Have I found a German immigrant ancestor?

[lizziec]

I have been investigating my Kisler tree (in the Suffolk and London pages), and now need to look at where they came from - Germany. 

(Sorry, the message below is long - questions are at the end if you don't want to plough through it all!)

The earliest part of the family I have found apparently were all born in Germany, and presumably moved over here together... (info from various censuses, 1851 onwards...)

My German family as far as I know is...
John b 1777
Elizabeth (wife) b 1801
Elizabeth (daughter) b 1830
Jacob (son) b 1835

In the 1851 census they are in London living in the same house, though the daughter is married with a 1yo daughter (German son-in-law also living there - surname Dittmer). In a later census, Jacob appears to list his birthplace as Darmstadt.

I have been looking on the National Archive Catalogue web pages (www.catalogue.nationalarchives.gov.uk), to see if I could find their immigration or naturalisation records... There are none for Kislers that appear to be relevant, but there is a John August Kiesling from Saxony whose naturalisation papers were issued on 22 May 1858 (cert 2664)

I know that in the UK, the surname Kisler is quite unusual, but presumably is more common in Germany. However, I have also noticed Berlin Bob's note elsewhere about the possibility of name changes on immigration - so maybe it isn't so far off... Is there any chance this is my John?

Does naturalisation normally happen close to the date of immigration, or could it be several years after arrival (if they had only arrived just in time for the 1851 census, it would be 7 years after arrival). Could they chose not to naturalise? What information does the actual paperwork contain (birthdate? other family members? which might help to identify whether I have the right person?)

Thanks for any advice, information or pointers you may have...
Liz

[Berlin-Bob]

Hi Liz,

as far as I know, naturalisation wasn't /isn't compulsory.  If you thought you would benefit from it, then you did it, otherwise, --- why bother ?

Nowadays naturalisation means social sevice benefits and all sorts of "goodies", so I suppose it would be more common.

As to when, this could happen any time. I don't know if there are any rules; in Germany the rule is (was ?) you have to live here for 5 years, have a job, etc, etc.

Then there is the other extreme:
My g-grandfather was (supposedly) german, but in the 1901 cenus he gives place of birth as Stepney. My guess is that he came over illegally or semi-legally  and didn't want to draw unnecessary attention to himself and his circumstances.
So there will be many immigrants who were never naturalised, but whose children were british by birth.

PS.
My guess for KISLER would be KIESLER rather than KIESLING
in the Berlin telephone book there is one KISLER family and 25 KIESLERs !!
on a german gen. site GEDBAS: http://gedbas.genealogy.net/  there is one KISLER and 17 KIESLERs

Darmstadt is in Hessen, which is along way from Saxony !
 
PPS:

What information does the actual paperwork contain (birthdate? other family members? which might help to identify whether I have the right person?)

I started a thread on naturalisation records at Kew.
Immigrant Information at Kew: http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=21849.0
If you find out anything useful please add it there, for others.
Thanks.
Bob

[lizziec]

Thanks for your advice Bob.

It's unlikely this is my man... 

However I followed your link and eventually ended up in the London Gazette webpages, where I found some useful background for more recent family members,  so some good has come of this research...

Thanks again...

Liz