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Messages - Shizara

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Essex Lookup Requests / Re: Louie Grace Brooks - Census look up please
« on: Sunday 27 September 09 20:29 BST (UK)  »
You are wonderful.  I have struggled with this family for a long time and only just got the marriage certificate yesterday. 

The information you have given me is a big help and I really appreciate it.  Thank you.

Essex Lookup Requests / Louie Grace Brooks - Census look up please
« on: Sunday 27 September 09 08:28 BST (UK)  »
Louie Grace Brooks is the daughter of Isaac Thomas Brooks, Commercial Traveller, according to a marriage certificate dated 1918.  Her age is given as 34.

She married George Brooks, Civil Servant.  His age is given as 34.

Addresses given were Markhouse Avenue, Walthamstow for George and Queens Road, Walthamstow for Louie.

Scotland / Re: Lieut.Col James Dalrymple
« on: Wednesday 23 September 09 23:22 BST (UK)  »
Some absolutely amazing detective work is going on here and an equally amazing story is evolving. 

I have been tied up with work related things lately but hoping to be back on the trail shortly. 

I was being left behind so to speak.  My last email notification was 2 days ago so missed all the latest exciting finds, but I have caught up now and ready for the next exciting installment.

Scotland / Re: Lieut.Col James Dalrymple
« on: Sunday 13 September 09 11:48 BST (UK)  »
The following is a summary of how I see the situation and many aspects of it, including the inheriting of the title, are in agreement with what has already been said.

It would seem to me that lineages can change direction for many reasons, but looking at what information is freely available on the internet and trying to strike some balance between what probably did happen, what actually did happen and transcription errors I still come up with the thought that because James is a child of the second marriage then any brothers from the first would come in line to inherit the title before he would.  In this case, his half brother John and more often than not I suspect the lineage carries on to the eldest living son of the one holding the title.

Electrics Scotland also gives an account of the second baronet, Sir John Dalrymple having been twice married and having 5 sons and 6 daughters. When he died he was succeeded by his eldest son, Sir William Dalrymple, who bacame the 3rd baronet of Cousland.  Sir William apparently having 8 sons and 6 daughters from his 2 marriages.

The account notes that 3 of his sons of William, 3rd Bart,  by his second marriage were also in the army, but, it was after the death of the third baronet that his eldest son, Sir John Dalrymple, by his first wife, Agnes Crawford, became the  4th baronet.

In searching any family tree there is always the chance of stepping on toes directly or indirectly and I see the biggest issue here is in the partial acknowledgement of descendants of Lieut-Col James Dalrymple.  Partially acknowledged because some records, in various forms, still exist and they point towards that relationship.

Understanding what went on at the time isn't always easy as we were not witnesses to the events, but what history does tell us is that relationships and marriages that produced Anglo-Indian offspring didn't always have a relaxed acceptance in some areas of society and people reacted accordingly.  However, there were times it was actively encouraged and this url gives more insight:

Unless documented proof can be found we cannot be sure that James and Moti were or were not married but what is known, from the available records, is that there were children born to James and Moti and that he provided well for them, including an education at a school that his sister Wemyss Murray nee Dalrymple had more than a passing connection with, according to his will.

It would appear that the children had Indian names and that any that returned to England to be integrated in Scottish society had taken on English names.

Now, this is only my personal opinion, but I don't see that the lineage changed direction, it would appear to have rightfully gone to John, eldest son of William,  3rd Bart and his first wife Agnes Crawford and from there to the son of John.  What I do see and with much sadness, is the non inclusion of the descendants of Lieut-Col James Dalrymple leaving them, for the most part, with a cloudy ancestry and seemingly, without an official documented line in history.

What does seem clear to me is although it is without a title, Glamis and her mother are descendants of an Indian Princess and Lieut-Col James Dalrymple, who is son of William, 3rd Bart of Cousland and his second wife Ann Philps.  It also seems clear to me that having their line as part of that family documented officially would mean a lot to this family.

Scotland / Re: Lieut.Col James Dalrymple
« on: Wednesday 09 September 09 21:37 BST (UK)  »
Little Nell, you are brilliant.  I inquired about copies of manuscripts from the library and it was unbelievably expensive.

Scotland / Re: Lieut.Col James Dalrymple
« on: Tuesday 08 September 09 21:46 BST (UK)  »
Little Nell, I read, with interest, your balanced explanation to the queries that Glamis had.  It makes a great deal of sense.... then came the bit at the end that previously had a question mark over it, what did Lieutenant Colonel James Dalrymple die of and exactly where he was buried.  I think that Glamis will be so pleased to have that information.

Scotland / Re: Lieut.Col James Dalrymple
« on: Sunday 06 September 09 22:47 BST (UK)  »
The "hat" probably stops the birds pooing on his head.

Scotland / Re: Lieut.Col James Dalrymple
« on: Sunday 06 September 09 21:19 BST (UK)  »
A Google search turned up some information on the statue of the man on a horse.  it is the Duke of Wellington.  As for the cone on his head, it seems that the authorities regularly removed cones only to have someone replace it with another, usually the next night.  The authorities no longer remove the cone and it is said to show the city's light-hearted attitude towards authority.

Scotland / Re: Lieut.Col James Dalrymple
« on: Sunday 06 September 09 11:20 BST (UK)  »
Another Google search, this time for:

bullet-holed colours of the Scottish Regiment of Foot

This brings up in the listing a pdf file her time out with the option to have an html file.  A search of that page netted the information regarding the bullet holed colours and the connection to Mrs Hankins.

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