Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.

Messages - crb83

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 ... 15
Westmeath / Looking for KILLANE from CARN & RATHDUFF (for possible Y-DNA research)
« on: Wednesday 17 February 21 19:29 GMT (UK)  »
I'm looking for any Killanes from the Rathduff area to see if there is a possible interest in doing Y-chromosome DNA comparison.

I'm a McLain, whose family came from the Moate-Clara area. For a long time I've taken the surname for what it's attributed to (Scottish MacGiollaEain), but not only does YDNA indicate these people were originally Connachta and in Westmeath since at least the 13th century (via a timeframe of a Gorry match from Westmeath) but as I dug up more and more records, there seems to be the larger and larger possibility that the name was originally Mac Cilleain, and I've found multiple instances of "Clane" or "Killane" families in the area adding or dropping a Mac prefix.

"Cilleain" was a diminutive name for "Cillin" and the accepted surname that Killane is attributed to is O'Cillin which seems to have several variants (Killeen, Kelleen, Killean, Killane, Killean).

The reason I am looking for a Killane from Rathduff is that the family that was (or maybe still is) around Rathduff was managing to hold on to ancestral land and descended from the O'Cillin that were here over 400 years ago and had managed to stay in the same place unlike most other people constantly moving, so it eliminates the coincidence of a similar surname in the area.  The townlands around Rathduff itself (especially Carn and Ballymurry) were all part of the territory of "Calry" under the Magawley.   The 1659 census shows that one of the principal names of Ballyloughloe parish was KILLEEN with 5 families present.  It is likely they were inhabiting this area of Rathduff/surrounding farms.  A 1600 pardon list notes "Nich. O'Killine of the Karne" being pardoned among the Magawleys.  The Moate Quaker congregation records note a "James McLane of Ballymurry" attending meetings 1770-78. Records from 1826 through the 1911 census show a James Killane family farming at least 16 acres in Rathduff (Often spelled Clane , Clain, Kellane, but mostly Killane).  These three surnames all on practically adjoining townlands, which were in Magawley hands into the 1660s point to an original medieval gaelic tenancy of the O'Cillin family.  Also closer to Clara where my ancestors pop up in 1770 is a James Killeen in Cloghatanny, then a decade later an Andrew McClane in Cloghatanny, who names a son James, and then goes by the surname "Clane" for some time.

Earliest odd variations of spellings of my ancestors surname in parish registers like "Mc Elean, McClene, and MacKlaine" may be more coincidences of Mac Cilleain.

My working theory at this time is that either there was a variant surname of MacCillin (-eain) existing at the same time as O'Cillin (-eain) or that during the 17th century there may have been an anglicization where after the O-prefix had dropped, a part of this family added a "Mac" prefix either during a temporary resurgence of the irish language or they had moved into a predominantly Irish speaking area.

If any Westmeath folks know of this family and think they would be interesting in participating in a Y-DNA test or at least comparing some research, I would be grateful for you getting in touch.  Thank you!

Chris McLain Beal

Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Re: 1828 Irish Tithe Applotment Books Entry
« on: Saturday 07 November 20 20:47 GMT (UK)  »
Please disregard my post...apart from th representative bit.

Found a better mag glass and agree with first reply.

And thankyou for looking for yours I think I have now found where mine came from before Offally.
Been so so long searching! Did not know about tithe appt books.

Thanks everyone for your input. Lola, I've been slowly able to put together a pre-famine farming cluster with the tithe applotment books. However theres no soundex searches, I definitely recommend a lot of wildcards (*)

Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / 1828 Irish Tithe Applotment Books Entry
« on: Saturday 07 November 20 18:04 GMT (UK)  »
I have been trying to figure out the exact name here in this entry in the Tithe Applotment Books in Ireland.
Place: Ballybroder, Durrow Parish, Co. Westmeath (but listed under King's Co.)
Time: 1828

Context: I have been investigating the possibility that my McLain ancestors in this area were an extreme anglicization of O'Laineaghain or O'Laineaghnain, an ecclesiastical family around Durrow abbey, associated with the Mageoghegans.  This surname had another extreme case of anglicization to Lynan and Lynam (an attempt to pass as Leinster English Linehams). There are two Lynam farms above this surname, which at first glance looks like "McLuire" but could very well be McLuine, McLeein(e), etc.  It looks like it was either written more hastily or by a different person, as the "L" character is a little different.

Link to the actual record:  You can manually go forward or backward in this parishes pages via the link (i.e. changing 307.pdf to 306 or 308 etc.)

Thank you for any insight!


Ireland / Commissioning Research for some very specific times/records/locations
« on: Thursday 15 October 20 00:01 BST (UK)  »
Good evening all, there's not much left to search in avenues of research for me except for a few specific record sets so i'm not exactly interested in the broad introductory research packages.  I am looking for a genealogist to search a few decades of parish records at the RCB library as well as Tholsell Court records (so it would work out for someone close to Dublin city since it's not all that much to search). If anyone can point me in the right direction, it would be much appreciated!


Ireland / Gaelic gentry in the late medieval period
« on: Tuesday 22 September 20 21:03 BST (UK)  »
Lately I've been getting into the Tudor Fiants and compiling notes for my surname around Breifne and the midlands.  I'm wondering what really constituted a "gentleman", especially among surnames that were not part of a leading sept.  For instance in a fiant from 1570, a James M'Clyne of Rathinmore (Rahinmore, Co. Westmeath) is listed as a gentleman among the Mageoghegans.  I hate to assume things, but would it be fair to assume that he probably had a maternal connection to the Mageoghegans and became an heir to the land he was on?

