Obtaining Asylum Records

[Simon G.]

I understand why they don't allow access to more recent records...can't say I especially agree with it though, except in cases where people are still living.  But indeed you could argue with most records...apart from to the family historian, what possible interest could these records be to anyone.

[Rewcastle]

This is a few years earlier than before the time of whats being discussed.
I've just found a possible distant relative, who was the proprietor of an asylum from the late 1820's onwards.  It seems, that there was money to be made in the trade in lunatics, which led to a scandal including the poor law commissioners and the then home secretary. I'm still looking into it, but he's a couple of links for reading.
 The 1832 Madhouse Act and the Metropolitan Commission in Lunacy from 1832
 England's Poor Law Commissioners and the Trade in Pauper Lunacy 1834-1847


Rewcastle.

[monkeymagik]

Hi again, I emailed the trust regarding my relatives records from Stanley Royd Asylum & have received a very polite, prompt reply. However not what I was hoping for.

For some reason, there are no surviving patient medical records from the 1970s on-wards (the hospital trust having destroyed later patient records).  Why would they do that?? Is this common practice? This seems absolutely ridiculous to me, the asylum did not close until the 90s.

Unless I know a possible date of admission of before 1970 ( which I don't)  then no documention will now survive.

If I did manage to by some miracle find out a date of admission for him before 1970 then it is only likely that a one-line entry in an admission register might be found. 

Hmmm, does this sound right to you?

Simon, I would be particularly interested to hear your view on this, given you actually did some work in this area. 



Rewcastle, That web site has a mountain of information, doesn't it! I have found a few interesting things on it in the last few weeks. I will have a good look at the links you posted.

[NadT]

Hi,
I was told a similar thing when trying to find details of my husband's great grandmother who was in the Salop and Montgomery Asylum.  We were told she had died in 1902 but I found that she was still alive in 1906 when her husband died but was a 'lunatic'.

Having contacted the now Shrewsbury Royal Hospital, after going back and forth many times from record office, to archives office and hospital, I was told that they could only confirm that my ancestor had been present in the asylum in the year in question (1906/7) because their records were incomplete.  I was told that many historical records had been detroyed according to old procedural requirements.  They couldn't tell me when she was admitted, what was wrong or even whether she was ever discharged or died there, just that she had been there.
Initially they tried to tell me that they couldn't give me any information because of the 100 year rule and that she may still be alive, until I pointed out that she would have been 37 when she was admitted and would now be 148 years old!!

I will have to wait until teh 1911 census and see if I can find her on that, if not, then we'll never know what happened to her.

[monkeymagik]

Hi NadT,  so you were told more or less the same as me. It seems very odd, how the different trusts deal with inquiries into asylum records, and that some have destroyed records & others haven't. I thought like you & others on this thread I would be challenged with the 100 yr rule as my relative only died in 1991, but they did not mention it! What I can't understand & this is a quote from the email I received

there are no surviving patient medical records from the 1970s on-wards (the hospital trust having destroyed later patient records).

Now if he had said no records prior to 1970 exist I could get my head around that a bit more, however technically there may be many people still alive whom resided in Stanley Royd after 1970,  what happened to their records? I suppose they must have been passed on to GPs, or something.
It just seems a bit funny,  given the investigations into the Hospital in 1984, that all records were
destroyed.

Maybe Its just the disappointment , of realising that I will probably never know what really happened to my relative, making me a bit bitter & suspicious.

I hope you have more luck with the 1911 census than I did with the Trust Records.

[NadT]

I don't really know when our reative actually died - no-one seems able to tell us.  The family all say she died in 1902, which is clearly not the case.  I'm not holding my breath as regards finding out what happended to her.  My guess would be that she probably died there - I've come to accept that we'll probably never know.  All a bit sad, as in 1906 (when we think she was likely committed -could have been earlier which would have been worse, as it would have likely been post natal depression as we now know it) her children were only 4 and 8, and they never knew their mother existed!)

We'll see when I get access to the 1911 census.

As for storage of records, there seems to be a huge discrepancy across the country over what records were held/destroyed.

I don't know what health  records are like, but I worked for a financial organisation some years ago and records that were 6 years old were sent for destruction via confidential waste (may have changed since!).  Maybe hospitals had the same sort of rules/timescales.  Might seem mad now but at the time I guess after 6 years maybe they felt that hanging onto records was of no real use.  It's only with our generation of genealogists that we start to question these types of procedures ?

Nad

[Pilgarlic]

This is a quote from an email sent to me from the Chief Archivist at the East Kent Archives re - Hospital records.

'I should point out that NHS trusts do not generally hang on to patient records once the records are 21 years old'.


Pilgarlic

[acorna]

Found this link which might help clarify NHS policy on retention of records, the links at the end of the page have very specific guidelines on MINIMUM timescales of when to destroy records. I guess it's up to individual trusts to decide if somethings of 'historical value', or possibly might even depend on whether or not archives are regularly checked and 'cleared out' of records past their destruction date! http://www.nhsdirect.nhs.uk/articles/article.aspx?articleId=1889

[monkeymagik]

  Hi, thanks for link acorna, do you by any chance work for NHS
you have posted some useful NHS links on this thread.   Cheers Nic.

Many thanks to Pilgarlic & Nad also.

Nic