1841 BYRNE look up

[genna]

Hi Spikeholden

Welcome to Rootschat. It's some time since I looked at the Byrne family as I came to a full stop in not being able to find them together in the 1861 census. Francis and Paul have been especially problematical as the only details I could be reasonably sure of was their baptisms. I haven't gone to the expense of ordering a birth certificate for either of them as they're not direct ancestors.

I can't help with the errors on the Canvey family tree as the link I had no longer works and I am not signed up with myheritage.

It will be interesting to see the details on Francis Byrne's birth certifcate. Without the certificate how can you be sure of a connection with the family of Joseph and Elizabeth Byrne 

All the best, Genna

[Spikeholden]

Hi Genna

The Canvey family tree site is now back up - it was down for years:

http://freepages.rootsweb.com/~canvey/genealogy/index_files/Page19631.htm

The myhertitage site you should be able to see my family tree without an account I think.

Ill share the birth certificate when I get it.  I have Edward John Byrne's marriage certificate - it shows Francis John Byrne as his father as a police constable.

[genna]

Hi Spikeholden

I've had a quick check for marriages and there's a marriage of John Byrne to Catherine/Catharine Quintan/Quinlon 21 Apr 1839 in Liverpool. According to FamilySearch they appear to have had several children but not all are showing up on the GRO site. I've found searching for anyone with the surname Byrne a bit of a nightmare because of all the name variations so all the best with your search. I'll check out the canvey site shortly.

Regards Genna

[Spikeholden]

Yes not to mention the typos of the surname in the census records!  I found one under Payne after searching for ages.  Myheritage fortunately has scans so you can check the original. 

So there is a question as to whether Francis John Byrne is the same Francis Byrne appearing with the Joseph Byrne family.

So I have the 1908 marriage certificate showing Edward John Delve 19 years old recorded as an Electrician marrying Llian Delve in St Pancras with father Francis John Byrne (police constable).  Looking at the 1911 census, I have (Edward) John Byrne with his wife and daughter, with him being recorded as being born in St Pancras and working as a carman.   The 1939 census has an Edward J Byrne living with Delves, born 7 May 1889 and working as a railway porter.

According to GRO there is an Edward Byrne born in St Pancras in 1889 (mother's maiden name Booke).  I'll request this.

The 1901 census has an Edward Byrne born c1890 in Liverpool with a father of Francis Byrne.  So this Edward is born in Liverpool so perhaps its a coincidence that Francis is also a police office.  This is perhaps where the Canvey researcher made a link.  But the evidence above suggests this is a different Edward/Francis

Now interestingly I originally had Edward's father as Edward Byrne married to a Blanche Booker.  According to the 1891 census, Edward (born in Ireland) was a police constable and their son Edward J Byrne was born c 1890.  Of course, the name doesnt match up with the Francis John as the father on the wedding certificate.  Edward J Byrne also is in the 1901 census with father Edward T/J/F Byrne (police constable) and mother Blanche.

More digging required....the joy of genealogy!

[genna]

Hi Spikeholden

I've now looked at the Canvey site and don't think the Byrne family of Macclesfield and Liverpool are connected to your Edward John and Edward Francis Byrne.

There is a marriage of Blanche Flower Booker to Edward Francis Byrne registered at Westminster in 1885. I think your original thought that they are the most likely candidates as being Edward John's parents is correct. The birth of Edward Byrne registered in 1889, Pancras, is quite probably your Edward John Byrne. If you're interested there are a small number of public family trees on A* relating to Blanche and Edward Byrne but they're not entirely accurate.

Good luck and all the best, Genna

[Spikeholden]

Hello again!

I have the birth certificate for Francis.  Yes this is a match to the John Byrne (labourer) and Catherine Quinland (unclear) you found.  He was born on 4 July 1849 at 44 Freemason St? Liverpool.  Im still waiting for the other birth certificate. 

[genna]

Hi, since I last posted I've found a baptism for Francis Byrne b 16 Sept 1849 bapt 25 Oct 1849 at St Anthonys, Liverpool. Parents Joseph and Elizabeth. The birth registration still eludes me! The is also a marriage of Francis Byrne to Annie Shiel in 1881 West Derby (Liverpool) together with details of a Catholic marriage of Francis Byrne, son of Joseph, to Ann(ie) Sheil. Both her first and surname have various spellings. In 1901 Francis and Annie together with several children including Edward b 1890 are living at 50 Windermere Street, Everton, Liverpool. According to the baptismal entry Edward was b 18 Sept 1889 and bapt 26 Sept 1889 at All Saints, Liverpool. Parents Francis Byrne and Anne Shiel. This Edward enlisted in the Royal Navy on 18 Sept 1907, Occupation Baker so not your Edward. In 1911 Francis and his wife, now listed as Anastasia, are still living in Liverpool at 10 Abbey Road, Cabbage Hall.

Here's hoping the Edward Byrne b. St Pancras is yours,

Regards Genna

[Spikeholden]

ok - I got hold of Edward J's birth certificate.  This has the same birthday of 7 May 1889 as the 1939 census.  The parents are Edward Francis Byrne and Blanche Booke(r) which I had originally.  Edward is a police constable.  The address on the marriage certificate of 1908 also matches the family address of 1901 (something I overlooked earlier).  I have all the census records and they seem to match as Edward leaves and marries. 

The only odd thing is that the father's name on the marriage certificate is listed as Francis John Byrne (police constable) which led me down the wrong path (and probably the person who researched on the 'canvey' website).  Edward appears on the 1911 census with Blanche (as a police pensioner) so he is still alive. 

Given it seems clear who Edward J's father is, its not vital and may just remain a mystery - perhaps Edward F went by the name Francis that day!

I have previously tracked Blanche's history so I have restored this in my tree.  I have drawn a blank with Edward Francis Byrne (born in Loughrea, Ireland c1853).   I guess I need that marriage certificate next...

Thanks for all the help, and sorry we arent related!  I was quite proud of the Everton link as well....

[Spikeholden]

So I have Edwards and Blanche's marriage certificate (1885).  Unfortunately it has Edward's age as "full".  He is listed as a railway clerk.  His father is a Patrick Byrne, a Professor of Languages, deceased.  The address for Edward and Blanche is the same.  I cant find any more records on Patrick, so looks like a dead end.