Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.


Messages - Framesmiths1816

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 ... 91
1
Census Lookup and Resource Requests / Re: Looking for origin Country for Peter Lunn (Lun, Lund, Luhn, Lunne) and wife.
« on: Saturday 15 January 22 13:45 GMT (UK)  »
Please could I have opinions on the surname of this Marriage Witness?  At first glance I thought it was Thomas but I do not think that is correct. She could be a relation of the grooms mother if my hunch is correct.

https://we.tl/t-hy1RX6jmOR

I am not sure on how attachments work here these days so I have made a download link for a jpg file for a the relevant section of the image.

2
Census Lookup and Resource Requests / Re: Looking for origin Country for Peter Lunn (Lun, Lund, Luhn, Lunne) and wife.
« on: Wednesday 05 January 22 20:58 GMT (UK)  »
Parish Register entry is for Thomas (George) Lunberry 12th April 1846 St Mary Magdalene Bermondsey to Ann Quick - Father Peter Nelson Lunberry.

3
Census Lookup and Resource Requests / Re: Looking for origin Country for Peter Lunn (Lun, Lund, Luhn, Lunne) and wife.
« on: Wednesday 05 January 22 16:23 GMT (UK)  »
Quote
Where does the Nilsen come from?  Perhaps I missed it somewhere in this thread

Sorry Bearkat, I did not say where Nilsen came from. Reading the link on the first reply that explains how  Norwegian names are made up, they are not hereditary until 1926. So there is a given name Peter, Petter, Peder or Per for example, a patronymic name in the form of father's given name with "sen" added or in the case of girls with "datter" added and a third part is a location which is changeable depending on where the person might consider home to be and could change in their life.  Lunn, Lund, Lunberg, Lundberg are such types of location name which might account for why Peter is flexible with it. The only hint of his patronymic name is on one of the wedding certificates of one of his children after his death. He gives his father's names as Peter Nelson Lunnberry. Of course the historic figure of Nelson is widely known after 1805 and it could be possible for someone to hear the names Nilsen or Neilsen perhaps and think they have heard the name Nelson. its a hunch based on this one reference and how Norwegian names should be structured.

Regards
Mark

4
Census Lookup and Resource Requests / Re: Looking for origin Country for Peter Lunn (Lun, Lund, Luhn, Lunne) and wife.
« on: Tuesday 04 January 22 20:03 GMT (UK)  »
Quote from: Mabel Bagshawe on Tuesday 04 January 22 19:53 GMT (UK)
here's one to add to the list

Maria Lunnbury
William Horwood
Marriage    9 Feb 1835    St Leonard, Shoreditch

Sadly it's a short record with no parents names. Eleanor was one of the witnesses. Both girls made their mark, so probably wouldn;t know if ther name was recorded properly

Thank you Mabel,

I had been looking for that marriage without success today.

Every bit of info helps.

Regards
Mark

5
Census Lookup and Resource Requests / Re: Looking for origin Country for Peter Lunn (Lun, Lund, Luhn, Lunne) and wife.
« on: Tuesday 04 January 22 19:47 GMT (UK)  »
Quote from: bearkat on Tuesday 04 January 22 08:17 GMT (UK)
A great summary.

If their names has been more common than Peter & Lydia you wouldn't have got this far.

If Peter was Norwegian and had a strong accent he may have been difficult to understand.

Have you tried looking for Peter's baptism either in UK or Europe?

Hi Bearkat,

Yes you are correct, without those names it would have been much harder. I have also found some additional information in the last 24 hours which enable an educated guess at his name.

I am playing a hunch that it is some variation of Peter Nilsen Lundberg.

Peter might be Peter, Peder, Petter or Per
Nilsen might be Nilsen or Neilson
Lundberg could be Lunnberg, Lunberg, Lundberg

Born around 1769 to 1774 . I am starting search Norwegian records but as I only speak / read a very little Norwegian it is slow going.

Regards
Mark

6
Census Lookup and Resource Requests / Re: Looking for origin Country for Peter Lunn (Lun, Lund, Luhn, Lunne) and wife.
« on: Monday 03 January 22 23:10 GMT (UK)  »
I spoke with a Norwegian friend who speaks Norwegian, Swedish and Danish He thinks that the most likely Norwegian version of Lunnberry might be Lunberg. The G is silent and "berg" is pronounced as "bear". Lunn in Norwegian is more likely to sound like Lune or Loon to an English person with the N sound like Neh so also together something like Lune-nah-bear. When looking at the Lewin Bell possibility there is a Swedish name Lunbell and a Norwegian name Loewenberg. There is also Lundeberg for the one spelling of Lund.

I am starting to think that the Peter Lewin Bell / Lydia Cheeseman marriage has a connection. The birth of son Peter Cheeseman in 1800 ties with the death of Peter Lun in 1805. Maybe they gave the name as Cheeseman at the baptism because father Peter, being a Mariner, wasn't present. From the 1861 census Lydia Lunnberry seems to come from Frimley even though on the 1841 census it says Foreign parts.

