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Andy

It's good that you are not upset finding out what you've found so far. I'm sure that not everyone in your circumstances is so well-balanced.

I am no expert on DNA analysis but as an amateur genealogist since 2004 I've felt that it is the detective work that comprises much of the fun for me and I've found so many things about my own ancestors that I never imagined when I first started.

DNA tests are only half the picture. To be any use you also need to do the family tree legwork and in this case it means assembling trees for people who are matched to you or to examine any trees they have already prepared (and of course to check them). You need to try to find out who your common ancestors are and work downwards to see who was likely to be in the right place and of the right age to be your likely genetic father. Basic things like remembering that if your match is clearly a 1st cousin, you share grandparents with them, so who are the grandparents? If you are likely to be second cousins you share great grandparents etc.

But you probably know all that. Even so, my basic message is that you have to do the "legwork" to couple it to your DNA matches.

Good luck with it all.

Well, my mother's side seems all good. Oddly enough, I have DNA matches to people who would be on my father's side but I cannot find links to via my mother. But when both sides of your family come from a relatively small area, then there's a multitude of reasons that could be. Especially if my biological father has family in the same areas too.

If I toss out everything that I thought I knew about my father's side, then I can build a reasonable amount of my closest match's family tree based on the conversations we have had and information I can find online. I can also build very partial parts of the family tree of the people in Ireland, I just cannot find the person who connects the two.

And, obviously, I'm also not 100% certain of the nature of my relationship to this person.

I have the details of the closes matches in a spreadsheet now, including notes on who they are related to - or how I suspect people might be related. I tried the Leeds method as suggested but there is either not enough data to make it work, or I am not fully understanding how it is meant to work.

Hi Andy,

There is a DNA tool called "What Are The Odds?" I don't know if you've tried it...

You can use it to create a tree with various branches & input shared DNA cM values.
It then generates hypotheses as to where your most likely position in the tree is.

https://dnapainter.com/tools/probability

Thank you - I'll go and have a look.

Your post suggests that you and your match's two close relatives are from her grandmother's family, is that right? Or is that uncertain.

In so far as I know, yes. But logically, if the grandmother is Irish, then presumably her brother's would be Irish too - either by birth or ethnicity. If one of those grandfathers also had children in Ireland, that could explain why I have such close matches in both the UK and Ireland, right?

And it might also explain why the estimates of 1st cousin once removed keeps popping up?

It's not impossible the younger uncle was my father - but I do know that my mother's taste was generally in older men. Not necessarily massively older, but that's what I know of my father, step-father, and the partners she had between the two. Although I suppose that some younger teens do look older than they are. And she herself was only 19 at the time.

Her mother is doing a DNA test so I guess we can narrow this down pretty quickly:

If younger uncle was my father, the mother will be my aunt.
If uncle's father was my father, she'll be a half-sibling.

If it's another relationship, I guess I might have to go back to the drawing board.

Quote from: AndyH81 on Wednesday 08 December 21 17:49 GMT (UK)

I do know that the grandmother of my highest match lived on the same street as my own grandparents at about the same time.

It seems more than a coincidence i.e. do you know what children the g/parents had & with such high cMs, is it possible your match may be a half sibling?

Annie

The only child I know for certain the grandparents had was the mother of my closest match. I suppose it's possible she might transpire to be a half-sibling. She's going to do a DNA test, but I have no idea when... after Christmas, I guess.

I know the following facts about the match's family:

Her grandmother was born in Ireland and is the connection to the Irish family.
Her grandmother has 2 sisters and at least 3 brothers, but the brothers are all dead. If we assumed the suggestion of 1st cousin once removed, then it would be one of those brothers (most likely) who would be my dad.
Her grandfather was adopted and isn't sure of his heritage - although they do know his family are from the same town I am from. I don't know whether this is his adopted family or biological; I assumed the former.
The grandparents had two children (that I know of): her mother and her uncle. Her uncle died when he was 15 in a crash in my home town the year I was born. I did the maths in my head and I don't think there's any chance at all he could be my father, so I completely ruled him out as a possibility.

We're both pulling our hair out as we feel like the answer must be staring both of us in the face but we're missing it.

Now, as for my 2nd and 3rd closest match -

2nd -

We have a 5.4% DNA match (379.1 cMs). MyHeritage estimates we have a 1st cousin once removed/2nd cousin relationship. To the best of my understanding, he is in Ireland and is part of the larger Irish family. According to my closest match, she has the same estimated relationship to him that I do.

3rd -

We have a 5% DNA match (375 cMs). Ancestry estimates we would have a 1st/2nd cousin relationship. She is in Ireland and has the same surname as my 2nd closest match, but I have no idea what their relationship is to each other. I've done my own research but cannot find that information and the information available to me on these other peoples' public trees doesn't provide that info. either... although that could be because they're all still living so the information is hidden by default.

Okay... is there anyone here I could just send a spreadsheet too or something? Let me know what details you need, and I am happy to do it that way. I'd just assumed people would need to have the DNA file itself. Any volunteers???

Sorry, I really never intended to sound ungrateful for the offer, I'm just a little bit cagey about that kind of stuff because I want to know exactly how 'me' is being used, by whom, and where.

Having spoken more with the closest match, it seems it is possible that one of her grandfathers is a candidate for my biological father. I believe he would be English, but his wife was born in Ireland and would be the connection to the Irish family (I think!). Unfortunately these men have all since passed away quite young, is my understanding.

Her mother is going to do a DNA test too, so that (by rights) should highlight what relationship her mother and I have - which I assume will narrow down the search in a relatively major way.

I am also working on the assumption that there might be more half-siblings out there too, depending on circumstances.