"Pardon to Conly Mageoghegan of Donowre, gentleman and chief of his name; Brian Mageoghegan of the same, gentleman; Thomas O'Brynan of Adamstowne, gentleman; Johanna his wife; Thady and Mortagh O'Brynan his sons; James M'Clyne, gentleman, of Rathinmore; Phelim M'Geoghegan of Donowre, gentleman; Donogh M'Goghegan of Kennaghe, kern; and Ferrall m'Fiagh M'Goghegan of the same, kern."

Most likely there was probably some Maclean gallowglass presence around Moycashel barony much earlier when the Mageoghegan was much more powerful than in this period (likely 1350-1450). Although chieftains did billet their mercenaries on very good land, I dont think they would have given them title unless it was their descendants had some blood connection after some time. But thats just a theory of mine.

Rahinmore (An Raithin Mor: the great little ringfort) is a 172-acre townland in the parish of Newtown, Moycashel b., Co. Westmeath. In the 1655 Down Survey maps it appears that it's part of Cominstowne (526 acres) under Thos Geoghegan, who is later listed as people transported under the Cromwellian Resettlement Acts.

Good morning, Longford Forum. I have been researching my Macleans in Ireland for quite some time. Our YDNA shows we are native to the Breifne/midlands area. I had long attributed this surname there to a gallowglass family who were in Cavan over 500 years ago, but I may have stumbled across something else that leads me in another direction.

 Yesterday I was doing some searching and trying to find if estate rolls existed for an ancestor's 12 acre holding in Kildardon, Co. Longford (Forgney p., Shrule b.).  I was on because they list textual records of townlands with sources on how the spelling of the name has changed over time (maps, patent rolls etc).  I saw that Kildordan was mentioned in the Elizabethan Fiants in 1602.  So getting into the fiants, I find the occupier being pardoned, one Donnell Og O'Farrell.  But around him in the same list of pardons were several MacGiollaChlaoins.  (Donnell M'Gillecleyne of Castlerea, Tho. M'Gillakleyne, gent., of Mornin).   I knew the surname Cleen/Clyne/Cleyne was around this area but had no idea what it had anglicized from (Pender's Census: 6 "Cleene" families in Ardagh b.). actually lists "Cleene" as an anglicization of Maclean but due to me finding only Cleens in Ardagh, and 1 Maclean family around Edgeworthstown, I disregarded this, as it did not seem like a family cluster that was originally "Maclean".   It turns out that this "M'Gillecleyne" surname originated in Northeastern Roscommon near Lough Kilglass and anglicized there to "Kilcline" but in Longford it largely anglicized to Clyne/Cleene.  I found that in a Connaught dialect, the word Claon is pronounced "Clee-uhn".   

I did find another fiant quite some time ago of a James M'Lyne in McGeoghegan country in 1570 (southern westmeath).  Did I catch M'Gillecleyne mid-anglicization to something other than Clyne?
Did some of the M'Gillecleynes anglicize to M'Cleyne and then M'Clane?

I think in order for my theory to hold water, I need to find some Cleene/Clyne folks and see if we are paternally related.  If anyone here knows any in Longford (I believe there could also be Clynes from Scotland anglicized from something else, so I am specifically looking for a Longford paper trail), please send me a message, I would love to get in touch.

Chris McLain Beal

Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition / Symbol in 1820s Tithe Applotment books
« on: Tuesday 07 July 20 17:37 BST (UK)  »
I'm wondering if anyone can tell me what this is. I'm leaning towards "& Co." but i'm not exactly sure what that would mean or why it would be on here. These are from Tully, Co. Cavan and Ardegullion, Co. Longford tithe applotments. As they were 5+ years apart, the Alexander in question may be the same person (Ardegullion is 20km from Tully)

Westmeath / Hearth Money Rolls for Mullingar
« on: Monday 06 July 20 15:18 BST (UK)  »
"Tracing your Irish Ancestors" has Mullingar's 1660s Hearth Money Rolls as published in the Journal for the Franciscan College in 1950.  I cannot find for the life of me where this is held, or if it has been published elsewhere. Has anyone been successful in finding this 17th century substitute for this large parish of Mullingar?


Cavan / Seeking McGoverns for Y-chromosome DNA Group
« on: Thursday 09 April 20 20:11 BST (UK)  »
Good afternoon/evening to County Cavan researchers.  I am the administrator of the McGovern YDNA group on FamilyTreeDNA   
I have been the admin for almost 2 years, and took over after a long period of time where there hadnt been much updating or testing, and only a handful of McGoverns are active members that have tested 67 markers or better on the Y-chromosome. I figured I would spread the word here in case any McGoverns were considering doing DNA research but did not know where to start or how to go about it.  The Y-chromosome tests track your direct paternal origins, unlike the ethnicity tests/autosomal DNA tests which are only reliable for 4-6 generations which most of these big companies are pushing.  FamilyTreeDNA has the best and most up to date testing (BigY700) for this. It would have to be a male McGovern in your family doing the test.  If anyone has any questions, would like to participate, you can reply or message me directly. 

Thank you!

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 ... 15