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Messages - panished

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Travelling People / Re: Staffordshire Travellers
« on: Monday 27 December 21 16:00 GMT (UK)  »
 Hi Garen

I have been collecting all sorts of information these last few years, i have lots on the Sherriffs and Hollands plus all the ways the Hodgkiss name may be wrote, i know you are a high class researcher but i like to share things i find, i try and look for answers contained within what i find like the name of a pub or street then i just use that name alone and research it, i will put up here a few things i found about the Hodgkins/ons, that Smithy Lane is interesting to, in the papers they say about how it was a Cherry Orchard hundreds of yeares ago, that's if i found the right place? 

Happy New Year to you...michael

PS...i will put a few more things on that you may not of seen before but if you have no worry

Saturday 29 July 1848 Staffordshire Advertiser

The court opened nine o'clock, and the first case tried was one of a Criminal Assault on a Child at Westbromwich.
JOHN LEICESTER, a young man, described in the calendar as 20 years of age, was charged with an assault with Intent, &c., on Sarah Hoskins, at Westbromwich. the prisoner had been committed for the capital offence, but the the Grand Jury having ignored the bill, he was put upon his trial for the misdemeanor. A strong sympathetic feeling was apparent in court at the procedure's, a child about nine years of age of diminutive stature, and very meanly clad, was lifted on the barristers' table to give her testimony. The girl belonged to a gipsy encampment which, in the month of June last, was pitched in a lane near the old church, at Westbromwich. Having wandered from the tent for the purpose of picking sticks, she saw the prisoner sitting on a stile. He asked the girl to come to him, and her refusing he carried her over the stile, and proceeded to use considerable violence towards her, and afterwards ran away. Information of the outrage having been conveyed to the police, Jesse Bailer, one of the officers, went in pursuit of the offender, and in the course of the same day met with him in the neighbourhood of Westbromwich. The prisoner being told the nature of the charge of which was suspected, put on a bold front, and at once consented to go to the gipsy camp, and confront the child. On the way, however, came to stand, and said to the officer, “ I am d--d  if i will go any further with you,” and “suiting the action to the word," ran away. Baiter gave chase, and for twenty minutes followed him over hedge and ditch, until ultimately with the assistance of two men who were fishing, the prisoner was captured. being taken to the station, was identified  by the girl…………………………….

Saturday 15 December 1855 Staffordshire Advertiser
 Child Burnt.—A serious accident happened on Thursday to a little girl, whose stepfather, named Hodgkin's, lives in Pumpstreet, Bigherland, Newcastle. He is a besom-maker, and, with his wife, had gone to the wood to get some stuff for besoms, leaving the little girl alone in the house. About noon the neighbours were alarmed by the shrieks of the child, who ran into the street with her clothes in a blaze……………………..   
Saturday 31 March 1888  Worcestershire Chronicle

DEATH from EXPOSURE near EVESHAM. Mr. F. Moore (deputy coroner), held an inquest on Thursday afternoon, at Rous Leach, touching the death of Maria Boswell, tramp, aged 75, whose body was found on Monday morning in a field called Yeld Hill. Police-constable Mayo stated that the body was scantily clothed ; but deceased had a package of bread and meat lying close to her, and on her fingers were seven rings, two of which appeared to be gold ; while in her pockets was 7'd. money, some tobacco, and clay pipe. Clara Hodgkin's, travelling hawker, stated that deceased, who came from Warwick, was her mother. She last saw her eight days previously, when they were camping near Abbots Morton, and deceased strayed away during her absence…………………………...   

Staffordshire Advertiser - Saturday 27 February 1808

To be sold by action, undermentioned desirable Freehold Estates,   LOT I. All that desirable Freehold Close, Piece or Parcel of excellent meadow pasture Land, situate, lying & being near to,or adjoining a certain Lane in Uttoxeter aforesaid, called Smithy Lane, known by  the name of Smithy Lane Croft, now in the occupation of John Smith

Saturday 11 December 1819 Staffordshire Advertiser
To be sold by auction.
LOT 5. The upper or western part of a close piece of Land, called the Cherry Orchard or Smithy Lane Croft, (as now marked staked out)  N. B. Among the many opportunities which have lately presented themselves in the Town of Uttoxeter, for investment of money in real property, few have occurred equal to the present. Lots 4, 5, 6, 7, and 8, are all well stocked with a choice assortment of valuable fruit trees in full bearing. The whole of the premises are in the occupation of Mr. John Smith, Gardener…………   

Staffordshire Advertiser - Saturday 27 January 1838
Occupier-James Hodgkins, House in Smithy Lane, chief rent on this lot 1s. 8d.........

Travelling People / Re: SHERRIFF family,Warks,Notts,Staffs,Derby
« on: Thursday 02 December 21 17:47 GMT (UK)  »
Hi all,sorry iv not been on here for abit.Iv kinda run out of steam on the Sherriff tree at the moment so been havin a break from it.
Garen,i think it was my uncle that got in touch with you (my auntys husband Roger).You have a great website,my trees on ancestory.Great newspaper clippings,i wouldnt even know where to start.Any tips would be greatly apprechiated!!!

Julie,in the Sherriff family many of the people named there kids after their siblings,so you will find there are probaly quite afew Abrahams etc.Its just trial and error in finding the right one.As Garen said,they changed names & intermarried,anyone older was called uncle & anyone the same age was brother or sister.Also sometimes they were born in one place but not registered until in another place or sometimes the births were registered in several districts.The Romanys of yonder deffinatly didnt make it easy for us to find them etc,lol!!!
I just wish my grandad was still alive to ask.
Shaz xxx

On page three of this thread above Roger is talked about well Roger managers Susan's Ancestry page and Susan is your Aunt, dna is not talked about in this day like a family tree but before the internet i listened to people talk about the black blood, this you had to have if you was from the Romany Gipsy's, you had to have this regardless of family or lifestile, you had to be of the black blood no matter what big or small, to me this is the true meaning of what people have been talking about, its all there in the dna clusters, it is not like them old tree rings that people search out for answers about how old a tree is its not like when the scientists crush up bones and date the dust of the dead, the dna in people living will tell you if the dead are alive in you in this day, its not like the halogroups that people looks for that tell of far of placers, the black blood gets past down through generations and is kept alive as long as it is alive, if you know you know if its in you its in you, when its gone its gone, by looking for cracks in science people may fool evan themselves into thinking they open an hidden door that lets them rejoin, i do not think that this is the black blood,
the black blood is what the old Gipsy's would talk about, someone once said that the Romany in this day know who is who for they themselves would know all the old names connected to the Gipsy's through family ties that others would not know, this is how they new who was who and who had the black blood in them now in this day the dna that is within all the Gipsy descendants in this day shows them who are the people who are left from the ancient peoples, its living dna not dead crushed bones or tree rings or long gone country's, the black blood is the living dna not the dead dna, the black blood doesn't mutate it is just passed down this is the only true line of the Romany Gipsy's, it may come from your Aunt, your Uncle, your great Gran or Grandad, it will be there if its there, no Gipsy alive or dead would ever say different, it as nothing to do with being a male or female, theres no mutations no secrete line to be uncovered there is no chalice there is only whats in you, when it runs out its out and gone, if its still in you just recognise it for what it is, you may not be of the Gipsy's in this day but know as true that the dead still live in you in this day for if you still carry what was given you are truly descended from them, my Mother said to me never michael to be afraid of the dead if they come to you just be having the talk to them, never be afraid just talk to them right, well this talk i just have had is the right true talk and I'm not afraid of the dead.

michael Leahcim...... this is my Ancestry name 

I just wanted to show you this, well i am a far Cousin to this lady below named Lorraine her grand mother was Ellen Sheriff 1902–1982
who comes out of Thomas Holland there does not seam to be any more information that Lorraine knows, i think she is from the Gipsy's though for me and Lorraine both share dna with 12 people and each and every one of those 12 are ritch in Gipsy history we share no history through dna with no other peoples, these are the 12 below

Stanley Young Smith Seed Jeffery two Lovell's  Hodgkin's Davidson Deese Boswell a Weddell who father was a Lovell and who as these ancestors in his tree
Duke Lee
Union Lee
 Duanna (Diana) Lee
Elisha 'Rightdoer' Lee
 Elisha 'Rightdoer' Lee1737–
Letitia Lee
Manfield Lee
 so you see evan when someone as a name like Weddell that may not be known by anyone yet when you look into their dna as a family in dna you then start to learn, me and Weddell then go on to share 27 people who we both match to and each and every one of those 27 are from the Gipsy's, i have 17 thousand dna matches thoughout the world i have still not looked at thousands of these matches but so far i have over seven hundred people from the old Gipsy's worldwide who match through dna with me, over 20 now are from the Romany Gipsy of Europe, how i match to them is a mystery for they hold no British way dna as in ethnicity yet we share far ancestry in dna as dna.












Travelling People / Re: SHERRIFF family,Warks,Notts,Staffs,Derby
« on: Thursday 02 December 21 17:46 GMT (UK)  »
This is a reply to page one post one on this thread

Hi all,i wondered if anyone was related to the Sherriff family from Warks & surrounding areas?My family line goes Reginald Sherriff B:1921 Warks...Matthew Sherriff B:1880 staffs m Annie Morgan 1900 Warks...Abraham Sherriff 1851 Chester m Delilah Smith 1850...William Sherriff 1814 Redditch m Mary Ann Tracey Boswell 1806 Leicestershire...Edward Sherriff abt 1779 m Mary Hart ...George Sherriff m Susannah Palmer....

 Any info is greatly apprechiated!!
Thanks for reading.
Shaz :O)

 Hi Susan is a far distand Cousin to me we both share fragments of ancient dna, Susan's father was Reginald Harold Sherriff 1921–1993 Nuneaton Warwickshire r.i.p who's father was Matthew Sherriff 1880–1950 Burton upon Trent Staffordshire who's father was  Abraham Sheriff 1849–1925 Alsager, Yorkshire, who's father was William Sherriff  1812–1891 Redditch, Warwickshire, it looks like William may have come down from Edward Sherriff 1780William's wife was Mary Ann Tracy Boswell, 1799–1897 Loughborough, Leicestershire, Abrahams wife was Deliah Smith 1850–1930, Delilahs mother and father were Priscilla Smith 1824– Belper, Derbyshire, and Frederick Heap 1826–Snelston, Derbyshire, Reginald's mother was Annie MORGAN 19011-972 Alcester Warwickshire

Susan shares 44 dna matches with me who all descend down from the old Gipsy's, this is in the 1st to 6th range, there are old family names within the stated 44 such as the Holmes Lovell's Lees Wharton's Boswells Gray Smiths Young Adams Jeffery Anderson's Love Stanley  plus many more, there will be many more at the 8th range, these only show up when you click on their individual names, there will be far more in the 6th to 8th range but you must hunt them down in a individual way for ancestry only bring together your shared clusters from 1st to 6th in the Cousin sequence
 I also share dna with a male who descends down through the Booths on his male side his father is Hope Booth 1911-1958 r.i.p who's parents were Ephraim Booth 1884–1963 and Matilda Sheriff 1886– who is my matches grandmother, Ephraim Booths parents were Henry Booth 1864 - and  Elizabeth Boyling 1864–1950, Henry Booths parents were Ephraim Clayton/Booth 1841–1910 and Diana/Dinah Booth 1836Elizabeth Boyling 1864–1950 parents were Absalom  Boyling 1816-and Rebbecca Booth 1823–1888

Now back to Hope Booth 1911-1958 r.i.p  well Hopes mother was Matilda Sheriff 1886– Matilda's  parents are Hope Sheriff 1855–1934 and Trinity Boyling 1860-1937 Hope Sheriffs  parents were 
William Sheriff 1812–1891 and Mary Ann Tracey Boswell 1805–1897 Aka Tresi Boss descended from Haniel Bosswell 1583, Trinity Boyling 1860-1937 parents were also Absalom  Boyling 1816- and Rebbecca Booth 1823–1888.

