Author Topic: NICOL family  (Read 8049 times)

Offline Lhconstantino

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Re: NICOL family
« Reply #27 on: Monday 09 December 19 19:14 GMT (UK) »
How likely is it for there not to be a baptismal record for a child? I have baptismal records for 8 children of George Kyd and Ann Gibson. Ann Kyd who married George Duncan Sr is not one of them. Yet, in 1841, George Duncan Jr was living with Ann Gibson Kyd and he was referred to in 1881 as the nephew of Isabella Nicol Kyd, wife of Ann Gibson Kyd's son Joseph. If Ann Kyd Duncan were another child of Ann Gibson Kyd, it would explain both the 1841 and 1881 records.

Offline Forfarian

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Re: NICOL family
« Reply #28 on: Monday 09 December 19 20:13 GMT (UK) »
How likely is it for there not to be a baptismal record for a child?
It's fairly common. Estimates of the proportion missing range from 10% to 30% or even more. It is commoner in towns and cities than in rural areas.

Quote
I have baptismal records for 8 children of George Kyd and Ann Gibson. Ann Kyd who married George Duncan Sr is not one of them. Yet, in 1841, George Duncan Jr was living with Ann Gibson Kyd and he was referred to in 1881 as the nephew of Isabella Nicol Kyd, wife of Ann Gibson Kyd's son Joseph. If Ann Kyd Duncan were another child of Ann Gibson Kyd, it would explain both the 1841 and 1881 records.
It's difficult without the actual ages from the 1851 or later censuses.

However.

George Kydd and Ann Gibson had
George, baptised 16 March 1795
Margaret, baptised 11 February 1797
John, baptised 27 September 1799
Jane, baptised 10 October 1801
Joseph, baptised 27 April 1804
James, baptised 20 May 1809
Beatrix, baptised 16 October 1813

and in the 1841 census in Keptie Street, Arbroath are
Agnes Kydd, 70
George Kydd, 40
Margaret Kydd, 25
John Kydd, 35
James Kydd, 25
Betsy Kydd, 25
George Duncan, 12

The names Agnes and Ann can be interchangeable, and Betsy can be short for Beatrice as well as for Elizabeth. By census day George would have been 45, Margaret 44, John 41, James 31 and Beatrix 28. So although the actual ages are a bit out, apart from Betsy, the order is right so I think this could be Ann Gibson or Kydd. (In Scotland we don't use xxx yyy zzz when xxx is a woman's given name, yyy her maiden surname and zzz her husband's name. We use xxx yyy or zzz, then it is clear that yyy is her maiden surname and not a middle name.)

George Duncan, aged 12, is exactly the right age to be the son of George Duncan Sr and Ann Kydd or Duncan, who was baptised on 18 September 1828.

There's a family in Helen Street, Arbroath, consisting of George Duncan, brewer, 45; Ann Duncan, 30, and James Duncan, 11. James, baptised 16 November 1830, son of George Duncan and Ann Kydd or Duncan, would not quite have been 11 on census day 1841, but only a few months off. So if this is the right couple, and if Ann's age is accurate, she would have been born between 1806 and 1811. There do seem to be gaps in the family of George Kydd and Ann Gibson or Kydd after 1805 long enough for there to have been another child.

So it is certainly possible, and given that young George is in the household of Agnes Kydd, who is probably Ann Gibson or Kydd, it looks reasonable to suppose that he is a grandson and therefore that Ann Kydd or Duncan is a daughter of George Kydd and Ann Gibson or Kydd. But I don't know how you could prove it!

Researching

AITKENHEAD, Lanarkshire; BINNY, Forfar; BLACK, New Monkland; BRYSON, Cumbernauld; BURGESS, North-East Scotland; CRUICKSHANK, Rothes; DALLAS, Botriphnie; DAVIDSON, Oyne; GUTHRIE, Angus; HOGG, Larbert; LESLIE, Rothes/Mortlach; MENDUM, England; MOLLISON, Lethnot; PATERSON, Larbert; RHIND, Forfar; SANG, Scotland; SCOTT, East Kilbride; STOR(R)I/E/Y, Shotts; THORNTON, Shotts; WADDELL, New Monkland; WILKIE, New Monkland; WILKIE, Tannadice; WYLLIE, Angus; YOUNG, Keith

Offline Lhconstantino

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Re: NICOL family
« Reply #29 on: Tuesday 10 December 19 08:17 GMT (UK) »
Again, extraordinarily helpful information. I'll respond more later, but just found something in the US records that I want to pursue before I do. Be back shortly.Gratefully, Laurie