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Messages - Tracey Asteroid

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Australia / Re: German families immigrating to Australia late 1800s/ early 1900s
« on: Saturday 09 July 16 11:28 BST (UK)  »
Well, it certainly seems that the "story" of Friedrich and Adeline immigrating to Australia in 1913 and leaving oldest daughter Mariechen in Germany was WRONG.  ;D

The National Archives has scanned in the naturalization records of Friedrich Heinrich SCHROEDER here:
And it appears that he immigrated to Australia in 1907 (the year before Mariechen was born) on the Bremen, arriving in Melbourne on 18 November. In the application (filled out in July 1914) he declares that he is living with his wife and only child, a daughter, and has been in Australia for 6 years and 7 months.

I don't know if Mariechen was born in Australia or Germany, and I do not know if Friedrich and Adeline married in Germany or in South Australia in 1913, but I DO know how he got here, and THAT MAKES ME HAPPY :)


Australia / Re: Two Charles COE/Elizabeth families in NSW from 1850's
« on: Wednesday 08 June 16 12:59 BST (UK)  »
Tangled up has to be a giant under statement.

I am sure it was Elizabeth MCGUINESS, widow of Richard PEARCE, who arrived on the "Friendship" with her mother and older brother. Elizabeth was signed into the Orphan Home not long after arriving, but was released into her brother's care as a teenager. She met PEARCE and had four children before he passed. I have been told that Richard's will prevented Elizabeth from ever re-marrying, so Elizabeth and Charles COE did not get married.
Elizabeth and Charles lived in Binda (near Crookwell) on the sheep station owned by her brother Thomas, at least until Thomas passed away. Family lore then says that Charles stayed in the Goulburn area, while Elizabeth and all the children joined a caravan of families moving from Victoria to the North West of NSW, eventually settling in Coonamble.
It is a great story, but I don't know how accurate any of it is, and how to find supporting information.

The PEARCE descendant I have been talking to, is related to the last of the PEARCE girls born, Mary Ann, who traveled with her mother before becoming a midwife, marrying, and staying in the Goulburn area after Elizabeth and the younger children moved on. She was passed down photos of the family in Coonamble, so that suggests a link at least.

I am going to put this on the back burner for a bit. I need to figure out what certificates I need copies of and get them ordered. That will be the clearest way to link all the kids with the same parents I think.

thanks for your help!

Europe / Re: Prussia, Ferdinand LE JUGE and Louisa MACHLINBURG
« on: Tuesday 07 June 16 12:38 BST (UK)  »
I love trove, on occasion! I find it hit and miss with how I choose to spell things. I will try again though now that I know there is something in there. Thank you Donna.

State records has uploaded the pdf:

It was not a standard form applying for naturalization, but a letter to the  Governor of Victoria (Sir Henry Barkly?) asking for naturalization under the act of council "Victoria 39".
The letter notes that he was 28 years of age, and a quartz miner. He arrived in the Colony of Victoria on the ship 'Gem of The Ocean' in 1854, and plans to settle for life in Australia. The letter is dated 7 June 1861 ( and I am reading it EXACTLY 155 years later) which makes his estimated date of birth 1833

:D I have the stupidest grin right now. How COOL IS THIS?!?!?!?!

Onto the wedding certificate:
Arrrgh! There is a stamp on it saying 'best quality image/damaged document'. I can't even read the names properly :(
Here is my best guess, and I might use the 'help with reading documents' forum at some point.
Date 11 August 1862 in the House of Andrew Ross Hungas......... (that is a really long name with unreadable letters)
Names unreadable, though I know what they are suppose to say and they sort of look like that.
Condition Bachelor and Spinster (yeah, THAT part was written clearly!)
Birth place Moningsberg/Houngsberg (???) Prussia and Hobart Town
Rank Miner (nothing for Elizabeth)
Age 29 and 19 (this matches for Ferdinand, but I suspect Elizabeth lied. Her birth record is in a list of births from 1845, so she would have been 17 in 1862.
Residence Present Queenstown and Queenstown
Residence Usual Milfrozen (??) and Queenstown
(So I am going to guess that they met on the goldfields here This is also supported by the fact that Elizabeth's younger brother Thomas died at these gold fields in 1860. I have written about the Skinner family previously, here: )
Parents and occupation...
Ferdinand Le Juge, custom officer
Louisa, nee, Machlingburg (or Mich-fiss-brug according to what I can see)
Thomas Skinner, miner
Harriet, nee, Hutchisen
In the presence of Joseph Freitag (not sure about that "i") and Charlotte Ness
By David Boyd, Minister of the Presbyterian Church, according to the rites and ceremonies of the Church of Scotland/Factland (why do running writing letters look the same??)
And a note written on the bottom of the certificate: The father of the bride gives his written consent.

