Author Topic: Cornish Mystery  (Read 119654 times)

Offline deb usa

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Cornish Mystery
« on: Saturday 11 March 06 20:16 GMT (UK) »
Hi all

Recently, I decided to try to trace some ancestors through my maternal line...thinking that it might be easier...NOt lol

I started with my gr grandmother Bessie Elizabeth Palmer (born abt 1877 in Truro...she married William Penfold)... her parents were John and Mary Palmer (nee Smith ) married in Truro 1876.

I found Mary Smith (Palmer) with her parents and siblings in the 1861 census:

George Smith b abt 1802 in London
Amelia Smith b 1816 in Falmouth
children:
Ann b abt 1842
William b abt 1844
Amelia b 1851
George 1853
James b abt 1855 
MARY b 1858 (this is my Mary who married John Palmer)

I couldn't find them before that , so with some great help , we managed to locate them , still in Truro in 1851  but under the name Slack!!!!!
Amelia Slack b 1816 Falmouth
George Slack b 1811 London
Ann b 1842 Truro
William b 1844 Truro
Amelia

Marriage info says that George Slack married Amelia Knoriton in march 1842 in Truro.......

 As I am following the female line... my next hurdle is finding out Amelia Knoriton/Slack/Smiths parents.... the confusing thing is that there  is absolutely no KNORITON name to be found other than the reference to it in the marriage details of 1842. I have tried the surname every which way...Norton, Noriton< Knerton, Knaugton etc etc...with no luck.
 
I am hoping someone can solve this for me and maybe the mystery of the change of name from Slack to Smith.
 
I have not yet had a chance to order this marriage cert...but I am thinking that it may be the only way possible to find out the fathers name...

Hoping to hear from you soon

Thanks

Deb  :)


Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Valda

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Re: CORNISH MYSTERY
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 11 March 06 21:37 GMT (UK) »
The entry in the civil registration is clearly typed and reads Knortton. Not much help because that clearly isn't a surname either.

Regards

Valda
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline deb usa

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Re: CORNISH MYSTERY
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 12 March 06 01:12 GMT (UK) »
Valda
thanks for even responding... my whole message seems like a mystery and now Knortton...even more confusing...do you think cert is the only way to go....

i wonder who amelia was.....
thanks for looking ...i do appreciate your quick response
 deb:)
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Valda

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Re: CORNISH MYSTERY
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 12 March 06 10:21 GMT (UK) »
I do think the certificate is the only way to go. Without it you don't have George's father's name and occupation either or the witnesses and the exact place of marriage.
Coming forward on the censuses

1871 census RG10 2283 folio 43
St Mary Truro  Cornwall   
George Smith 68  London City, Middlesex, Head  Married Hawker
Amelia Smith 55  Kenwyn, Cornwall, Wife Married
James Smith 15  St Mary, Cornwall, Son   farm Labourer 
Mary Smith 12  St Mary, Cornwall, Daughter

1881 census RG11 2312 folio 50
Charles St, Kenwyn, Truro Cornwall
Amelia Smith 66 Truro, Cornwall, Head  Widow
Elizabeth Palmer 4  Truro, Cornwall,  Granddaughter   

1891 census RG12 1830 folio 46
No 4 Hoskins? Court Kenwyn  Cornwall 
Amalia Smith 75 Truro, Cornwall, Head  Widow
Annie Palmer 10 Truro, Cornwall, Granddaughter 

Deaths Sep 1894
Smith  Amelia  78  Truro  5c 85

So she remains pretty consistent about her age.

Georges death is the more interesting of the two. I could find no George Smith deaths registered Truro between 1871 and 1881 so tried Slack.

Deaths Mar 1872
SLACK  George  69  Truro  5c 118

which is consistent with George's age on most censuses.

Slack and Truro on FreeBMD gives you these entries between 1837 and 1872.

Marriages Mar 1842
SLACK  George    Truro  9 363   
Births Dec 1842
Slack  Ann     Truro  9 312   
Births Dec 1844
SLACK  William Henry     Truro  9 *17   
Births Dec 1846
Slack  Amelia     Truro  9 326   
Deaths Jun 1848
Slack  Amelia     Truro  9 200   
Births Mar 1849
Slack  Amelia     Truro  9 369   
Births Mar 1852
Slack  George     Truro  5c 200   
Births Sep 1858
Slack  Mary     Truro  5c 180   
Births Dec 1861
SLACK  Emma Barton     Truro  5c 167   
Births Mar 1867
SLACK  William Francis B     Truro  5c 169   
Deaths Sep 1870
Slack  Emma Burton  8  Truro  5c 110   
Slack  Francis Bassett  3  Truro  5c 110   
Deaths Mar 1872
SLACK  George  69  Truro  5c 118

Having checked the censuses for Cornwall 1851 to 1881 Slack is a surname virtually unknown in Cornwall apart from your family in 1851. After the 1872 death entry there are no further Slack entries on FreeBMD in Truro (checked up to 1901) so it is reasonable to assume that these Truro Slack entries on FreeBMD are all in someway connected with your family.