The other possibility I am entertaining is that Peter Lewin Bell maybe hiding his identity. It is possible he might be a returned transported convict. A crime that carried capital punishment.

The time line looks like this so far

1798 Marriage Peter Lewin Bell to Lydia Cheeseman St Marys Rotherhithe
1800 Birth Peter Cheeseman St Marys Rotherhither
1802 Birth Maria Lunn St Peters Frimley
1805 Death Peter Lun St Marys Rotherhithe
1806 Birth William James Lund St Marys Rotherhithe
1809 Maria (Maybe same Maria as 1802 - 1851 census lists her as born in Trimley)
1809 Birth of James Thomas Lunn St Marys Rotherhithe
1813 Birth of Thomas George Lunn St Marys Rotherhithe
1817 Birth of Ellen Lunnbury (Baptised 1825 St Marys Rotherhithe) 1st known use of Lunnbury/Lunnberry
1841 Census family name given as Lunn
1843 James Thomas marries in Deptford surname given as Lunn
1843 Eleanor Lunnbury marries at St James Bermondsey (Father Peter Lunnbury, witnesses sister Maria (Horwood) brother Thomas Lunnbury)
1843 Peter Lunn father dies aged 75 St Marys Rotherhithe
1851 Census Lydia gives names as Lunnberry
1856 Lydia Lunnbury mother dies

I descend from James Thomas and the surname Lunn comes down that line into current usage. Neither Peter or Lydia could write so I am guessing some variation in surname spelling is understandable but a complete change from Lewin Bell to Lun, Lund, Lunn, Lunnbury and Lunnberry is a big surprise.

If anyone one has any other ideas as to why this might have happened then I would like to hear them.

Regards
Mark

7
Census Lookup and Resource Requests / Re: Looking for origin Country for Peter Lunn (Lun, Lund, Luhn, Lunne) and wife.
« on: Sunday 02 January 22 23:48 GMT (UK)  »
Quote from: wivenhoe on Sunday 02 January 22 22:13 GMT (UK)

"On 2 other records Peter's occupation is given as "Mariner".

Can you please identify these records.

Hi,

One entry is on the 1805 death record of 5 year old Peter Lun St Marys Rotherhithe where it gives the father as Peter Lun Mariner. The second is on the 1843 marriage record of son James Lunn to Elizabeth Nicholls Deptford.

Peter and Lydia are my 5th Great Grandparents.

Regards
Mark

8
Census Lookup and Resource Requests / Re: Looking for origin Country for Peter Lunn (Lun, Lund, Luhn, Lunne) and wife.
« on: Sunday 02 January 22 21:43 GMT (UK)  »
Hi everyone,

I have found what appears to be the same family group still living in Neptune Court in the 1851 census. There is definitely something odd going on with the surname.

In 1851 Lydia Lunn is now Lydia Lunnbury aged 70 and born in Trimley ??
The daughter Maria is widowed and has the surname Harwood and is also from Trimley Surrey ??
The Daughter Ellen is now called Eleanor and is married to Thomas Simpson. There is a matching St Marys Baptism 16 Jan 1825 born 17 June 1817 Rotherhithe surname Lunnberry parents Peter and Lydia Lunn-Berry (Mariner)
A grand daughter Mary Ann Lunnbury aged 3 is also listed but I do not know her parents connection yet.

This leaves me wondering the following points.
1. Does Trimley = Frimley ?
2. Does the Peter Lewin Bell marriage match? Lewin-Bell could it be a version of Lunn-Bury/Berry?

Any thoughts?

Regards
Mark

9
Census Lookup and Resource Requests / Re: Looking for origin Country for Peter Lunn (Lun, Lund, Luhn, Lunne) and wife.
« on: Friday 31 December 21 17:56 GMT (UK)  »
Hi everyone,

I am not sure what to make of the Peter Lewin Bell / Lydia Cheeseman references. It maybe that the surname under went spelling changes at this time (c1800). Digging around in the St Mary's Rotherhithe registers I have found a 1770 baptism for a Peter Lawn or Lown (F Peter, M Susanna) plus a 1768 baptism for Sarah Elizabeth Lowne (Lonne) to the same parents. There is also 1766 marriage between Peter Lawn and Susanna Clements. Could the name have morphed from something like Lawn, Lown, Lonne, Lownde to Lun, Lund, Lunn? I still have the puzzle of the 1841 census though that seems to indicate neither Peter or Lydia were from the County and were of "Foreign Parts". The Lewin names turns up a number of people in Newgate for Transportation which could give a reason to want to change a surname perhaps if linked with some bad publicity.
I am going to have to spend sometime thinking about the possibilities.

Thanks
Mark

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 ... 91