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Messages - janfurness

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Surrey / Re: Sophia Holford born about 1822 in Addlestone or Chertsey- help please.
« on: Wednesday 11 November 20 13:27 GMT (UK)  »
Our suspicions are confirmed! It would explain why none of John and Sophia's sons were named James after John's father.

I checked the GRO records for Rosina, which gave her mother's surname as Rolfe, which confirms your earlier findings. It really is a remarkable error on a marriage record. The names don't sound alike in the slightest. Perhaps Sophia sneezed as she gave her surname!

On the subject of Robert Rolfe- he gave his birthplace as "Thorpe, Berkshire" on the 1851 census. There isn't a Thorpe in Berkshire. The most likely place was Thorpe, near Egham, Surrey, 2 miles from Addlestone near Chertsey where Sophia was born.
Free Reg has the following baptism:
15 Aug 1784 Egham,Surrey,England

15 Aug 1784 Person forename Robert Person sex M Father forename Robert Mother forename Ann Father surname ROLPH Mother surname ROLPH Notes Born 6 Aug.

In 1783 in Egham, Robert Rolf married Ann Tarant.

As I mentioned before there are other Rolf/e records in Chertsey and Egham, so it seems likely that was where Robert Rolfe was born and where he lived until Sophia's birth in 1822.

Thank you all for your replies.
I suppose he was so specific because worked for a firm that just made the serving trays rather than other silverware.
They look beautiful items in the link you posted Mike.
Problem solved! :) Jan

Norfolk / Re: Norfolk ... coal miners?!
« on: Monday 19 October 20 16:34 BST (UK)  »
Hi BugBear,
It seems to have been fairly common for farm labourers to have made the move north for work during the C19th, and it was probably resonably easy for families from East Anglia to travel up the coast.
There are several posts on this topic which may interest you.

And then I found some of my own ancestors had moved North East from Norfolk,so I started a couple of posts:

I hope the links work!

My ancestor, Benjamin Meadows, lived in Birmingham and married in 1770. On the record of banns for St Martin's church, his occupation is clearly written as  "Waiter Maker."
It seems very specific but gives no indication of what his trade might have been.
I wondered whether he could have been a silversmith making serving dishes, or a cabinet maker making serving stands.
I wonder whether anyone has heard of a waiter maker and has any idea of what his trade was?

I've finally found the famliy in 1851-Ancestry had mistrancribed the surname as Robbe. I checked the original online, it's unclear and Robert's place of birth is hard to read-it could be Bucks or Berks. Ancestry has Thorpe Berks. (Thorpe in Surrey is near Chertsey which would be lovely!)
If James was the son of a brother of Sophia, wouldn't he be described as nephew, not lodger in 1871?
Whereas she may not have owned her relationship to her illegitimate son. A birth certificate for James seems the way forward.

Still no luck with Sophia, but I've been delving further into the Rolfes. I haven't found the 1851 census record yet, and Robert died in Windsor in the second quarter of 1857, but I have found James and Ann. James's birth was recorded in the first quarter of 1841 in Windsor-James Robert Rolfe. In 1861 he is on a census in Clewer with Ann. They are living in the household of James and Sarah Godliman, aged 44 and 42, andtheir children. Confusingly their relationship to James the head of the household is described as daughter and grandson! I haven't found any relationship between Ann and the Godlimans.
Ann died in Windsor in 1870 and in 1871 James was living as a lodger in the household of the widowed Sophia Morton! Another link. :)
I do wonder whether James was Sophia's son rather than Ann's. Her dob on her death record was 1786, making her 55 when James was born.

Surrey / Re: Sophia Holford born about 1822 in Addlestone or Chertsey- help please.
« on: Wednesday 29 July 20 15:32 BST (UK)  »
Hello Paul, Nice to "meet" a distant cousin! I'm sorry I didn't see this before.
I think the family in 1841,with Robert, a cattle dealer, daughter Sophia and son Thomas, all near Windsor seem likely candidates for being Sophia's family and the surname Holford being written in error instead of Rolfe.
I've sent you a PM but I've just found another piece of circumstantial evidence.
I was looking at Robert Rolfes on ancestry and found a marriage record in Chertsey, Surrey for a marriage record in 1845 for Benjamin Rolfe, a soldier, father Robert Rolfe. (it's rather spoiled by this Robert being a labourer but it's possibly another error or a change of occupation.)
Sophia always gave her place of birth as Chertsey or nearby Addlestone. I can only find Chertsey baptisms for Benjamin in 1820 and Eliza Rolfe in 1822, parents Robert and Mary Rolfe. There are other Rolfe records in Chertsey so It's definitely a Chertsey surname.

Hello again, I wondered whether Ann White was the maiden name of John Dale's mother. Information from the muster books of H M Brig Martial in 1823 give his birth as about 1796 in Middlesex, England. There are a number of possible candidates, but I haven't been able to find any definite baptismal record for him, so I don't know the names of his parents. They seem to have used names from Mary's family, so perhaps some of the other names come from John's. They seemed to like the name Ann, their youngest daughter born 24 years after Ann White was called Anne Maria!

Hello Hope,
Nice to hear from you. My great great grandmother was Mary and Robert's eldest daughter, Ann White Dale. So we share Mary and Robert as our 3x great grandparents. I'm not sure what that makes us- 3rd or 4th cousins perhaps?
Best wishes, Jan

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