Doing the same with the IGI you get
ANN SLACK
Christening: 06 SEP 1844 Truro, Cornwall
JAMES SLACK
Christening: 31 OCT 1855 Truro, Cornwall
MARY SLACK
Christening: 30 AUG 1858 Truro, Cornwall

all the children of George and Amelia and a singleton Slack in 1826 in a different place which probably has no connection.

George's occupation on the 1851 census is coachbuilder journeyman. Journeyman indicates he didn't have his own established business but nevertheless indicates he was a craftsman. This is very different from being a hawker on the later censuses. So it would appear something occurred between 1851 and 1861 that meant the family changed its surname from Slack to Smith at least on an everyday basis (you can call yourself any name you wish to) and finally completely to Smith after the death of George.

On the 1861 census George gives Holborn as his place of birth within London.
There is on the IGI a possible baptism at Holborn at roughly the right time, considering he moves his age around a bit.

GEORGE SLACK   
Christening:  29 DEC 1803   Saint Andrew, Holborn, London
Father:  WILLIAM SLACK
Mother:  ANN 

in all three children were baptised at the same time which doesn't mean triplets, just the family was a little lax in getting their children baptised - and therefore the George baptism could indicate an earlier birth as only one of the children is likely to have been born circa 1803.

JOHN SLACK
Christening: 29 DEC 1803 Saint Andrew, Holborn, London,
CHARLES SLACK
Christening: 29 DEC 1803 Saint Andrew, Holborn, London

with a later possible at St Pancras who might be the son of a different William and Ann

WILLIAM FRANCIS SLACK 
Christening:  04 AUG 1816   Old Church, Saint Pancras, London
Father:  WILLIAM SLACK 
Mother:  ANN   

I can't see any of these as likely siblings on the 1851 census and besides you would really need George's marriage certificate for details about his father to see if this is a likely line or not.

I have done a search on the IGI for all Amelias baptised in Cornwall on the index (which of course has far from complete coverage) and can see no Amelia with a surname anything like Knortton (of course she could have had a baptism earlier or later than I checked). The marriage certificate should give further information - she might even have been a widow for instance! - which hopefully would make looking for her alot easier, but is probably just wishful thinking.

Regards

Valda
 

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline deb usa

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Re: CORNISH MYSTERY
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 12 March 06 16:14 GMT (UK) »
Hi Valda

WOW!!!!!!!!! I am speechless...your info is absolutely fabulous and i really would like to say a big 'thank you' for your time and effort.
i need to let it all sink in...lol
i will definitely order the marriage cert of George and Amelia.... the Knorrton name is driving me crazy.... hopefully on the cert her fathers name might reveal the correct spelling.
Once again thank you sooo much ...I will keep you updated, and hopefully if you have or find anything else you will let me know.

Take care
deb
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline goggy

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Re: Cornish Mystery
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 01 April 06 04:36 BST (UK) »
Just a thought,and you have probably had before I did!
Could the 'K'be an initial for a second name.Making the surname Norton.
What prompted the thought was 'the clear spelling' ;D,copied  from an earlier misprint perhap,s?
        Goggy. ;)

Offline fizzybubble

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Re: Cornish Mystery
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 02 April 06 20:36 BST (UK) »
I think that she was Amelia Norton. If you look at Family History Online you will see that there were a lot of Norton people around the Truro area.

1842 was fairly early in the literacy stakes - dont let the typed copy of the original register fool you. Most of that date are hand written and the registrar may have had his own version of the spelling of Norton. He may simply have had a habit of putting a "K" in front of anything that started with an "N" if that makes sense. The double "t" is nothing really - one of the names I am researching is "Mutton" and that can sometimes be written with one "T".

Fizzy
Cornwall - Mutton Brown Trevethan Mugford Higham
Yorkshire - Thirlwall

Offline goggy

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Re: Cornish Mystery
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 05 April 06 04:50 BST (UK) »
And--then there's Knaughton!
Should I just be quiet for a while???
               Goggy. ;) ;D

Offline JAP

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Re: Cornish Mystery
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 05 April 06 07:10 BST (UK) »
Valda, I've puzzled over this whole story to no avail  :(  However, re one of the SLACKs you found - Emma Barton SLACK b Truro 1861, d (as Emma Burton SLACK) Truro 1870 - I came across the following in the IGI:
Emma SLACK or BURTON, bap 3 Oct 1862, Truro, parents Joseph SLACK or BURTON and Ann.
Another SLACK in Truro going under an alias?

Incidentally, the 1803 baptisms in Holborn in the IGI list the ages of the children of William SLACK and Ann - John 7, Charles 3, and George 1.

JAP