Author Topic: Dating Photo and Altering Photo  (Read 5084 times)

Offline Claddagh

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Dating Photo and Altering Photo
« on: Wednesday 07 January 09 04:27 GMT (UK) »
Hello everyone,

Can anyone please help me with these two photos?  First of all could anyone remove the gold frame in the first photo so that I may place this photo in a frame?  Do you believe that it is the same woman in each of the photos?  Does she look English or could she be Jewish? 

Photo 1:  Undated elegant photo of a young woman who was born in 1866.

Photo 2:  Mother and young boys that were born in 1887 and 1890 respectively.  Can someone clean this photo please?  Could the shadow at the bottom of Emily's left hand be a large dog?

My 2nd great-grandmother Emily “Emma” Smith/Smyth was born in 1866 in London, England and married an Irishman named James Johnson who was born on July 4, 1865 in Dunlavin, Co. Wicklow, Ireland at Immaculate Conception, Mullingar, Ireland on June 13, 1886.

Her parents were wealthy jewellers/goldsmiths in London and disowned her for marrying an Irishman.  One story says that she was a Protestant and that’s why she was disowned and another states that she was Jewish. 

I have often wondered if the intricate brooches on the collar of her dress might indicate if her family was English or Jewish.  I hope to find someone who can steer me in the right direction. 

Her husband was a military man who joined the 11th Hussars British Army and served in South Africa before the Boer War.  She died of tuberculosis on March 11, 1901 in London, England.  She was living in a rooming house in a section of London which I’ve been told is a predominant Jewish neighbourhood.  Her children were living with her in-laws in Ireland and she was working as a seamstress in London.  Her husband was in South Africa acquiring a parcel of land that was being offered to military personnel and was coming back to retrieve his family.  I have been unable to find his burial place but when his 2nd son married in London in 1917 it indicated that his both his parents were deceased.

She is my genealogy brick wall and I can’t wait to finally find her family history.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Take care and keep smiling!

Claddagh
Dunlavin, Co. Wicklow, Ireland:  Johnson, Donnelly, Lenhan/Lennan/Lennon, Heydon/Hayden

Co. Cavan, Ireland: Kiernan
Co. Sligo, Ireland: McGowan

Co. Tyrone, Ireland: Brogan, Curran, McBride, McDade, McDaid, McFadden, McFaiden, Nolan

London, England:  Smith/Smyth
Scotland: McGoun

Offline Finley 1

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Re: Dating Photo and Altering Photo
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 07 January 09 08:38 GMT (UK) »
just removed the frame.  xin

Offline PrueM

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Re: Dating Photo and Altering Photo
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 07 January 09 08:45 GMT (UK) »
Hi Claddagh  :)
Welcome to Rootschat and the Photo Restoration board!  :D

First of all, I would say that the ladies in your two photo are one and the same.  They definitely have a very similar look to them, even though the detail is lost in the second pic.

The first picture seems to date from 1889-1891 or thereabouts, judging by the little puff at the top of the sleeves.  The hairstyle is unusual but the fringe and 'up-do' suggest the early 1890s as well.  It's a beautiful picture  :)

The second picture would date from the mid-late, going by the lady's blouse (with big puffy sleeves) and skirt combo, and the sailor suits of the little boys.  Not sure about the odd misty shape, but there's nothing to suggest it's a dog (usually you'll see something solid amidst the mist if it's a moving object) - could be some kind of anomaly on the film or light damage to the print....or a ghost!  ;)

Hope that helps  :)

Prue

Offline Dave Hall

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Re: Dating Photo and Altering Photo
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 07 January 09 14:39 GMT (UK) »
Hi Claddagh,
Welcome to the "Gang"
Heres a quick tidy from me
Dave
HALL,PITTS, RAISTRICK,BRADLEY,FEATHER,HENDY,RAMSAY,BENTHAM,CARRINGTON,DODGSON,FLUEN,ILEY,CLAPHAM,BOLLARD,WOODYER,WEBB,TURTON,RUDDOCK
Please feel free to alter/adjust any of my work


Offline Niksmum

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Re: Dating Photo and Altering Photo
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 07 January 09 14:39 GMT (UK) »
Hi there,
A clean from me

