Author Topic: Which of your ancestors have disappeared?  (Read 56973 times)

Offline MarieC

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Which of your ancestors have disappeared?
« on: Monday 22 January 07 09:55 GMT (UK) »
AARRGH!!

Surely I'm not the only Rootschatter whose ancestors have disappeared without trace!

Maybe if we all list them, we'll eventually find the black hole where they are all clustered and laughing at us!

I have two in the nineteenth century.  I've looked, Rootschatters have looked - nowhere!  Gone!

Edward Martin, London, last found in 1851 census.  Wife Mary listed as married, and supporting herself, in 1861 and 1871 - widowed in 1881.  Cannot find him, or a death among all the Edward Martins which is him (and I have several wrong death certs!).

Eleanor Bentley, London, last found in 1861 census.  No subsequent sign, and no deaths which could be her. 

Again, with feeling - AARRGH!!!!

Who are yours?

MarieC
Census information is Crown copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Martins in London and Wales, Lockwoods in Yorkshire, Hartleys in London, Lichfield and Brighton, Hubands and Smiths in Ireland, Bentleys in London and Yorkshire, Denhams in Somerset, Scoles in London, Meyers in London, Cooks in Northumberland

Offline hiraeth

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Which of your ancestors have disappeared?
« Reply #1 on: Monday 22 January 07 10:10 GMT (UK) »
Hi Marie

I feel your pain ;D ;D   

I have a John Carrington who never died.

It's none of my business, but have you checked out re-marriages for Eleanor Bentley?? I found one of my gg grandmother's remarried 18  years after her first husband died...  the clincher was the 2nd husband was a witness at my g grandfather's wedding.  So you never know.

Edward might have gone to sea and died out of the UK eg?  Or maybe ran off with another woman and changed his name???

Oh, the books we could write, spun from the tales of all our Rootschatter ancestors!!

Heather
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Offline MarieC

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Re: Which of your ancestors have disappeared?
« Reply #2 on: Monday 22 January 07 10:23 GMT (UK) »
Hi Heather!  :D

Yes, checked for remarriages for Eleanor - none found.  Yes, either of the scenarios you mention for Edward, or more, could apply!  I've even been tempted to think they ran off with each other!!! :o :o :o  I could make a great story out of it all!

When and where was your John Carrington when last heard of?

MarieC
Census information is Crown copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Martins in London and Wales, Lockwoods in Yorkshire, Hartleys in London, Lichfield and Brighton, Hubands and Smiths in Ireland, Bentleys in London and Yorkshire, Denhams in Somerset, Scoles in London, Meyers in London, Cooks in Northumberland


Offline KathMc

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Re: Which of your ancestors have disappeared?
« Reply #3 on: Monday 22 January 07 10:27 GMT (UK) »
What a great topic. There will be a lot of venting here. I have gr-gr grandpa William C. Davis, born between 1851 and 1854 in Princeton, New Jersey (so he says!). I have him on church records when he is conditionally baptised 4 days before his wedding, in 1874. I have him in the 1880 census and 1900 census with his family in Orange, NJ. His wife Bridget (Delia) dies in 1906 and is buried at St. John's, Orange, NJ. No hide nor hair of Willie. We have done paid searches in Princeton for pre-1874 stuff and we can't find him definitively. And after 1900, he has disappeared. And he isn't buried with Bridget.

I also have two of another gr-gr grandfather's brothers, who I have no idea what happened to them. Michael Hayes, born Ireland about 1845, came with parents to England. The family settled in Staffordshire (for one generation). The youngest, George Hayes, b. 1865 in Huntington, is also missing. They are both gone from the 1881 census and that's that. I might have a lead on Michael but it is proving hard to confirm. Apparently, my gg grandfather, James, never spoke of Michael or George, only his other two siblings, Mary Jane (died when she was 15) and John (moved to Australia and we are in touch with his descendants). I wonder if there was a falling out


Kath
Sligo: Davey (also Mayo), McCluskey, McNulty
Wexford and Staffordshire: Hayes, McClean
Galway and Staffordshire: Scott
Coventry: Wells, Collins, Palmer, Moody, Beck, Mickelwright, Husbands
Ireland: McNulty (Sligo), Kealy, Murphy (Carlow) Connolly, Gillen, Powell, Ryan, Moore, Martin
Davis from I don't know where originally
Stahl, Russia to England to USA

Offline MarieC

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Re: Which of your ancestors have disappeared?
« Reply #4 on: Monday 22 January 07 10:36 GMT (UK) »
That's really frustrating, Kath!!  As you say, perhaps there was a family falling out.  But your gr-gr-grandpa - you have searched thoroughly, and nothing!  Where the devil is he??  (Mine are g-g-grandparents, too!) 

