The mysterious Robert Jones

[fuddy]

Hi.  I'm trying to determine what the relationship is between my grandfather (Thomas Hughes Jones) & Sir Alfred Lewis Jones (the 19th century Liverpool shipping magnate).

Tom was supposed to have been set to receive an immense inheritance consisting of cash, stocks & bonds, land in Jamaica, etc etc. Tom's father was Robt Jones.

Birth cert., Thomas Hughes Jones - b.Oct. 11, 1882, @ Gas Works, Savile Town, Thornhill. Father- Robert Jones, occ. 'Gas Manager'. Mother- Sarah Helen Jones (late Kershaw, formerly Holt). Robert's residence- Gas Works, Savile Town.

Marriage cert., Thomas Hughes Jones, occ., professional musician(age 25) & Annie Joynt, spinster(age 30) - m.Feb 6, 1907, @ Register Office, Salford.
(Thomas's father- Robert Jones(deceased), occ.- Analytical Chemist.) Thomas's residence- 8 Mildred St, Broughton.

Marriage cert., Robert Jones(widower), occ., Gas Engineer(age 'full') & Sarah Helen Kershaw(widow) - m.March 31 1882, @ Church of the Ascension, parish of lower Broughton.
(Robert's father- Robert Jones(deceased), occ.- Lawyer.)
(Sarah's father- Joseph Holt (of the Holt brewery company?), occ.- Mechanic. Robert's residence- Dewsbury.

None of Sir Alfred's siblings were named 'Robert'. Inheritance comes down from the male line. Any suggestions? (my head is bogged down w/ excessive tidbits of info at this point, sorry)       -thanks!

                                               

[winston]

Hi Fuddy


I have a couple of Titbits from the Times.


I have sent you a PM


Wendy

[winston]

Off track,  I know but Thomas's mum Sarah kept her self busy with these marriages.


I only noticed as I was looking for the family unit in the 1891 census to track Robert back through the census for you just to see if indeed there was a link.


Wendy

[fuddy]

And in such quick succession. Kershaw, '77
                                               Jones, '82
                                               Gledhill, '85


Thomas was conductor of an orchestra for the Cunard Line during the teens & 20’s, S.ampton/Cherbourg/New York route (Aquitania, Berengaria, Mauretania).

In the few pages of his journal I've found, he writes of a visit w/ his Aunt Helen on her birthday (May 13) at her manor house in Liverpool (she picked him up in her Rolls Royce at train station), where he was shown a large oil portrait of his father, age 14 (Robt.?), & conversed about his inheritance. He writes, “Sir Alfred being a Baronet, I will claim title at the Court of Heralds“,
and, “Sir Alfred left an estate of L5,000,000, not counting Briarcliff. Mr MacKenzie, her secretary now, says there is some property for me in Jamaica, and we are going over soon. Will as follows:

L5,000 cash
L12,000 in stocks & shares - Elder Dempster
C.P.S Ship.
C.P.RR
B.W. Africa Steam Co

Imperial Direct RM. SS
L10,000 cash every five years (total L40,000)
L20,000 at age 60
Stocks & Bonds held for children & cash as they come of age
Masonic emblems & many other things, at Helen’s death"

[stuizzy]

I did some rummaging about looking for Sir Alfred. I did get excited when I saw in 1901 that he had a Picton H. Jones with him, listed as cousin. When I searched back for Picton (born abut 1880), I found that his middle name was Hughes, as was the case for all his siblings and his father.  Picton's father's name was Isaac Hughes Jones. Couldn't find a Thomas Hughes Jones, or a Robert for that matter.

Another thing that's confusing - who is "Aunt Helen"? I assumed that she was going to be Alfred's wife, but as of 1901, I don't find him married. Also, there's no mention of a wife in his obituary.

Isobel

[fuddy]

Hi Isobel - Sir Alfred never married, & I've no idea who Aunt Helen was. Wendy (previous posts) sent me a listing of Sir Alfred's charitable contributions as written in his Will, but no mention of a distribution among family members.

The only info I can find @ Robt is on the certificates listed a few posts back. If there's a connection between Picton & my grandfather it's eluding me. Any suggestions, perhaps Picton's birth cert. might help?

[winston]

Fuddy

Is the a date or Year for the entry that he visits "Aunt Helen" on her birthday?


Wendy

[fuddy]

Yes, Wendy, on the fourth post in this thread - Thursday, May 13, 1926 was the entry date in his journal - he writes,   "arrived Liverpool 5pm, had a wonderful time and reception. Stayed all night - it was Aunt's birthday today."

[winston]

I fuddy


I wonder if Aunt Helen which side of the family she would have been on?

she would have been quite an elderley Aunt then wouldn't she going on the year of entry in his journal?


Its a pity he didn't also state how old this Aunt was - a last name would've helped also.


MMMM



Wendy