

I'm wondering if there might simply be gaps in the parish records and that the birth-death connections I'm assuming may be wrong. Does anyone know of any particular cause for so many deaths in the area at that time?