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Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Joseph's relationship to the Head of household
« on: Monday 18 December 23 17:38 GMT (UK) »
Can anyone make out Joseph Nation's relationship to Charles in this snip please?
Margaret
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2
The Common Room / Help please understanding a section of a 1692 will
« on: Thursday 24 August 23 16:29 BST (UK) »
Hello,
Can someone help me understand the meaning of the part from "with the ffee thereof next after the decease of the
therein granted by me in marriage with my daughter Lydea aforesaid." Is that word ' life'? Still don't understand what it all means, though.
Lydia had married my ancestor a few years earlier and in the early part of this will, her father gives her "one shilling of lawful English money..."
Thanks in advance for your help.
Can someone help me understand the meaning of the part from "with the ffee thereof next after the decease of the
therein granted by me in marriage with my daughter Lydea aforesaid." Is that word ' life'? Still don't understand what it all means, though.Lydia had married my ancestor a few years earlier and in the early part of this will, her father gives her "one shilling of lawful English money..."
Thanks in advance for your help.
3
Somerset / Samuel Poole (again) ! Was he the miller of Hewish Mill, Crewkerne?
« on: Monday 27 February 23 14:05 GMT (UK) »
I'm still trying to find out what happened to my gggg uncle Samuel Poole. As I have said in earlier threads, all I definitely know about him is that he was baptised in Seavington St Michael, Somerset in 1777, the 10th child of Thomas and Honour Poole (a yeoman family). [He is not the Samuel Poole that died in Middx in 1854 according to innumerable A****try trees - 1851 census clearly shows that one was born in Middx.]
Relatively recently I found references in the London Gazette of 1802 to a Samuel Poole who became bankrupt in 1802. In other newspapers including the Manchester Mercury of 04 May 1802 there was the announcement as follows:
Samuel Poole, now or late of Hewish Mills, within the parish of Crewkerne, in the county of Somerset, miller, to appear April 23, 24 at the George Inn, in Ilminster, and May 23 at the Castle Inn, in Taunton. Attorney, Mr Philip Warren, in Ilminster.
Is there any way of finding the result of any judgement? Would he have been imprisoned for bankruptcy? Does any further report state his age? (He'd have been 25 in 1802). It's just that Crewkerne is very close to his home village - and his older brother was a miller, so Samuel might have followed suit, for want of family land farmed by other brothers.
Any ideas gratefully received !
Relatively recently I found references in the London Gazette of 1802 to a Samuel Poole who became bankrupt in 1802. In other newspapers including the Manchester Mercury of 04 May 1802 there was the announcement as follows:
Samuel Poole, now or late of Hewish Mills, within the parish of Crewkerne, in the county of Somerset, miller, to appear April 23, 24 at the George Inn, in Ilminster, and May 23 at the Castle Inn, in Taunton. Attorney, Mr Philip Warren, in Ilminster.
Is there any way of finding the result of any judgement? Would he have been imprisoned for bankruptcy? Does any further report state his age? (He'd have been 25 in 1802). It's just that Crewkerne is very close to his home village - and his older brother was a miller, so Samuel might have followed suit, for want of family land farmed by other brothers.
Any ideas gratefully received !
4
The Common Room / Parish of Trent Somerset or Dorset
« on: Thursday 05 January 23 18:34 GMT (UK) »
My first post of 2023 so happy new year everyone!
The youngest child, William, was baptised in Trent, Somerset in 1607 (21 sept.)by his parents William and Thomazine Harvey/Harvye/Harvie. Only father's name appears on the Somerset Baptism Index taken from the Bishop's Transcripts, transcribed on FindMyPast (I haven't yet seen an image but so far this might be a true record. On FreeReg the child is the son of Richard so it definitey needs checking!)
Until 1896 Trent (about halfway between Yeovil and Sherborne) was in Somerset.
Other Harvey researchers say baby William died in 1608, very possibly the case. But I wanted to see where this info came from as I had never found a burial record in Trent (or Ashill, Somerset, where the family resided.
