Unpleasant family truths .......

[Meliora]

Just a small story on least favourite ancestors,

I have a 4 X greatgrandfather who owned a coal mine in Leicestershire & I have seen graphic writeups & descriptions of the working conditions of the men, women & children who crawled on their hands & knees to bring coal out.  I felt horrified & ashamed of it all.

But then I found the inventory to his will & in the fields around his farm were paddocks with blind ponies who had been brought up from the mine to end their days with the sun on their backs.  If only he had given thought to the conditions of his work force as he did to the ponies I would have thought better of him.

Meliora

[lambster134]

I have so far found a bigamous ancestor, an alcoholic and a father who abandoned his children. I have no intention of apologising to anyone for them nor do I judge them!
   How can we be judge and jury about times gone by when we have the benefit of 20-20 hindsight and work by a whole different set of social rules?
  Regarding slavery, the Romans were doing it, the Vikings were doing it, the Turks were doing it, the English were doing it, the Africans were doing it, the Chinese were doing it, the Japanese were doing it, the Russians were doing it - everyone did it.
  Now we know it is abhorrent but back then the warped religious argument was that black Africans were "savages" and "animals" and the uneducated masses of the time believed it.
  Let us simply be grateful that a few far-sighted souls back then realised it was wrong. Rather than apologise, let's hail William Wilberforce and the abolitionists!
  Until female emancipation it was legally acceptable for a husband to use violence on his wife. Any men out there want to say sorry??  

[Cathymjp]

The past is another country.  For me, you cannot right all the wrongs done in the past, however unpalatable parts of history are, they are of their time.  The most important part of history is to learn from it and not to repeat the same mistakes now. 

Cathy

[lcsnor]

Our energies are best spent not looking backward but in touching the problems of our world.  Slavery is still with us, sweatshops are still with us, exploitation is still with us.  This is something we can do something about.  An apology on behalf of a dead man to another dead man can only serve to salve our consciences and distract us from our responsibilities.

Louise

[MrsLizzy]

The arguments put forward at the time by those who opposed the abolition of slavery sound remarkably familiar to those put forward today by people who want to continue hunting with hounds and other forms of cruelty to animals:

"It's traditional."  "They (black people or foxes) don't matter or don't have feelings."  "If it's banned we will lose our livelihood or business."

[MrsLizzy]

Our energies are best spent not looking backward but in touching the problems of our world.  Slavery is still with us, sweatshops are still with us, exploitation is still with us.  This is something we can do something about.  An apology on behalf of a dead man to another dead man can only serve to salve our consciences and distract us from our responsibilities.

Louise

Louise!  Beautifully put!  10 out of 10 for eloquence and truth.  You should be a writer, if you're not already.

[dennford]

But then I found the inventory to his will & in the fields around his farm were paddocks with blind ponies who had been brought up from the mine to end their days with the sun on their backs.  If only he had given thought to the conditions of his work force as he did to the ponies I would have thought better of him.

Meliora

I know that this is a little bit off topic - and I suppose oflittle importance, but having had the fortune in my younger days to have worked as a pony driver in the coal mines, I can definately point out that it is a misconception that the ponies lose thier sight. At most mines the animals were brought out to the surface during the annual holidays (this is when holidays became a part of the working year), they were also brought out when they could no longer do a days work. Occassionally we would visit the retired ponies who would see us approaching and instantly could recognise an old companion - I never did witness any loss of sight, yet I regularly heard that the poor creatures would be blind after years in the dark.

                                                     Denn (out in his own green padock)

[Gadget]

It is very interesting, Denn. My Dad used to talk of them being brought up at holiday times. However, I thought that this ended a long time ago and you're nowhere near my Dad's age - he would have been 101 

Gadget

[dennford]

Many people don't realise just how recent ly Pponies were used. I have just checked my old NCB certificate of training and I completed that on 2nd April 1964. At that time there were still many collieries using ponies. I went to Wath Main colliery wher they were still using ponies for salvage work for quite some years - in fact I think that Wath was one of the last pits to use them. If I were to guess (and it would only be a guess) I would say that ponies were used up untill the late 1960s.

                                                      Denn