Since I know now how Ferdinand arrived in Australia, which was the information I was after, I will cease this search for now. If I get a chance later, I may reopen the search by applying for Ferdinand's death certificate from NSW BDM.

Thanks for all the help  :D

Australia / Re: Two Charles COE/Elizabeth families in NSW from 1850's
« on: Monday 06 June 16 05:23 BST (UK)  »
Absolutely. Marriage certificates are the key!

Australia / Re: Two Charles COE/Elizabeth families in NSW from 1850's
« on: Monday 06 June 16 04:23 BST (UK)  »
Together they had at least seven children (listed on this blog )
Jane COE (1844-1932) married Thomas EVANS
Charles COE (1847-1928) no spouse
Sophia COE (1848-1897) married John EVANS (brother of Jane's husband) then Elijah OSBORNE
Thomas COE (1851-1933) no spouse
Elizabeth COE (1856-1946) married John COVENTRY
George COE (1861 twin -1938) no spouse
Rachael COE (1861 twin -1935) no spouse

Rachel/Rachael died in 1935 and was buried at the Botany Cemetery with her husband Thomas BOWMAN.  The burial record gives her age as 76 and this may be her birth:


There is no consecutive registration number for another child that might be a twin.

Debra  :)

Thanks Debra,
I was about to give up on the twin theory. The only George COE I can find born in that decade was George COE died 1838 in Tamworth (reg#19939). His head stone puts his age at 84 so an estimated birth year of 1854.... but no birth details so can not check parent names or place of birth (yet).

I have found NOTHING on Rachael COE. But if her name was mis-spelt, that would explain a lot.

I am in contact with a lady that is a descent of one of the PEARCE daughters, who has a copy of Elizabeth COE (nee PEARCE, nee MCGUINNESS) death certificate. If she is kind enough to share a copy with me, then I can sort of confirm which children she had that the death informant knew of.

In the mean time, I need to start saving up pennies to buy all these birth/death certificates.

Thanks for the info about the baptism records Majm.


Australia / Re: Two Charles COE/Elizabeth families in NSW from 1850's
« on: Monday 06 June 16 01:11 BST (UK)  »
Thanks Neill.

So far I have been working with the theory that Jane had the name PEARCE on her birth certificate, since that was the married name her mother was still using.

There was a birth in 1844 for Jane PEARCE (father unknown) reg # 1788/1844 V18441788 28
I suppose it is actually possible that Charles was not her father, if this even is the right Jane.

I have found nothing for Sophia's birth, though a Sophia COE definitely lived and died. Her marriage to John EVANS in Dubbo in 1869 has her named as Sophia COE. Her second marriage to Elijah OSBORNE in Coonamble in 1890 has her listed as Sophia EVANS. Her death certificate lists her as Sophia OSBORNE in Coonamble in 1897, parents Elizabeth and Charles...which only means that the person reporting her death knew Sophia's parents as Elizabeth and Charles.

Australia / Re: NSW Birth Lookup please
« on: Monday 06 June 16 00:54 BST (UK)  »
I only saw three:
Annie born 1883 reg# 16195 in Liverpool
Frederick born 1885 reg#11465 in Waterloo
Helena born 1887 reg#7317 in St Peters


Australia / Re: Two Charles COE/Elizabeth families in NSW from 1850's
« on: Sunday 05 June 16 13:02 BST (UK)  »
My question is, of course, who belongs to who and where?
I think I need to do two separate family trees!