On FamilySearch I eventually found a record - attached to someone's tree - of a burial of a Willm Harvye in December 1608. The transcription says that the 'event place' was Trent, Dorset, England and the supposed record is from "England, Dorset, Parish Registers, 1538-2001", database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV3S-WJPX : 9 March 2021), Willm Harvey, 1608."
But how come this early record is said to be for Trent, Dorset?? I'm not at all sure this refers to the child in question since no mention of it being a child or father's name - but I'm far more concerned with where the information came from since Trent was in Somerset at the time !!
How can there be Parish Registers of this name while FreeReg for instance puts Trent among its Somerset registers? Confusing.
The youngest child, William, was baptised in Trent, Somerset in 1607 (21 sept.)by his parents William and Thomazine Harvey/Harvye/Harvie. Only father's name appears on the Somerset Baptism Index taken from the Bishop's Transcripts, transcribed on FindMyPast (I haven't yet seen an image but so far this might be a true record. On FreeReg the child is the son of Richard so it definitey needs checking!)
Until 1896 Trent (about halfway between Yeovil and Sherborne) was in Somerset.
Other Harvey researchers say baby William died in 1608, very possibly the case. But I wanted to see where this info came from as I had never found a burial record in Trent (or Ashill, Somerset, where the family resided.
On FamilySearch I eventually found a record - attached to someone's tree - of a burial of a Willm Harvye in December 1608. The transcription says that the 'event place' was Trent, Dorset, England and the supposed record is from "England, Dorset, Parish Registers, 1538-2001", database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV3S-WJPX : 9 March 2021), Willm Harvey, 1608."
But how come this early record is said to be for Trent, Dorset?? I'm not at all sure this refers to the child in question since no mention of it being a child or father's name - but I'm far more concerned with where the information came from since Trent was in Somerset at the time !!
How can there be Parish Registers of this name while FreeReg for instance puts Trent among its Somerset registers? Confusing.
5
The Common Room / 1939 register, changes, transcribers & FindMyPast
« on: Monday 19 December 22 19:58 GMT (UK) »
Fiddling about on FindMyPast I thought I'd just see what the 1939 register looked like, never having had cause to look at it before. When was it released? I find some oddities.
I put in my grandmother's name Winifred Nation + year of birth 1890 and Somerset. 1 result for Winfred T Nation. Clicked on the image to find her correctly at Clayhill Farm Cannington Somerset, except that her second name was Frances and looks like a pretty clear F to me.
For some reason the transcription gives her occupation as "Chitlon Twictt Cottage" (Chilton Trivett Cottage is the preceding location!) Not really important but is such an occupation really very likely?
However, underneath her entry is one crossed through in red for Annie M Nation born clearly (in my opinion) on 6th November 1919 (transcribed as 5th Nov), who is single and a student. This was my mother (deceased 2008)....whose name only changed to Mead 3 years later in 1942 when she married ! (If you go to "See Page 16" it shows the same information except that the name Nation has been transcribed as Hatson.)
I think at the start of the line in the image is a date, 17/9/42? If so it looks like the register was "corrected" for single women just after they married, even several years later.
I checked my mother-in-law (once I eventually found her, and her parents, under Dorothy Berris when it looks fairly obviously like Burris to me) and the same thing is there, her married name added 3 years later.
Why was this done I wonder?
I also wonder how many folk are unable to find fairly recent information from this register ! I know it wasn't created for the likes of family research maniacs and I do understand that transcribers are supposed to transcribe what they see but .... (tongue in cheek: are they asked to take a sight test first and/or use their intelligence just a tiny bit??)
I put in my grandmother's name Winifred Nation + year of birth 1890 and Somerset. 1 result for Winfred T Nation. Clicked on the image to find her correctly at Clayhill Farm Cannington Somerset, except that her second name was Frances and looks like a pretty clear F to me.
For some reason the transcription gives her occupation as "Chitlon Twictt Cottage" (Chilton Trivett Cottage is the preceding location!) Not really important but is such an occupation really very likely?