There's got to be a black hole somewhere...

MarieC
Census information is Crown copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Martins in London and Wales, Lockwoods in Yorkshire, Hartleys in London, Lichfield and Brighton, Hubands and Smiths in Ireland, Bentleys in London and Yorkshire, Denhams in Somerset, Scoles in London, Meyers in London, Cooks in Northumberland

Offline hiraeth

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Re: Which of your ancestors have disappeared?
« Reply #5 on: Monday 22 January 07 10:58 GMT (UK) »
Hi Marie
my 3g grandfather, John Carrington, lead miner. His wife Barbra, age 60, is listed as widow on the 1851 Census of Bersham.  The youngest child at home is listed as son John, age 17 on the 1851, which indicates that John would have lived until 1832 or so.  ::)
John's mother Jane was living in Llandegla in 1841, age 75, at the home of her son Aaron Carrington and family.  I've searched the following with no result:
North Wales BMD between 1837 and 1851
1841 census of Llandegla - no other Carrington families - of course most of 1841 for the area is not available
Every page of the death registers available for Carringtons from 1837 to 1851 inclusive
IGI family search

The only conclusion I've come to is that he must have died between 1832 and 1837 and that the burial would be recorded in parish records for Llandegla or other close parishes, but NOT FOUND YET!!!  OR he died somewhere else AFTER 1837 other than in Ruthin, Holywell or Wrexham reg districts (highly unlikely) Am sick and tired of ordering death certificates - could paper the powder room wall!!  Because I live in Canada it gets very expensive to keep buying PRs looking for just one death.    Will just have to hope that if and when the PRs for Wales go on line one day I may find him again.  Perhaps he was abducted by aliens! ;D ;D  Having said all that someone will probably find him in about five minutes now!!   Never mind I'm not proud I just want to find him :D

Kath is right - this is a great topic - there should be a thread for SUPER brickwalls :D  Like a confessional!!  If nothing else it would provide a place to moan in "private" ::) 
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Offline hiraeth

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Re: Which of your ancestors have disappeared?
« Reply #6 on: Monday 22 January 07 11:03 GMT (UK) »
It was far too easy for men in particular to disappear back in the 1800s ;D ;D
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Offline MarieC

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Re: Which of your ancestors have disappeared?
« Reply #7 on: Monday 22 January 07 11:22 GMT (UK) »
Hmmm, Heather!

Think you are right, it is most likely that he died between 1832 and 1837.  Do you know if he and his family were C of E??  Otherwise, he could have been buried from a non-conformist church like Methodist.

I know that the C of E in Wales hasn't allowed the LDS to film most of their records, which means that these aren't available to the likes of you and me, which is very frustrating!  He is probably languishing in parish records of either the established or a non-conformist church somewhere.  Can you persuade anyone to take a look??

A little story to cheer you.  I looked for months/years for the marriage of two of my ggggrandparents in the north of England.  It nearly drove me round the twist.  I got in to the LDS films of all the possible parish records - they were definitely C of E.  Didn't find them.  But I noticed that the films were of Bishops Transcripts, and that there were a couple of pages missing from one of the really likely parishes, for likely years too.  So I pleaded on the appropriate board, and a very kind R/Chatter went to the Records Office and looked at the original PRs - and found the marriage, in a year which was missing from the BTs!!!  ;D ;D  I was over the moon!

MarieC
Census information is Crown copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Martins in London and Wales, Lockwoods in Yorkshire, Hartleys in London, Lichfield and Brighton, Hubands and Smiths in Ireland, Bentleys in London and Yorkshire, Denhams in Somerset, Scoles in London, Meyers in London, Cooks in Northumberland

Offline hiraeth

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Re: Which of your ancestors have disappeared?
« Reply #8 on: Monday 22 January 07 11:42 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for the encouragement ;D ;D  I know the family eventually became Wesleyans but back in the 1830s I think they were still C of E....  Part of the trouble is that there were so many of the same name in a relatively small group of villages - so every time I think I've found him it turns out he is not the one!!

BTW  the latest Gwynedd Roots magazine says that the LDS have struck a deal to put all the Welsh PRs into digital format so eventually there may be enlightenment :) :)

Heather
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk