Daughters of Joseph Black

[Agnetta]

I have given up on Joseph Black and Martha Weir,but do any of these names,of their daughters, ring a bell with anyone?
Margaret Black m'd William John Shirlow(Sherlow)c 1885, lived at Brethetts Hill, Lambeg.
Mary Black m'd Thomas Sinclair c 1883
Jane Black m'd James Irwin c 1881
Elizabeth(Lizzie) Black m'd William John Mc Dowell c 1892 - lived at Lambeg,Lisburn. (The house,on the Queensway, was just demolished in 2006.
There was a son Joseph Black - believed to have gone to Glasgow,and possibly a daughter Agnes Black b 1873.

[Tees]

Hi Agnetta

Here are the marriage registrations I found:

Maggie Black married William John Shirlow on 1 Jan 1885

Mary Black married Thomas Sinclair on 04 May 1883

Lizzie Black married William John McDowell on 15 April 1893

All were taken at the Railway Street Second Presbyterian Church in the Parish of Blaris, Lisburn, Co Antrim

Jane Black married James Irwin on 20 March 1880

At the Saint Anne's Church of Ireland in the Parish of Shankill, Belfast, Co Antrim

Interestingly, I could find a birth entry on Agnes in the "right" area in a right year--

She was born as Agnes Elizabeth Black to the parents of Joseph Black and Jane Carrothers in the parish of Lisburn, Annahilt, Co Down on 5 Aug 1873

I saw the parents' marriage--on 5 April 1866, Joseph Black married to Jane Crothers at Magheradrool Church of Ireland in the parish of Magheradrool, Downpatrick, Co Down

Interesting thing about this is that many of your Black siblings were born in Co Down to this parents but I cannot be certain if they are yours.

Only Martha I could find that married to a Joseph Black is a Craig.

Hope this information help you a bit. Your best bet would to obtain all of the marriage entries to ascertain who was their father and his occupation and hopefully, one of these entries give the bride's age so you can trace her birth entry.

Good luck,

Tees

[Agnetta]

Tees - many thanks for your reply. I actually have all the info re the marriages of Jane,Mary,Maggie and Lizzie. (my grandmother) Their mother Martha was a widow Martha Craig,nee Weir,when she m'd Joseph Black in 1858 in Malone Presbyterian church,Belfast.Actually there is a chance that Jane (m'd James Irwin) b 1857 was the child of Martha and ?? Craig,but she was reared as Black. I posted all the names in the hope that someone would pick up on the Weir or Mc Dowell names.Joseph and Martha have eluded me for many years.Joseph's father was Joseph too, and Martha's father was Joseph Weir - I have Josephs death cert,but it doesn't mention wife or family.It was Lizzies husband,Wm John Mc Dowell,who registered the death.I can't find a death cert for Martha Weir/Craig/Black. Re Agnes 1873 - I don't know about her being a sister for sure,unless Martha had died and Joseph remarried.I do know my mother was called Agnes. Was she named for her aunt? who knows? I think it's just coincidence. I also know for sure,that these "girls"were reared in Derriaghy and Lambeg,Co Antrim.My grandmother lived her entire life,single and married,in the same house,and died there at age 89.Her father,Joseph Black died there as well.I was born in it.(The house was demolished in April last year)Thanks again for replying.It's nice to know that someone at least noticed.All the best,Agnetta

[Tees]

Hi Angetta,

Quite pleased you have all this information.

Understood your feelings about the elusive relations! Same with me...

Have you tried this website: www.ancestryireland.com

Perhaps you can find out who were Jane's father? Possibly a Craig. It is very likely.

It is possible that your Martha had remarried for thrice?

Kind regards,

Tees

[Agnetta]

Hi again Tees. I use that website a lot-  very good. On 1901 census Joseph Black is head of the house,at Lambeg.Living there also are my grandparents Wm John Mc Dowell and Lizzie and 3 of their children.Joseph is not listed as widower,but Martha ,his wife,is not mentioned. I have checked the homes of her other daughters,on the census,but she wasn't visiting any of them on census night,so rightly or wrongly,I presume she was dead.She is determined to stay "lost" no matter which way I go,but I WILL keep searching - she's out there somewhere !!Thanks again. Agnetta (Do you live in NI?)

[Tees]

Hi Agnetta,

No, I am not based in NI. If I am, I would be delighted to help many people here out.

However, I still have family there.

Yes, I think that the website is good despite the price is a bit steep and search on the names is a bit inflexible. (Can't do any phonetic.)

Kind regards,

Tees

[Tees]

Hi Agnetta,

Have you tried the cemeteries nearby?? Perhaps one of them have your Martha's grave.

Or try one that has Joseph Black's grave--hopefully, the tombstone will clue you onto who his wife was at the time of his death (before or after).

Hope this suggestions are any of help to you. Good luck with this one!

Kind Regards,

Tees

[Agnetta]

Hi again Tees - I too have lots of rellies (on both sides) still in NI,but none of them are even remotely interested in "family history" - and here's me,in Australia,fighting tooth and nail for scraps of info from whoever and wherever. I find Ancestry a bit expensive too,but I only go there after I've exhausted other avenues, and can use them to double check or verify. "Rootschat" has been the most helpful site I've found in years. Re the graveyards - my ancestors were all working class (a lot of them in linen mills) and didn't run to "headstones" Joseph and Martha were Prebyterians and obviously attended Railway St Church, in Lisburn (3 of their daughters were married there)Where they were buried is a bit of a mystery.Presumably together,but where? Their daughter Lizzie m'd a Church of Ireland man -William John Mc Dowell (my grandparents) so they are buried in Derriaghy CofI graveyard. As you probably know - that wa the custom (still is ) You m'd in your church but thereafter attended whichever persuasion your husband was. Not to worry - I'll sort this lot out one way or t"other. All the best,Agnetta.

[Tees]

Hi Angetta,

Yes--I have same "problem" with my family in NI about getting info on various ancestors. I do understand your position.

Perhaps the church(es) may have burial registers? I am not sure if this practice is usually practised in Ireland.

I wish you the best of luck and every success in finding your ancestors. I am sorry I could not be of help at this point!! 

Regards,

Tees