However, underneath her entry is one crossed through in red for Annie M Nation born clearly (in my opinion) on 6th November 1919 (transcribed as 5th Nov), who is single and a student. This was my mother (deceased 2008)....whose name only changed to Mead 3 years later in 1942 when she married ! (If you go to "See Page 16" it shows the same information except that the name Nation has been transcribed as Hatson.)
I think at the start of the line in the image is a date, 17/9/42? If so it looks like the register was "corrected" for single women just after they married, even several years later.
I checked my mother-in-law (once I eventually found her, and her parents, under Dorothy Berris when it looks fairly obviously like Burris to me) and the same thing is there, her married name added 3 years later.
Why was this done I wonder?
I also wonder how many folk are unable to find fairly recent information from this register ! I know it wasn't created for the likes of family research maniacs and I do understand that transcribers are supposed to transcribe what they see but .... (tongue in cheek: are they asked to take a sight test first and/or use their intelligence just a tiny bit??)
6
Somerset / Bullens of Seavington
« on: Wednesday 16 November 22 19:14 GMT (UK) »
In the 1901 census for Seavington St Mary an entry between Manor Farm and Manor Farm Cottages is called Bullens. This name of a dwelling does not appear in any other census for the village 1841-1911 (haven't looked at 1921).
I'm wondering whether this house/building was the home of my Bullen ancestors of Seavington.
Does anyone with local knowledge know it? Can anyone point me to a photo of it perhaps? I have looked on various old maps, and now on google street map and am wondering if, assuming it hasn't been pulled down, it might be the house at right angles to the road with no visible name between Manor Farm (on Water Street), on the same side of the road, and the junction with Church Lane. Does anyone know?
To have housed my ancestors the house had to be there in the 1790s.
I'm wondering whether this house/building was the home of my Bullen ancestors of Seavington.
Does anyone with local knowledge know it? Can anyone point me to a photo of it perhaps? I have looked on various old maps, and now on google street map and am wondering if, assuming it hasn't been pulled down, it might be the house at right angles to the road with no visible name between Manor Farm (on Water Street), on the same side of the road, and the junction with Church Lane. Does anyone know?
To have housed my ancestors the house had to be there in the 1790s.
7
Somerset / FreeReg record. How did the transcriber know?
« on: Tuesday 08 November 22 14:49 GMT (UK) »
Hello again.
I have just found the record in Seavington St Mary parish records for 1791 of the marriage of John Poole and Hannah Rowsell.
Looked at my notes and found that I'd recorded this marriage - plus the two witnesses (one of whom could help prove a point). But I can't see any mention of witnesses in the actual record (indeed I've trawled through many pages of the parish records and not seen any witnesses for anything mentioned as yet.)
I wondered if the FreeReg entry, where I almost certainly saw this marriage first, was based on Bishop's Transcripts - but no, it clearly says "Parish Register".
So where did the witness information come from? And is it at all reliable do you think?
I have just found the record in Seavington St Mary parish records for 1791 of the marriage of John Poole and Hannah Rowsell.
Looked at my notes and found that I'd recorded this marriage - plus the two witnesses (one of whom could help prove a point). But I can't see any mention of witnesses in the actual record (indeed I've trawled through many pages of the parish records and not seen any witnesses for anything mentioned as yet.)
I wondered if the FreeReg entry, where I almost certainly saw this marriage first, was based on Bishop's Transcripts - but no, it clearly says "Parish Register".
So where did the witness information come from? And is it at all reliable do you think?
8
Somerset / I'm probably being thick! FindMyPast disappointment
« on: Saturday 29 October 22 18:18 BST (UK) »
I've been researching my maternal side since 2009, quite successfully. I have used all the free online databases, national archives for wills and other documents and joined TheGenealogist for a good year. Yesterday, because I want to tie up some loose ends - and I had seen on FamilySearch that "images" of various BMDs are available on FindMyPast, I took out a three month subscription to the latter site (I've already used it frequently as a signed-in "visitor").
