Author Topic: Brick wall - a real long shot  (Read 17896 times)

Offline avm228

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Brick wall - a real long shot
« on: Wednesday 19 July 06 15:32 BST (UK) »
Dear All

I've got a frustrating brick wall that I'm making no progress on - Rootschatters have been so resourceful and helpful to me lately that I thought it was worth putting this one out there just in case anybody has any ideas.

I was lucky enough to inherit a handwritten family tree from a (now long-deceased) relative which has proved about 95% accurate and invaluable in tracing this particular line of the family. It's at the top of the tree that things get a bit vague and I'm struggling to pin people down. I'm hoping that an extract from the tree will appear as an attachment to this post (my first attempt at posting an image!).

So: here's what I know.  George Pierce was born and baptised in 1769 (St James' Westminster). He married, in 1790 in Westminster, Betsey Matthews of Calne, Wilts, daughter of Thomas Matthews and Susannah Tarrant.

George b 1769 was a jeweller (not a naval officer, as the family tree suggests; that was his eldest son George). He occupied premises at 9 Richmond Buildings, Soho, and the jewellery business was carried on there after his death (in 1823) by two of his sons, James and Samuel.

What I'm desperate to know is - who were the parents of George b 1769?  His baptismal records say George Pierce and Elizabeth.  The family tree names his father as "George - drowned in Wales" and makes no mention of his mother.  That is absolutely all I have.

As an even longer shot, the family tree shows the father of "George - drowned in Wales" as "Dormond (of Taunton, Somerset) b 1700" with a brother Thomas. Above that the tree simply bears the title "Pierce (originally from Wales)".

Any ideas at all as to how to fill in the gaps would be most welcome.  In case the middle names give any clues, I'll list the children of George Pierce/Betsey Matthews:

George Pierce b 1791 (bap St James, Westminster)
James Parker Pierce b 1794 (bap St James, Westminster)
Robert Pierce b 1796 (bap St James, Westminster)
Elizabeth Jeanette Pierce b 1798 (bap St James, Westminster)
Samuel Oliver Pierce b 1800 (bap St James, Westminster)
Thomas John Bailey Pierce b 1802 (bap St Anne's Soho)
Jane Beal(e) Bleadon Pierce b 1805 (bap St Anne's Soho)

Thanks in advance for any suggestions at all

Anna
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline avm228

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Re: Brick wall - a real long shot
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 19 July 06 15:37 BST (UK) »
Oh dear - the image is enormous.  Is there any easy way to shrink it?

Anna :o

OK - I've cropped it...
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline acceber

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Re: Brick wall - a real long shot
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 19 July 06 18:43 BST (UK) »
Hello

Have found this on familysearch.org, a record for Geo. Pierce m Elizabeth Williams in Monken Hadley (no idea where this is), London, 20 Aug 1767. Wonder if this could be your George and Elizabeth?
There is also a record for a George Pierce marrying Margaret Peferley on 25 apr 1769 in St James, Westminster. So maybe this could be your george remarrying or maybe someone unrelated!

acceber
Pattemore: Somerset - Sellick: Glous + Somerset -Sparrow: Glous + Wilts


Offline Gadget

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Re: Brick wall - a real long shot
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 19 July 06 18:46 BST (UK) »
Just adding a little Welsh info - it could well be that the patronymic form was being used in Wales at the time.

Pierce is Anglicised  from ap Rhys - son of Rhys.

Alternatively, one account gives it as being anglcised from the French 'piers'

Gadget
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Offline Lendevon

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Re: Brick wall - a real long shot
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 19 July 06 20:10 BST (UK) »
Pierce ( and variants ) is a common name in Plymouth which seems reasonable for a naval officer. Plymouth being full of Cornishmen would also fit with Gadget's theory.
Dimond/Diamond and variants are common around Taunton.
Kent - Piper, Longley, Colvin,Parks,Baker,Saitt
Essex - Wade, Shipp, Warren, Davies, Walford

Offline avm228

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Re: Brick wall - a real long shot
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 20 July 06 10:35 BST (UK) »
Thanks, everyone, for your input.

Acceber - I've seen that Monken Hadley marriage and wondered about it.  Monken Hadley is in Herts just north of London.  I've no other evidence at the moment to suggest a link with Monken Hadley, but you never know what might turn up!

The George Pierce marriage to Margaret in April 1769 I hadn't seen - interesting to see the St James Westminster connection - but I think it must just be coincidence as my George was not born until May 1769 (and baptised as son of George and Elizabeth in June 1769).

I'd love to get back to the Welsh roots, Gadget - if I ever find out anything at all about Dormond Pierce I might be able to verify whether this family really was from Wales, as the family tree says, or not  :) But it does look as though they were in England from about 1700 onwards, if the tree is correct. It's interesting to learn that there are different sources for the Pierce surname - I hadn't been aware of that.

Lendevon - the naval officer in the family was (contrary to the family tree) not George b 1767 but his eldest son George b 1791 in London and baptised at Westminster.  He was based at Devonport in the 1820s and 1830s and there is lots of naval biographical information about him, but there's nothing to suggest that the family was from Devon originally.  As to Diamond/Dimond - it hadn't even occurred to me that Dormond might be a variant of those names. Other than this family tree I've got no information at all about Dormond Pierce, but I'd give anything (or quite a lot) to find out.

Many thanks again everyone :)

Anna
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline Cazo

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Re: Brick wall - a real long shot
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 06 November 11 15:02 GMT (UK) »
I know this is quite a few years after your earlier messages - and you might have found this already - but the name Jane Beale Bleaden Pierce appeared on a periphery bit of research I was doing.

She was married to Robert William Morgan and information on her family can be found on this page: http://www.sewallgenealogy.com/p361.htm#i15618

My interest was in her daughter Edith, who married Rev. Henry Doyle Sewall. Their daughter Edith married John McClennan whose sister Emily married into the Verschoyle family who are my distant relatives. So quite on the edge of my tree!

Hope this is helpful.
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Offline avm228

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Re: Brick wall - a real long shot
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 06 November 11 16:42 GMT (UK) »
Hello Cazo

Nice to hear from you - yes, I do have Jane's Sewell and McClellan descendants noted (early 20thc at least). In fact there is another string to the connection because Emily and John McClellan's mother was born Emily Elliott Pierce (niece of Jane) - so that Edith Sewell and her husband John McClellan were related. It's always good to hear from someone else with people in common, even if peripheral!

I still haven't got any further back on the Pierce side of the tree.  Maybe some day :)

Anna
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline snowball

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Re: Brick wall - a real long shot
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 06 November 11 20:36 GMT (UK) »
Hi,
There are a couple of 18th C and two 17th C PCC wills of Taunton Pearses/Pearces that might be worth investigating:
http://bit.ly/uYSNDD

Regards
Rob