So it looks like these Sherriffs descend from the same family to which Susan's Sherriffs family come down from, Abraham and Hope must both be sons of William and Mary Ann there is also a mentioned Elizabeth Sherriff 1725–Sutton In Ashfield Nottinghamshire on my matches tree so she may be along with the old Edward Sherriff from the 1700s  in some way or relation who may be Williams dad, Nellie Smith 1906–Sutton In Ashfield, Nottinghamshire r.i.p was the Mother of my dna match, Hope Booth 1911-1958 r.i.p was her husband, Nellie comes down through a long line of Smiths to a Jane Smith1727–1797, i do not know if these Smiths are of the Gipsy's but they are connected to family's like Thompson and Wildgoose, me and this male born with the above Sherriff ancestry both share dna with 24 dna match's with many of the names above but this time the Bucklands join this cluster.


Travelling People / Re: Hurn Herons Hearns Youngs
« on: Monday 04 October 21 06:46 BST (UK)  »
Hi Daisy,  (daisydew7)

Through dna testing I have several Young/Heron matches, two of them come down through Frampton, one through Nathan and the other through Joseph who both are the sons of Frampton many of the Young's seam to have connection's themselves to Scotland plus the far lands to the East, these are distant Cousin matches to me that must predate them going to America, all the names you write of are in my matches tree that they put up for me to see, you have to match first though, see if you can find me on Ancestry my profile name is (michael Leahcim) we may match for I have male and females dna matches from America who are straight descended down from Frampton plus several more American Young's they are all connected to the Palmer's Robinsons Williamsons Lovell's and everyone you could think of, another of the Young's who I match to comes out of the Blackpool Young's, its hard to find everything out though for just as the many that let you see free bits well others put up nothing, they make you write to them evan though you dna match, so i will just have to rely on what i find, this is what you wrote below.

Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
  Friday 01 October 21
“Hello, I’ve known my whole life that I had Romany, however I never heard my dad or my granny use that term…it was always Gypsy. My dad and granny spoke their Rom language fluently. Some people find Gypsy derogatory but it was used in my family. My granny was 100% Rom. Her dad was Joseph Young son of Frampton Young( Heron). Her mother was Delilah Boss daughter of Sampson Boss who was son of the infamous Riley Boss.

Myself, my brother, my niece and my cousin all are matching DNA on Ancestry to lots and lots of cousins that we can trace and prove are all Romany  full or otherwise.  With that said I am only a 1/4 ROM. My Dad 1/2 and my granny full. Look at your DNA match and check who their matching. I guess if you are researching and not sure if you have Rom or not it could be more challenging for sure.

  Re: Hurn Herons Hearns Young's
  Wednesday 15 May 19
Riley Boss and his wife Lucy are my 3rd great grandparents but I am also related to the Hearn, Heron/ Young Family.....this is interesting. Eric Trudgill has been very helpful too as well as Anne. I find your posts here informative. Most my research has been found on my family after arriving in the USA. My great great grandfather Frampton Young came to America from England in 1855. My gg grandfather Samson Boss ( Son Of Riley and Lucy Boss) came to America as well as his Mother in the 1860’s . Thank you for posting this information.
Here is a marriage certificate of My gg grandfather Frampton’s youngest son Nathan and Pinkney, married in the USA”.

