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Messages - peakoverload

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19
The Common Room / Does Anyone Know Anything About Boats?
« on: Tuesday 18 January 22 14:52 GMT (UK)  »
A bit random but I've just found that my 3x GG who lived in Leigh-On-Sea, Essex had a boat/ship that was registered in the Mercantile Navy List 1848. Whilst he lived by the Thames Estuary he didn't really have anything to do with shipping but he was a seriously wealthy man who owned a lot of land and many businesses. The Mercantile Navy List doesn't give a lot of information but I'm wondering if anyone can shed some light on the little it does?

It says that the vessel had the name Eleanor and was registered in the port of Maldon. It was 72 tonnes but no horse power is registered so must have been powered by sail. The only other information is that it had the Commercial Code Signals (whatever they are) J.P.F.C.

72 tonnes seems a tad large for a rowing boat ;) but equally its not a few hundred tonnes or more of larger ship.

I can't figure out why he would own a boat at a port some 20+ miles away unless it was to do with one of his many businesses. In 1848 he would have been a Victualler and a Coal Merchant. There is a family story that one day he came home and put a lump of coal on the table and said "that's from my coal mine". Obviously there are no coal mines in Essex but later he did build a house called Pittington House and the sister of his first wife moved up to very near Pittington, County Durham. Whilst he is not recorded as having anything to do with Pittington Colliery, I wonder if, as a coal merchant, he bought coal from the colliery and shipped it down to Essex on boats like this (Leigh didn't have a railway at this time, that didn't come until 1855 which my 3x GG campaigned for)? Probably clutching at straws and that a 72 tonne vessel is too small for this kind of thing but just curious if anyone knows anything that might shed some more light on the matter.

20
Family History Beginners Board / Electoral Registers Question
« on: Saturday 08 January 22 20:03 GMT (UK)  »
I'm trying to trace the history of the house I grew up in and it's not helped by the fact that the road it is on has had three different names and the house 3 different numbers.

I did find that in 1911 a William Eric Leigh Jenkinson b 1881 was living there at the then 65 Church Road, Upper Norwood. From other information I have been given but haven't confirmed, I believe he was living there until 1928 so I expected to find him on the 1921 Census. However, from what I can find, neither he, his wife Mabel Winifred Jenkinson b1887 or indeed the house at 65 Church Road is listed in the 1921 census.

However I have found both he and his wife on the electoral registers for 1919 to 1923.

It shows them being in the polling district of Farringdon Without (s) and has them listed under New Bridge Street. However it then has in brackets (abode 65 Church Road, Upper Norwood)

The full line therefore reads:

Polling District of Farringdon Without (S)
New Bridge Street
S3463 BP O Jenkinson, William Eric Leigh 15 (Adobe - 65 Church Road, Upper Norwood)

Why would they be on the electoral roll for Farringdon if they lived in Upper Norwood? Is this a case of them having a second home and Church Road wasn't their primary residence and so they just happened to not be there when the 1921 census was taken? Also does anyone know what the letters BP and O indicate?

21
Surrey / Surrey Trade/Post Office Directories
« on: Tuesday 04 January 22 15:07 GMT (UK)  »
Does anyone know where I can locate (online ideally but will purchase data CD's if necessary) post office, Kelly's, trade directories that cover Upper Norwood from around 1840 to as near to the present as possible. I'm trying to find information about private houses and businesses in the area known locally as 'The Triangle' namely Church Road, Westow Street and Westow Hill. In particular I'm looking for information on the house I grew up in on Church Road

So far I've only been able to find a few for 1855, 1878, 1891.

I've been given some information pertaining to my house and it's former residents which indicates that the information came from directories and in particular for 1861, 1864, 1865, 1866-1889 (maybe not complete), 1892 - 1898 (maybe not complete), 1902 - 1909 (maybe not complete), 1911, 1912 - 1928 (maybe not complete), 1930, 1932 - 1939 (maybe not complete), 1954.

I would like to see what other information is in these and any other directories for the area to build up a picture of the community through history.


22
Buckinghamshire / Re: Two burials of same name exactly 1 year apart
« on: Tuesday 16 February 21 15:28 GMT (UK)  »
Thanks all for the replies and info, especially to LizzieL for the new leads.

I know that with records of this age there is often an element of 'best guess' as the detail recorded is so scant. It's also further complicated in that there appear to be a number of Gray families living in Great Marlow around that time and into the 1800's and there does appear to be two or three generations of Robert at various stages and in at least one occurrence, both married someone of the same name.