Australia / Two Charles COE/Elizabeth families in NSW from 1850's
« on: Sunday 05 June 16 12:59 BST (UK)  »
I'll start with the easy sentence: My husband's ggg grandparents are Sophia COE and John EVANS.

This is what I "think" I know right now:
Charles COE (b.1803) was married (no date) to Hannah GRIFFIN (b.1791) in England. They had a daughter Hannah Henrietta COE in 1829. In 1829 Charles was convicted of larceny and sentenced to life. He was transported to Australia arriving in 1830 on the "Katherine Stewart Foster".
A publicly available family tree lists Charles' parents as John COE (1773-1837) and Mary PARSONS (1772-1862) though I have no corroborating evidence for this. (A post on Roots Web suggests his parents were Charles and Jane).

Now Elizabeth STANLEY (b.1777) was married (no date) to Daniel MCGUINNESS (1781-1817), and convicted and transported in 1817 two months after Daniel's death. She arrived in Australia on the "Friendship" in 1818, with her son Thomas MCGUINNESS (b. 1810) and daughter Elizabeth MCGUINNESS (b. 1813).

Elizabeth MCGUINESS (nee STANLEY) died in 1832 in Sydney. Her daughter Elizabeth MCGUINESS married Richard PEARCE the same year. Elizabeth and Richard had 4 or 5 children
Four listed in this blog:
Elizabeth PEARCE (1832-1849)
Richard PERACE (1834-1886)
Mary Ann PEARCE (1836-1914)
Robert PEARCE (1838-1841)
A fifth child mentioned here:
Isabell PEARCE (1833-unknown)

It has been suggested that the death of her husband Richard PEARCE in 1839, quickly followed by the death of her youngest child in 1941, led Elizabeth PEARCE (nee MCGUINESS) to flee Sydney.
Around this same time, Charles COE was being released from Bathurst Goal (more info about his ups and downs from )
and somehow the two met and became involved around 1843/44 in Berrima NSW.

Together they had at least seven children (listed on this blog )
Jane COE (1844-1932) married Thomas EVANS
Charles COE (1847-1928) no spouse
Sophia COE (1848-1897) married John EVANS (brother of Jane's husband) then Elijah OSBORNE
Thomas COE (1851-1933) no spouse
Elizabeth COE (1856-1946) married John COVENTRY
George COE (1861 twin -1938) no spouse
Rachael COE (1861 twin -1935) no spouse

But a post on Roots Web ( lists:
Jane COE (1844-1932) married Thomas EVANS
Charles COE (1847-1928) married Elizabeth PARKER (nee HAMBLIN)
Sophia COE (1848-1897) married John EVANS (brother of Jane's husband) then Elijah OSBORNE
Thomas COE (1851-1933) married Sissy DARGAN
George COE (1854-unknown) married Eliza COOPER
Elizabeth COE (1856-1946) married John COVENTRY
No Twin
Rachael COE (1861 -1935) married Thomas BOWMAN

To confuse the issue, there was apparently another Charles COE/Elizabeth couple having children around this same time (from this post:
Eliza A COE b. 1854 Bourke
Clara COE b. 1855 Gulgong
Terese COE b.1856 Mudgee
William J COE b.1857 Mudgee
Robert David COE b.1859 Mudgee
Elizabeth COE b. 1860 Bathurst
Frederick COE b. 1863 Bathurst
Clara COE b. 1864 Bathurst

Which may (or may not) match up with this family ( as the offspring of Charles COE ( and Elizabeth PHILLIPS:
Charles COE (1853-1928) married Elizabeth PARKER
Clara COE (1855-1856)
Theressa COE (1856-1846) no spouse
William COE (1857-1887)
Robert COE (1858-unknown)
Elizabeth COE (1861-1946) married James SOORLY then Nicholas BUGDEN
Frederick COE (1862-1863)
Clara COE (1864-1864)
Hannah COE (1865-1865)

To confuse things more, it appears that both Charles COE’s died in the Goulburn area, and both Charles COE’s left a wife and one child behind in England, so they did not marry their Australian partners.

I am too tired to try and figure this out right now, but hopefully if we keep picking at it, the truth will become clearer.
Sorry for making you read all that.

I have mentioned the EVANS family before here:

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