Daisy, if you go on this link below it shows you information about everything, you have to keep clicking on (next) or (back) at the bottom of each page to see more pages, I use these pedigrees shown on this web site to trace back the Family's that I dna match to, I know things may have been wrote wrong and outdated but most will be about right, I have lots of Boswell matches well several but just one straight down the line Boss but lots have the Bosses in them anyway like the ones I match to from Framptons lot, I will find and put up here more information about the Heron Young's I hope I have been of help to you, I have no idear how I connect to the Heron Young's Hearnes Herrings, not a clue but in this day I share dna with the descendant's of these Family's, in life you can only carry that which you hold, plus Ancestry are updating their Ethnicity in peoples profiles, i have noticed several Gipsy Family's now have connections to the Bengal region,this placers their travels further East, i wonder what will the science make of this, the Heron Young's offten show the Eastern lands in their Ethnicity, you just have to look at their Family history in what i have read through my dna clusters and you know that they are one of the Old lot, some names i have found to are from a very old time yet i have seldom heard their name mentioned, i do not think though that such things would be of trouble to them, in my mind Daisy you was right about the word Gipsy, its a proud word, when i came on the internet i met many people and listened into many conversations, then i listened how they downgraded the word Gipsy for the proper word was Roma, now i wondered what were people talking about, sure Romany is a good name but how can you be a Romany without being a Romany Gipsy, no one can be a Gipsy or descend from them unless you are a Romany Gipsy, it would be like walking around with no legs, that's the way of the lands round these British isles in my mind and that's the way of it, well that's just what i think, i am just a scrag end but the whole bit of scrag once came of some good stuff, i,ll wear my Gold Coins till i die.

Travelling People / Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
« on: Sunday 03 October 21 19:03 BST (UK)  »
 Hi Daisy,  (daisydew7)

 i moved my post to the Heron Young page were i meant it to go

Travelling People / Re: Wilsher blood line, Nottingham, Joseph Wilsher
« on: Tuesday 04 May 21 19:17 BST (UK)  »
I would prefear to write to them on your behalf, and state that you would like to learn of such things that you have sort, if this is not right by you tell why and then i will private message you the details you ask, i would like to show respect to my Cousin dna matches, i offten make mistakes but try to evolve and move on, i will write to Deniece and ask her to come on Rootschat and answer your questions, who knows the final answers may not be of your liking and still your thoughts look ever more to the unknown, and also try not to give out the full details of people living 
regards michael 

Travelling People / Re: Wilsher blood line, Nottingham, Joseph Wilsher
« on: Monday 03 May 21 17:52 BST (UK)  »
you are right about Big Jack, i try not to put the modern to days information up, for i think its bad manners to do that when you start to understand the ways of the Rootschat peoples ideals, and Big Jack may not want his name put all over the internet that's why i try and learn new skills in writing, Denieces last name as in her profile well its on Ancestry as you did ask before, the person who mangers her profile has also well known photo's of Gipsy relatives , i do not match to him i match to Denieces tree in dna yet her manager as the same name as Her, Lesley from the North is also on ancestry i have the My Heritage also and i did find a sort of second Cousin named Knight who dna matcher's to me, the Knights are a Gipsy name from the past, My Heritage is more than likely a very good web site but i like Ancestry the best for it suits my needs.

on Denieces managers profile you may see Amy Lee and Earis Smith and Mena Lee plus Oliver Lee Leonard Lee and Julia Boswell Betsy Cooper and Sam Smith and more photos that i have never seen, i am nothing of none of the Peoples i talk of i just have links myself from peoples of the past who are now gone. 

Travelling People / Re: Wilsher blood line, Nottingham, Joseph Wilsher
« on: Monday 03 May 21 16:47 BST (UK)  »
Janey i few posts back asked me that, i still do not know what ged match is, i guess its to find people in a near tree who through dna are relatives, you can just freely ask me anything if you wish, do you seak any information, i have not done a gedmatch, who knows maybe one day i will.