Irene


Welcome to the restoration board  :)
Buckinghamshire-Babbs<br />Somerset-Smith<br />Woolwich-Elliott<br />London-Elliott, Hare,Baker

Restorers please do NOT use any restores done by me without my permission

Offline mudge

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Re: Dating Photo and Altering Photo
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 07 January 09 16:33 GMT (UK) »
Hi Claddagh,
Here's a variation of the first image
mudge

Offline Finley 1

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Re: Dating Photo and Altering Photo
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 07 January 09 17:49 GMT (UK) »
a fun one! xin

Offline Claddagh

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Re: Dating Photo and Altering Photo
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 07 January 09 18:28 GMT (UK) »
Hello everyone,

Many thanks for your warm welcome!

Xinia – Thanks so much!  The photo looks amazing and now I can place it in the round antique frame that I purchased.  The second photo looks so grand.

PrueM – Thanks so much for your expertise!  I too thought that they were one in the same.  It was the striking difference in colouring that took me by surprise.  In general, do indoor and outdoor photography of that era cause individuals to vary in hair and eyes colouring?   Emily’s husband had light gray eyes, one son had gray, and another had cornflower blue eyes and the other two I don’t know.  Since I don’t own the original photo I couldn’t say for certain that it’s stained or damaged but I like the ghost theory as it ties in with all things mystically Irish. 

Do you know where I might post to find someone who is an expert in jewellery of that era?  I wonder if he/she might be able to look at the brooches and pin point where they were made and by whom.  Maybe it was created by her father who was a goldsmith.  I wonder if “Smith/Smyth” might not be a surname that was given to her father because of his occupation.  He might have been a Schmidt for all I know.  It is impossible for me to see just by looking at her if she is “English”, "Scottish", “German” or “Jewish”.  I know nothing about her family and since the surnames “Johnson” and “Smith-Smyth” are two of the most common surnames.  I am lucky to have found what I have thus far and owe an enormous thanks to my cousin in England whose grandmother Bridget Johnson Byrne left invaluable family treasures for all of us to savour.

Dave Hall – Thanks so much!  I love the frame that you added to the photo.  I’ll add it to my family tree.

Niksmum - Thanks so much!  The photo has such an eerie quality that brings them to life. 

Mudge – Thanks so much!  The sepia gives the photo a totally different look!  I like it a lot!

I’ve added two photos in the hopes that you can see a family resemblance.

Photo 1:  Emily Smith/Smyth and probably her husband James Johnson.  It’s not very clear but it’s all I have.  If anyone can sharpen the image I’d be very grateful.

Photo 2:  Emily Johnson their daughter (1899-1914).  A family member mentions that she was always a sickly child but she appears to be healthy in this photo.  Can someone please date this photo?

I cannot thank all of you enough for your generosity of spirit.  May the genealogy angels watch over all of you.

Take care and keep smiling!

Claddagh

 ;) ;) ;)



Dunlavin, Co. Wicklow, Ireland:  Johnson, Donnelly, Lenhan/Lennan/Lennon, Heydon/Hayden

Co. Cavan, Ireland: Kiernan
Co. Sligo, Ireland: McGowan

Co. Tyrone, Ireland: Brogan, Curran, McBride, McDade, McDaid, McFadden, McFaiden, Nolan

London, England:  Smith/Smyth
Scotland: McGoun

Offline Claddagh

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Re: Dating Photo and Altering Photo
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 07 January 09 18:31 GMT (UK) »
Xinia,

I just noticed the dog in the family photo.  I must be in the clouds.  I had three Samoyeds when I was a child what beautiful, intelligent and faithful dogs.

Thanks so much for making me smile!

Claddagh

       ;)
Dunlavin, Co. Wicklow, Ireland:  Johnson, Donnelly, Lenhan/Lennan/Lennon, Heydon/Hayden

Co. Cavan, Ireland: Kiernan
Co. Sligo, Ireland: McGowan

Co. Tyrone, Ireland: Brogan, Curran, McBride, McDade, McDaid, McFadden, McFaiden, Nolan

London, England:  Smith/Smyth
Scotland: McGoun