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Messages - PAK

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10
Canada / Canada bmd if not on major websites
« on: Saturday 10 June 23 20:57 BST (UK)  »
Looking for details of a family branch I have recently discovered in Canada - mainly Alberta but of course other areas have occasional links. I have tried Familysearch, Ancestry and Findmypast and they all seem to be a bit thin on the ground.

Just as an example, I am looking for marriage dates for a family named Sturge in the mid 20th century, but marriage data seems to be largely unrecorded.

Can anyone suggest other websites?

11
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: Arrowsmiths in mid-Cheshire
« on: Wednesday 03 May 23 17:50 BST (UK)  »
I think that's all I need, so many thanks - especially for the prompt reply.

12
Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Arrowsmiths in mid-Cheshire
« on: Wednesday 03 May 23 15:06 BST (UK)  »
I have been puzzling over the attached for some time and am hoping someone may be better able to help me decipher this. It's crucial to my researches as it mentions a Simon Arrowsmith. But I have found 2 or possibly 3 others with the same name in the same part of Cheshire at around this period. So I'm hoping this might help me sort out which is which.
All suggestions gratefully received.
P.S. First time I have attached something to a Rootschat message. I think I've done the right things, but it's not clear if I have so please let me know if there is no attachment!

13
Cheshire / Re: Sproston family - Thurlwood, Odd Rode
« on: Sunday 08 January 23 22:00 GMT (UK)  »
Thanks for the replies, everyone. However, with the exception of one error on my part, I already have all the information you gave me.

Carole – I checked on the Elizabeth whose mmn was Eggerton and found her elsewhere later, so that one is not mine. So I agree that the one born Q1 1857 is the right one, but have found only the index you list, and no parish record with more information on it.

Ladyhawk - yes, I have deduced that William is the William Henry you mention, born in Congleton. Cheshirebmd shows it as Sandbach sub-district. I found a baptism record for Thomas at Odd Rode on 15.2.61 (as mentioned by Rosie).

Ladyhawk(2) – quite right that the groom’s father Thomas does not have an occupation listed. A slip of the digit on my part. The street is Goldschmidt Street in the Ardwick district.

However, my question is to try to identify Thomas the father of Elizabeth and Thomas. When was he born, where is he recorded in censuses ? He is not with Elizabeth, their grandmother and presumably his mother, in 1841 or any succeeding census.

14
Cheshire / Sproston family - Thurlwood, Odd Rode
« on: Sunday 08 January 23 17:32 GMT (UK)  »
Hoping there are some inspired detectives to look at this!
The 1861 census at Thurlwood shows these Sprostons : Elizabeth widow 56 b Sandbach, Jane 30 housemaid b Odd Rode, son Henry 11 b OR,  son Samuel 17 lab b OR.  I have all the details I need for them.
Then it shows grandson William 9 b Odd Rode, who I believe to be the illegitimate son of Jane above, also shown in birth and later records as William Henry.
But my problem is with the final two. Granddaughter Elizabeth 4 b Burslem, and grandson Thomas 1 b Odd Rode. I have Elizabeth in 1861 and 1871 then her marriage in 1881 at Prestbury to Charles Bason, where she is shown as the daughter of Thomas Sproston, a joiner. I have Thomas in 1861,  not 1871 or 1881, but I do have his marriage in 1890 in Chorlton-upon-Medlock to Annie Pugh, where his father is also shown as Thomas Sproston, joiner.

So the question is who and where was their father? If they are the grandchildren of Elizabeth then she did have a son called Thomas but he was born in 1840 and died in 1847. If she had a second Thomas born after then, he would be too young to have children in 1857 and 1861. If she had him earlier then they would not have named another child Thomas while he was still around. Might he have been Elizabeth's son, named Thomas, but by someone else, and then took the name Sproston after his mother married? If so, where is there any record of him? He is not with her in 1841.
Can anyone spot any holes in this? I think I'll go for a lie down now :) 