Travelling People / Re: Wilsher blood line, Nottingham, Joseph Wilsher
« on: Monday 03 May 21 08:50 BST (UK)  »
I just wanted to show you this dna match to me that contains a Cooper, she herself comes out of the Lowthers plus i share four dna matches with this match named Lesley, they are two Boswell males with the same Christain name but i can see they are different people, plus Big Jack from America who as the champions of ancestry, and finally a Female whose Granparents are Smiths and Lees on one side, her Parents she does not give any name to, there is much to learn from the information contained in the Cousin sequence, it may be many years in the future before such truth is known but we can only learn of such things in our own life times and think of these things, you would not of ever known of the Lowthers, they connect to the Wilshers- Wiltshires who I connect to, I am only a bit of a scrag end as regards Gipsy ancestry yet I to am free to learn as everyone who learns deems themselves fit, the Lowthers are in storeys with the Wilshers over the Yorkshire way and evan my own place of Sneinton, they get up to all sorts of goings on,  I understand all these goings, and love to read of the past peoples life's at all times I respect everyone of the long dead.

Manchester, Lancashire, England
Lesley  Mother was Brenda  1936–1982  r.i.p Manchester, Lancashire, Brenda's Mother was Donah Priscilla Lowther 1906–1987 Bury, Lancashire, Donas Mother was Lavina Lovell 1881–1910  Bury Lancaster, Donna's Father was George Lowther 1881–1958 Halifax, Yorkshire, Lavina's Father was George Lovell 1833– Elmstone Hardwicke, Gloucestershire, Lavina's Mother was Genti (Jenty) Cooper 1848– Wolverhampton, Staffordshire.

All this above in Lesley's open Tree that just shows you a few generations to help you see if there is a connection, then you may write to your dna match and ask to learn more, if they like you, you then are allowed to join their group.

Also on the world map that Lesley shows freely are more names in her tree but not the branch.

Major Lovell
Weldon, Northamptonshire

Isabella Smith
Solihull, Warwickshire

George Lovell
Longborough, Gloucestershire 

So you see how Gipsy's are connected through Family's and location, I think through dna you may follow and learn about Family's through the clusters that are plain to see if you look into the thousands of dna Cousin matches that everyone holds, also now there may be certain Family's that Criss cross Britain more than others and my own dna shows also how certain Family's Criss crossed evan oceans, it has been a great learning to learn of such things, the Coopers I do not know anything about but I have come to learn you will find them in many trees that span the globe, i have several direct down the line born and bred Coopers who dna match to me, how i come to share dna with Coopers born in this day saying we share a far off common ancestor i do not know, there is a link in some form what it meens in truth only the times of the future may reveal, now when I engage with people on the internet I just talk to words, through this meetings of words I learn of many words, by being a person who aligns to words may sound selfish yet it is the truth for through this meeting it allows me to send forth my own words of my teachings from the heart of learning, which is my soul time goal in the art of such learning, people try and project words but the words reveal their truth that projectiles are but sent words having their own meanings through letters that fall and form, i do not see people but feel into their words this reveals that which can not be thrown, I do thank everyone though, to take the time to engage in whatever agenda allows much breath to be breathed in the spoken word, all words may be read, all words may be spoken, some people hide away their words in the dark cell prisoned in thought, how would you define the word selfish then, such people believe they are the jailer of words and  grasp hard the key in such tight nit rope hands, but why do they not see they themselves are looking out from the inner cell as they believe and think that they stare at you confined in the prison deep in truth it is them surrounded by iron bars forged in great darkness by the metal smith whose blinded hammer as sounded our world since man began from words forged in light that truth alights yet in hidden minds why themselves would they take such things to the grave deep for how great the cell thoughts of jailers yet no words weeps for them but sing loud the song of freedom as the bird whistles above the tomb for the  flower risers in everyday yet the flower seeks water as do words seek speech

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