Patrish Scavenger Hunt.....Everybody Welcome to Join In.

[Brambletye]

Found Abraham and family on the 1851:

HO107/1543/212/2
12 Bell Lane Christchurch Spitalfields

Abraham Phillips 51 General Dealer
wife Hana 48
children Woolf 25 Cigar Maker (ah... ,
Sarah 17 Tailoress, Rosetta 15 Tailoress, Elizabeth 14, Priscilla 12 Scholar, Isaac 10.
All b. Aldgate.

No Henry, Emanuel or Michael at home - I'll have a punt round and see if anything useful turns up.

Just seen this again too...

Found Abraham Phillips 28 cigar maker living in West ham Essex in 1881. he is with Abigail (wife) and children Samuel 6, Rosetta 4, Philip 2, isabella 1.  From the name of the first son ... we have to assume that this is Samuel (brother of Emmanuel), son's family. If the above Abraham was Emmanuel's son , his first son would be named Emmanuel ...do I have this correct ? 

deb 

Both these families have a Rosetta, and both Samuel and Emanuel called their second son Abraham - just thinking out loud here...

Added ...that Abraham might be uncle to the Emanuel in his household in 1841, and not father?

[deb usa]

Hi Brambletye

I think that Abraham age 28 in 1881 ...is the son of samuel , samuel being the brother of Emmanuel ...I think errr 

my anc****y is on the blink

deb

this Abraham looks like he married abigail Martin in sept q 1874

[patrish]

Am I getting confused here

That cannot be Emmanuels brother Abraham the mother was only 50 on the 51 census. also he is on the 1881 as unmarried  aged 23

[deb usa]

pat ... just amended my last post to read Samuel was the brother of Emmanuel. Abraham is the son of Samuel

deb

[Brambletye]

Am I getting confused here

That cannot be Emmanuels brother Abraham the mother was only 50 on the 51 census. also he is on the 1881 as unmarried  aged 23

The Abraham Phillips age 28 in 1881 = b. c1852/3, making him son of Samuel & Hannah

The other Abraham b. 1856 was son of Emanuel & Susan

The Abraham age 42 in 1841 and 51 in 1851 is b. c1799/1800, making him a good age to be brother to your Emmanuel's father Phillip Phillips (with luck...!)

[cathayb]

there you are.i thought they were from the eastern bloc.  another point not all the perants may have emigrated here.often one family would bring alot of nephews with them so that the sons of those left in their native country could build a new life with better prospects for themselves.they are likely to be the first to marry out or drop jewish tradition unless uncle could keep a close eye on them.i would look fot any missing now in hampshire/dorset/sherwood as they the phillips def married into turners/birds and proberly others.cathayb

[Brambletye]

Another thought - Samuel Phillips & Hannah m. c 1850, had a son Michael in 1869.

Hannah was a Levy;  and Michael Phillips son of Abraham m. Abigail Martin in 1854, witnesses D. Levy and Moses Levy.

I know Levy is not an uncommon name, but it could connect Samuel to Michael if Michael's witnesses are connected to Hannah? and Samuel named a son Michael...

[deb usa]

is it a coincidence that Michael Phillips (s/o Abraham)  married Abigail Martin in 1854 and Abraham Phillips , s/o Samuel Phillips married an Abigail Martin in 1874!

deb

[Brambletye]

Could this be Samuel in 1841, possibly also not son of the head of household, but a nephew or some such?

HO107/706/3/31/2
106¹/₂ (no, really  ) Curtain Road, Shoreditch

Solomon Philips 40 Fruiterer
Mary 30
Susan 15
Samuel 11
Mary 15
Clara 7
Joseph 1¹/₂

....

is it a coincidence that Michael Phillips (s/o Abraham)  married Abigail Martin in 1854 and Abraham Phillips , s/o Samuel Phillips married an Abigail Martin in 1874!

deb

Good grief! well spotted, Deb...