1st world war diaries- Thomas Sheppard

[turnera]

I was wondering if anyone can point me in the right direction and clarify two things

1) What do the terms  Division,   Brigade, Battalion and Regiment mean? and how might I find a comprehensive list for WWI?

2) Specficically, How can I track from a 1st world war medal card for one of my ancestors to the campaign diary . I note that both are available on the National Archives website.

So for example, I know from the CWGC website that my great-uncle died as follows:

In Memory of
Private THOMAS NORGROVE OWEN SHEPPARD

18280, 20th Coy., Machine Gun Corps (Infantry)
formerly (10654), Devonshire Regiment
who died age 21
on 02 July 1916
Son of Mrs. M. Sheppard, of 43, Torrington Place, Plymouth, Dcvon.
Remembered with honour
THIEPVAL MEMORIAL

His medal card can be found on National Archives as ref : WO 372/18 Medal card of  Sheppard, Thomas
Corps: Devonshire Regiment
Regiment No: 10654
Rank: Private...
. Although it shows date of death as 3rd July 1916.

Based on this how do I know what Division,   Brigade, Battalion and Regiment , Thomas Sheppard was in, and therefore locate the appropriate War Diary? I can see that his regiment seems to be Devonshire.
However I guess there would have been lots!

I have tried to found out myself , but must admit I am a bit lost as to what all the terminology means and wonder whether there is a easy way of always getting the right  regiment and other details?

Any help would be much appreciated and I am sure that other novices like me would find this information very valuable and interesting.

Thanks
Andrew

[Bill749]

Hi Andrew

It would appear that Thomas joined the Devonshire Regiment but later transferred to the 20th Company Machine Gun Corps (Infantry), which would be the unit he was in when he was killed.

Since you know his unit, his date of death and the area in which he was killed, it should be fairly straightforward to track down the appropriate diary.

I've never tried it on line, but there are a set of books at Kew which will cross reference the information you have with the piece number for the diary.

War diaries from WW1 will usually give you a fair bit of detail about what the unit where doing on that day and where they were, but it is very unlikely that your chap will be named, as private soldiers were almost never mentioned by name in these documents, even as casualties.

The fact that he is remembered on the Thiepval Memorial suggests that his body was never found or was beyond recognition (sorry to be so blunt!), so he has no known grave.

You might find an answer to the other question on the MOD website.

Regards, Bill

[goggy]

Bill.
Thank's for that info on the Thiepval Memorial.
Now! I believe that my Paternal G'Dad joined the Liverpool Pal's initially,then(my theory)because of losses sustained,the survivor's were re-assigned to other unit's.and'seemingly'G'Dad went to the M.G.Corp's.
Reading W.W.1 histories,it seems that the gunner's who stuck to the job were generally killed out of hand.Too late to surrender.
So,Thiepval seem's the best place to find him.
                Goggy.

[Wendi]

Hi Andrew

Have you got his medal card?  can you post it here?

Here is some background info on The Machine Gun Corp from the Long, Long Trail

http://www.rootschat.com/links/0sm/

Wendi

[turnera]

Hi all and thanks for the responses so far. I have found them very helpful. I am new to this but have attached the medal card in pdf format ,so hopefully you can view? Thomas's entry is 2nd from the top on LHS.

Any further information would be very much appreciated.

Many thanks

Andrew

PS Do medal cards exist for WWII and are there war diaries available for this?

[atom12]

Hi

Your great uncles's listed on the SDGW site as:

Private Thomas Sheppard: No. 18280

Regiment:  Machine Gun Corps
Battalion: Infantry

Born: St Philip's, Bristol
Enlisted: Devonport
Residence: Plymouth

Died: 03/07/16: Killed in Action: France & Flanders

FORMERLY: 10654, DEVON REGT.

[atom12]

The 20th Brigade Machine Gun Company were part of 20 Brigade, part of 7th Infantry Division.  In that Division, as part of 20 Brigade were the 8th and 9th Devons.  The practise at the time was that battalions gave up their machine gun sections to form a Brigade Company of machine guns.

"20th Brigade Machine Gun Company (formed 10 February 1916, moved into 7 MG Bn 1 April 1918)"

see:

http://www.1914-1918.net/7div.htm

[themonsstar]

Hi
Here are the numbers you will need for the Medal Rolls & War Diarie, for your G/U. at the National Archives(Kew)

The Medal roll for the British War Medal, should give you the Battalion he was with when he was in the Devon Regiment.

MGC/101/B12 page 1277=WO329/1738, this is for the British War Medal & Victory Medal.

MGC/5c page 155= WO329/2826, this is for the 1915 Star Medal.

The War Diarie for the 20th Company MGC is WO95/1657, Feb 1916-Nov1917,this unit was part of the 7th Battalion MGC,this will cover the time of your G/U Death,

The "WO" numbers are the ones you need at the National Archives,

Here are the "WD" for the Devons,
WO95/1655 is for the 8th Battn=July 1915-Nov 1917.
WO95/1656 is for the 9th Battn=Sept 1915-Nov 1917.

Best of luck