My first search was to see the actual record of the baptism in 1767 (18th October, born 7th August) of Simon Joseph Pool(e), my 3xggrandfather's younger brother (and a twin to Mary). He was baptised in Seavington St Michael and his baptism record is usually transcribed as "Simon" though my 3xggrandfather, baptised 2 years earlier was Simeon ! As you can see the child of 1767 was also Joseph (which name he used when he was married in Chillington in 1800).
So, I just wanted to see for myself that his baptism record called him Simon, or perhaps Simon Joseph (parents Thomas and Honor) - the vicar's mistake perhaps because there was a 2-year old running around called Simeon!
But the "image" on FindMyPast is only the transcription and I'm disappointed - unless I'm missing something...
Can anyone clarify for me?
My first search was to see the actual record of the baptism in 1767 (18th October, born 7th August) of Simon Joseph Pool(e), my 3xggrandfather's younger brother (and a twin to Mary). He was baptised in Seavington St Michael and his baptism record is usually transcribed as "Simon" though my 3xggrandfather, baptised 2 years earlier was Simeon ! As you can see the child of 1767 was also Joseph (which name he used when he was married in Chillington in 1800).
So, I just wanted to see for myself that his baptism record called him Simon, or perhaps Simon Joseph (parents Thomas and Honor) - the vicar's mistake perhaps because there was a 2-year old running around called Simeon!
But the "image" on FindMyPast is only the transcription and I'm disappointed - unless I'm missing something...
Can anyone clarify for me?
9
Somerset / Looking for Giles Poole's death
« on: Saturday 08 October 22 18:42 BST (UK) »
Giles Poole was one of my 3x great grandfather's younger brothers.
He was born in 1772, baptised in Seavington St Michael in January 1773.
He married Betty Will(e)y 1796 in Kingsbury Episcopi.
Their 6 children were all baptised at Middle Lambrook Meeting House between 1797 and 1806 and the parents are recorded as "Giles Poole and his wife Betty of Seavington St Michael" - but I have perhaps wrongly assumed that they settled in Kingsbury Episcopi since Middle Lambrook is part of that parish.
I am fairly sure they stayed in Somerset but I can find no record of Giles' death anywhere, nor any census record so presumably he died before 1841.
I don't know much about Betty, yet. An Elizabeth Poole aged 76 is recorded in the 1851 census as a widow living in Kingstone, and born Stocklinch Magdalen. Could be Betty or any number of other married Poole wives/widows in the area.
I suspect that MY Betty is the daughter of George and Sarah Willey baptised at Drayton in 1778 but haven't confirmed it.
Giles and Betty's second child was called George. (Their first was Mary possibly named after an aunt/godmother/maternal great grandmother, the third was Betty (after mother) then came Thomas (after paternal grandfather) then Giles (after father) and lastly John (after an uncle perhaps)
Can anyone find a reliable death or burial for Giles?
Thanks in advance.
He was born in 1772, baptised in Seavington St Michael in January 1773.
He married Betty Will(e)y 1796 in Kingsbury Episcopi.
Their 6 children were all baptised at Middle Lambrook Meeting House between 1797 and 1806 and the parents are recorded as "Giles Poole and his wife Betty of Seavington St Michael" - but I have perhaps wrongly assumed that they settled in Kingsbury Episcopi since Middle Lambrook is part of that parish.
I am fairly sure they stayed in Somerset but I can find no record of Giles' death anywhere, nor any census record so presumably he died before 1841.
I don't know much about Betty, yet. An Elizabeth Poole aged 76 is recorded in the 1851 census as a widow living in Kingstone, and born Stocklinch Magdalen. Could be Betty or any number of other married Poole wives/widows in the area.
I suspect that MY Betty is the daughter of George and Sarah Willey baptised at Drayton in 1778 but haven't confirmed it.
Giles and Betty's second child was called George. (Their first was Mary possibly named after an aunt/godmother/maternal great grandmother, the third was Betty (after mother) then came Thomas (after paternal grandfather) then Giles (after father) and lastly John (after an uncle perhaps)
Can anyone find a reliable death or burial for Giles?
Thanks in advance.