15
Lancashire / Re: Giles Makin - too many of them! Is mine the criminal?
« on: Thursday 18 August 22 16:03 BST (UK)  »
Thanks for all the very helpful replies.
There are several Giles Makins who might fit but after some elimination, and together with my own research, I think I’ve now come to some conclusions. I’m listing in some detail just in case another Rootschat enquiry is submitted for this quite distinctive name.
GM no.1 born and baptised in October 1805 in Horwich, is probably the one buried at St Peter’s in Bolton in 1814, both having a father named John.
My Giles (no.2) is probably the one baptised in 1808 at St Peter’s, the son of Thomas and Mary of Great Bolton. He and Elizabeth married in 1826 at Prestwich,and I have identified them in censuses from 1841 on. He is also the one buried at Astley Bridge in 1870, which is also where his wife Elizabeth was buried in 1858. Carole W – thanks for pointing to the non-con baptisms for his daughters. A pity it doesn’t show which non-con church, but I’ll follow that up for his other children.
Giles no.3 married Mary Wood in 1839. She had died by 1841 when he (shown as a widower) married Alice Smith, and I have tracked them in subsequent censuses, where his age consistently shows him born in 1812-13.
Giles no.4 was born in Bolton in 1814, but spent most of his life in Salford, where he died in 1878.
Giles no.5 was born in 1815 and died in 1884, spending most of his life in Worsley.
There are, of course, quite a few others who I was able to discard fairly quickly.
As for the GM who was sent to prison for larceny, I think this is probably someone else entirely from another part of Lancashire.
Thanks again for all the help – some of these are probables rather than absolute certainties but if anyone can spot a snag in the logic, please let me know.

16
Lancashire / Giles Makin - too many of them! Is mine the criminal?
« on: Monday 15 August 22 20:01 BST (UK)  »
I've been researching my wife's family tree and worked back to Giles Makin in Bolton. I believe he was born around 1807, married Elizabeth Aspinwall on 5.11.1826. They had 8 children and he was buried at Astley Bridge on 8th January 1870. So far, so good. But there are several Giles Makins around this time and this area, and i I fear I won't be able to be certain of his birth date and hence further generations back from him.
I have found one GM aged 31 imprisoned for 1 year for larceny, together with 7 others. This was at the Michaelmas sessions (i.e. Oct-Dec so after the census) when he was brought up from the House of Correction in Kirkdale. I can't find any info yet on his residence and wondered if anyone has access to newspaper reports of this time.
To anyone who has read through this - thanks for your attention!

17
Staffordshire / Re: Elizabeth Fisher (born c1812 in Kingstone, Staffs)
« on: Tuesday 17 May 22 11:39 BST (UK)  »
She must have died between the birth of her youngest child in 1838, and her husband's remarriage in 1847. So if the one in Chelsea is not her, it looks like we may be back to square one! I imagine a divorce was unlikely. Best bet (but with no evidence yet found) is that she died after the birth of her youngest so Q4 of 1838 or Q1 of 1839.
Alternatively, how clear is the age of 74 on the burial record?

18
Staffordshire / Re: Elizabeth Fisher (born c1812 in Kingstone, Staffs)
« on: Sunday 15 May 22 20:37 BST (UK)  »
Hi Helina. It's a long time since I looked at the Fishers and the notes I have are not very definite. However, what I have so far is as follows :
".... . There is no firm record(1) of Elizabeth after the birth of her 3rd child in 1838.
   William is known to have started work at Buckingham Palace in 1840 and from 1841 until 23rd November 1859 was assistant usher in the servants hall, with the grand title of “Usher of the Hall”. He remarried in 1847, to Matilda Bartlett at Cowes on the Isle of Wight and later probably held a position at Osborne House. They had at least 4 more children. In 1851, he is still at the palace, whilst his first family were living with grandparents in Staffordshire and Derbyshire, and his wife and second family with Matilda’s parents at Cowes. By 1871 he was running the “Juniper Berry” beerhouse at 16 Castle  Square in Southampton. He died in the Southampton district."

A footnote re Elizabeth says " 1:   The most likely record is that for the death of an Elizabeth Blore in the Chelsea district in Q2 1847."

Do let me know if you have more success than I. And good luck!

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