Lewis Rossi Hardy - part 2!!

[tilly56]

I have, with a LOT of help from New Zealand Rootschatters, been finding out about one of my ancestors, Lewis Rossi Hardy. I won't repeat it all here, but if you're interested, have a look at the NZ thread!...........   However - I have just been told about ANOTHER Lewis Rossi Hardy who served in the Royal Navy - which got me a bit worried as I thought it might mean all our hunting had lead to the wrong man. But this doesn't seem to be the case - "my" Lewis is well and truly buried in New Zealand.

I thought that the name Lewis Rossi Hardy was unusual and was surprised to find another one - so I'd like to know a bit more about the Australian one, in case there is a link somewhere.  All I know is :

Lewis Rossi Hardy, born 10th October 1870 in Sydney, NSW, Labourer. Served for twelve years from 10 August 1895 to 21 June 1897 when he bought his way out.  He was then serving on the Victory 2.

I would be interested to know his parents' names and if possible his place and date of death.

It could be, of course, that his middle name has been misread and that it doesn't say Rossi at all....

Many thanks for any info anyone can let me have.

Tilly

[Cazay]

Hi Tilly

Can't find a birth for Lewis Rossi Hardy after a quick look, you can search for yourself here.....

www.bdm.nsw.gov.au

Cazay

[tilly56]

Thanks for the tip Cazay - Have had a look, but can't find him, even without the Rossi bit......Strange - but I'll  keep trying!

Tilly

[ChristineR]

It does seem a  bit strange - I have been looking at your NZ thread - your bloke was in the RN too? but still serving when he died.

Is it possible it is the same chap? yours born abt 1859 and this one 1870 is only an 11 years age diff.   He only served two years of that stint - would hardly have been past the training stage.   Do you have the enlistment details of 'your' Lewis?

My granddad changed his surname, age, country of birth, and religion. 
Can you prove that yours was not in Australia 1895 - 1897?
Have you found yours in the 1861 census in England?

Christine 

edit - looking at the RN list in the UK archives - there is only the Sydney born one mentioned there.

[ChristineR]

Just further to my other post - this site
http://www.pbenyon.plus.com/18-1900/Index.html
has an outline of 19th century vessels.

I know that Victory 2 was a shore based training ship / camp.
And it seems that Worcester (named on your fellows headstone) was also a training ship from 1876 - stationed in the Thames, London at the time of your blokes death in 1910.

I really think that it is possible that these fellows could be the same man. 

Is it possible that his parents were briefly in Australia?  New Zealand records will reflect what he has told his family (like I grew up believing that I was 25% Scottish).

Did you download that RN record? I thought you might as you knew he had brought his way out.  Did that one serve time on the Worcester at all?

Christine 

[tilly56]

Hi Christine,

Very interesting!  I wondered whether this second Lewis had, for some reason, "stolen" my Lewis' name.....

I do have my Lewis in the 1861 census, when he was 1 yr old and living with his parents (George and Julia) in London - father was a "Woolen draper".  I have him in 1871 too when he is at his Grandfather's house (Edward Clifford).  The only Lewis R Rossi I can find in 1881 is living in Cumberland and is a Comedian Actor (doesn't seem to fit....).   I can't find him in the 1891 census but he could have been on his ship somewhere.  I don't know if there's a way of finding this out.   

I also know that my Lewis' father is given as George, Gentleman, when Lewis goes onto the Worcester as a cadet. A document is being posted to my mum's in England and I will get to see it when I go over in a couple of weeks for a holiday!

I don't yet know when he moved to New Zealand....I'm waiting for some info from Carol in NZ, who is waiting for some info from the funeral directors... when we get that,  hopefully I'll know some more. 

The second Lewis didn't serve on the Worcester only the Mildura (?), Karrakatta and Victory 2. Can I put a copy of the document onto the thread?  I wonder whether the middle name "Rossi" has been misread by the archivist as it's not very clear............

I'm also going to try and contact the Royal Navy - they must have a historical society or something....

Anyway - thank you very much for your ideas -  and for your help

Tilly

[ChristineR]

Can you prove that yours was not in Australia 1895 - 1897?

    oops, I was hoping to get rid of this bit before you saw it - suddenly realized that of course the Aussie born one was in England at his time, not Australia - at least for his training.

What about the 1901 census - if your fellow was in the RN he should show up.  I do not understand why they have named the ship on his headstone - unless he was appointed a permanent member of staff at that training school.  (My grand dad was moved from ship to ship - until he deserted in NZ 1907.)

But, interestingly yours is missing in 1881, when this one had quit the RN.  Your fellow should have been on the Worcester?

Now, you do get a chance here to work out if they are the same man - compare the description of your fellow with this one when you get to see the documents. 

In 1890 the ship Polaris was renamed Mildura -  was based at an Australian station before 1900, according to that web site I posted.  Karrakatta was also built for the Australian station.   I do not know if they did training here in Australia.

I would be interested in seeing the document - would you mind emailing it to me?  I will pop my email in a PM.  it is okay if you would rather not.

Another scenario - this fellow could be a cousin and they have both been named after the same person.

Christine 

[ChristineR]

Thanks for sending that Tilly.

I am sure that is Rossi is the middle name on the file, no doubt - and I asked my husband for his opinion (since he had no pre-conceived idea) and he said Rossi as well.

Now I see that he began right off as a 2nd class Stoker, and doesn't have to do the training that an AB seaman would.  His home port was Portsmouth - so was he in England, or Australia!  He might have been signed on specifically on to go from England to Australia with the Mildura - it was there before 1900, I didn't find a date.   

Anyway, sit on him until you get a look at your blokes file - to see if the dates given for his activities (and his description) preclude him from being the same man. 

As I said, he could be a cousin to your bloke - if the Rossi comes back from further up the line than the mother.  Pure co-incidence?

Those headstone photos are wonderful - I was admiring your luck on the NZ thread. 

I'll have a poke around and see if I can find any evidence of his existence downunder. 

Christine 

[tilly56]

Hello Christine

Could well be a cousin from somewhere - I'm waiting (and waiting - it seems to have got lost in the post!!) for a birth certificate for Lewis' mother - hoping that her mother's maiden name will be Rossi. Maybe a cousin on the Hardy side?  The fact that the ship's name is on the headstone makes me think that he might have been someone "at the top" on the Worcester, in what way, I don't know....

I've found an Archive site for the Royal Navy and I'm going to drop them a line.............see if they can help!

I'm posting the document about the Imposter Hardy  to see if anyone else has any ideas!

If the document from the Worcester Society thingy arrives before I go to England (should do it was posted yesterday) - I'll post the info on this thread.

Many thanks again for your help.

tilly