Going through things though, unless I've missed something, the most likely scenario based on the records found so far is that:

Robert Gray was baptised 04/01/1757 to parents Robert and Elizabeth

Ann Allum was born c1752

Robert married Ann Allum 23/02/1778 Robert aged 21, Ann aged 26

Ann Allum was buried 10/11/1816

Robert was buried 28/05/1837

All the dates do seem to match up. The thing I'm less certain about is Robert only being 21 when he married when Ann was 26. Whilst certainly not impossible, it just 'feels' a little too much of an age gap for people so young.

It's entirely possible that Robert wasn't born in Great Marlow, it's just that 3-4 generations after him were all from there. Indeed I'm really struggling to trace this line any further back than this.

23
Buckinghamshire / Two burials of same name exactly 1 year apart
« on: Monday 15 February 21 21:53 GMT (UK)  »
I'm tracing my 5xGG Robert Gray. I know almost nothing about him other than he was married to an Ann Allum whom he married in Great Marlow on 23/02/1778

They had 4 children:

Joseph Gray b1781
Ann Gray b1783
Sarah Gray b 1785
Hannah Gray b1790

I've no idea when Robert was born but have presumed it was around 1757 +/- 5 years in Great Marlow. Unfortunately there are two potential baptisms that match, one in 1757 and the other in 1759 and at the moment I've no way of identifying which is correct.

I'm also trying to find a burial for him and as it must be on or after 1790 I can only find two burials in Great Marlow that are possibles. However they match each other almost too perfectly and it makes me wonder if they are in fact the same burial but one has been miss transcribed.

In the record set England Deaths & Burials 1538-1991 there is a burial for a Robert Gray in Great Marlow on 19 Sep 1791

In the archives of the centre for Buckinghamshire Studies in the Bishops Transcripts (archive reference D/A/T/126/8) there is a burial for a Robert Gray in Great Marlow on 19 Sep 1790

What are the chances of there being two Robert Gray's in Great Marlow that were buried on exactly the same day but 1 year apart? Would you agree that this is more than likely a transcription error or that the date was written down incorrectly in the Bishops Transcript?


24
London and Middlesex / Court of Common Pleas
« on: Sunday 14 February 21 13:58 GMT (UK)  »
I'm researching my 2x GG George Gray b1840 in York Town, Surrey d1918 in Wandsworth, London.

Looking through the various census and other documents I've found, he's listed as:
Grocer
Tea Merchant
Ironmonger
Hay Straw Salesman

So it would appear he was of relatively humble means. However, one of his sons, Charles Haddon Gray went on to become a solicitor of some note and made a very successful career. It has puzzled me how his son was able to make that leap into a completely different line of work and lifestyle.

I've just found Charles Haddon Gray's School Admission registration in 1873 on Ancestry (LCC/EO/DIV01/STCL1/AD/001 page 19) and the address given is rather odd.

In 1871, according to the census, the family were living at 8 Bates Terrace, Wandsworth Road, Vauxhall

But the address given on the school admission is Court of Common Pleas, Westminster

According to Wikipedia The Court of Common Pleas, or Common Bench, was a common law court in the English legal system that covered "common pleas"; actions between subject and subject, which did not concern the king.

Does anyone know how this could be used as an address and whether this had any bearing on his son later becoming a solicitor?

25
Family History Beginners Board / Re: Charles Haddon Redvers Gray
« on: Saturday 13 February 21 00:17 GMT (UK)  »
Ahh think I found it

https://archive.org/details/Tambimuttu_TambimuttuPublishedWriting/page/n21/mode/2up

26
Family History Beginners Board / Re: Charles Haddon Redvers Gray
« on: Friday 12 February 21 12:35 GMT (UK)  »
Radcliff, can I ask where you found that image you posted? I would be interested to read a bit more if it's available online. I can't find a book called Tambimuttu 1915- 1983. I can find one called Tambimuttu : Bridge Between Two Worlds by Jane Williams which mentions him a few times but it doesn't seem to have that photo of him.

27
Family History Beginners Board / Re: Charles Haddon Redvers Gray
« on: Friday 12 February 21 11:42 GMT (UK)  »
Thank you so much for this! This is really interesting and confirms a few things I suspected about him and gives me a few more leads on other bits too. I have a photo of him when he was younger and there is definitely a resemblance, so for certain it's the same person.

Amazing bit of detective work!!

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