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You have been amazing thanks again x

John Edward also lived in Cross Street Dudley so they didn't stay in one place x

I have managed to get the bc for John Edward my great grandfather and this is my new starting point it reads
Place of birth Charles Passage (this is/was in Tipton) he is the only John Edward in the area in 1872 (1939 gives dob as 3 Nov 1873 bc as 3 Nov 1872) father William Martin mother Ann formerly  Armstrong father's proffession is carter x

Thank you Willow. This is interesting and now I am getting dizzy lol. In 1841 I have found something (different - my tree is getting many alternatives) I found William 15 b Staffs living in Tipton parents Thomas and Hannah. So the marriage throws that out of the window if my confusing theory is right. One census gives Worcs, another brilliant and another  Shropshire- the Thomas suspect father in 1841 says he was b in Dawley Magma. I think I need to ascertain the marriage is correct as could be two William and Ann's out there x

Thank you Willow. Yes this is them. I have been thrown of their trail once before. I found before they were married she had already had a child called Cartwright who later went as both Armstrong and Martin. Not sure if she actually married a Mr Cartwright or just went as that name but there was one next door on an earlier census. There are some Armstrong baptisms in Old Swinford which is under Worcs and they could possibly be her siblings. Also William says Dudley as well as Tipton which are side by side in Geography but Dudley as come under both Tipton and Dudley. My great grandfather John Edwards birth came under Tipton but the address was in Dudley x