Richard W Glasspoole, died Birkenhead 1924

[Laini]

Hi everyone

Not sure if this is correct county to put this but here goes. I am looking for info on Richard W Glasspoole died Birkenhead sept 1924. Its a long story that crosses from Liverpool, Shrewsbury, Birkenhead and Wrexham.

If you're sitting comfortably then i'll begin.

What i'm actually looking for is info and an opinion on whether I am looking at the correct family.

My g/f was born Keith Glasspoole 1911 at Raven Meadow cottage, smithfield, Shrews  (father unknown) mother Nellie Glasspoole nee Parr. Next child Sarah Glasspoole born Wrexham 1912 (father unknown) mother Ellen Glasspoole nee Parr. More children but born to Ellen/Nellie/Catherine and John Edward Williams. From family memory Ellen/Nellie/Cath... all same person (very quiet and private person died late 1950's and nobody knows where she was born)

I have a marriage cert for Ellen Parr and Richard W Glasspoole L'pool 1904 but she was in service in Shrews in 1911 (re- Keith). Ellens fathers name given as John Alcock. I have a fair bit of info on this Glasspoole family, all census etc . Whats the chances I have the correct family. Another piece of the puzzle that fits is that Ellen married John Edward in 1924, the same year as Richard dies in Birkenhead (they must have lived over the brush cos they have more children before 1924)

I am fairly certain I have correct Glasspoole family but my living family are very dubious without any info to back it up.

So my question is what are the chances that her name on cert is Glasspoole nee Parr (plus her name Ellen) and finding a marriage record with that name marrying a Glasspoole? Why did she go into service in Shrews if a married woman (Richard a solicitors clerk, his father James a sea captain) Why no father  known if she married. How did she end up in Pentre Broughton Wrexham.

I need to find out if Richard was married when he died which would throw doubt on my guess that Ellen waited till he died to marry John edward or that he was in actual fact married to another Ellen which prob means I got wrong Glasspooles.

Biggest question being why they didnt stay together prob never going to get an answer to that but got many theories!

Does any of that make sense. Anyone going to Birkenhead Records and can check an obit for Richard.

Thanks. Elaine

[junev]

Hi Elaine,

I presume Ethel Cecilia b 1905 West Derby is the child of Richard William Glasspoole as she marries in 1927 (James R Manley) in Egremont and Richard died in Wallasey (Cheshire BMD gives the area better) - Ethel & James had at least 3 children registered in Birkenhead.

Does Ethel feature in the family history - did she live with her father if as you say her mother was in service when she has Keith.

They would be on the 1911 census but sadly I don't have access - I think that is what you need especially as Keith was born in the first quarter of 1911.

Also how old was Ellen when she died (i.e when do you think she was born)? Are there any more children after Eva b 1924 as she would have been early 40's by then?

June

[cath151]

Deleted, will send pm.
Cathy

[Laini]

Hi June & Cath.

Thanks for info. Its the same Glasspoole family that i've been tracing but the only connection I can make is the M. cert of Parr & Glasspoole. Not exactly common names but could be completely different Ellen Parr.

Ellen born c. 1883 no location, died 1950's. (father John Alcock info from same M. cert so could be wrong)

The family story goes that she was in service in Shrews, never turned up for chores one morn and when checked on, found she given birth on her own in the night. From calculations that makes her 28, not exactly a slip of a girl. Address given on Keiths b. cert Bridge Inn, Moss, Wrexham. Next child Sarah, address given as Old Sweet Shop, Moss, father unknown again but is generally accepted by family that Keith was the only child that was not Johns. So did she return to family around here.

No children after Eva and PROMTLY marries John 1924 when Glasspoole dies. Coincidence? No family mention of a child before Keith.

Her m. cert to John states her name as Catherine. B. cert of Keith as Nellie and B. cert of Sarah as Ellen. Her g/d says her name was Catherine but always known as Nellie. No other family history info except that John brought Keith up as his own and just before Keith married he changed his name to Williams for 2 shillings.

Getting bogged down with tunnel vision with this Glasspoole family but I could be putting 2+2 together....... It driving me mad.

Elaine

[Neptune]

Hi everyone -
I've been having a look to see what I could find
I haven't looked at the original 1911 census but was able to find Richard W Glasspoole in the index and he was living in the household of the following in West Derby Liverpool -
1911
Ellen Dix  b1863 age 48
Ellen Elizabeth Glasspoole b1884 age 27
Ethel Cecilia Glasspoole b 1905 age 6
Ethel may Glasspoole b1886 age 25
Richard William Glasspoole b1882 age 29
Living at 8 Osterley Gardens Walton Liverpool

Marriage Free BMD Ellen Glasspoole and Charles Henry Dix 1894 West Derby
So their mother married again to Charles Dix

1901
Charles H. Dix  Head age 39  Master Mariner(merchant service) b Silverdale Staffs
Ellen  Wife age 41 b Liverpool Lancs
James H.  Glasspoole stepson age 20 clerk(board of trade) b London Chelsea
Richard W. Glasspoole stepson age 19 solicitor's clerk law b Seaforth Lancs
Ellen E.Glasspoole stepdaughter age 17 b Litherland Lancs
Ethel M.Glasspoole stepdaughter age 15 b Litherland Lancs
Living at 28 Brook Road Bootle

Marriage  Free BMD James Glasspoole and Ellen Harrison  June qtr 1879 Liverpool
So James might have died and Ellen then married Charles Henry Dix

At first I thought that in 1911 Richard W. was living with his wife Ellen  Elizabeth but when you compare the details with the 1901 it could be that Ellen Elizabeth is his sister(Ellen E. in 1901),
He seems to be with his mother Ellen (who remarried to C.Dix) and his sisters Ellen E. and Ethel M.

Could it be that Ethel Cecilia is his daughter (and the daughter of his wife Ellen Parr) who has now left and is living in Wales where Keith is soon to be born?
She did get married in 1927 in St Johns Egremont(Wallasey area)Cheshire and Richard W. died in Wallasey.

The original 1911 census or her birth certificate would give her relationship to Richard.

I think you might have the right family but Ellen Glasspoole(Parr) seems to have left by 1911 and has maybe gone to Wales?

Good Luck

Neptune

[Laini]

Hi Neptune

Got most of that and a bit more from 19th century newspaper site. James G died in Santos Brazil of Yellow fever (Captain of SS Buffon)

It good to see that someone agrees with me that this is the correct Glasspoole family and your take on it seems to be the same as mine. Looks like Ellen did a runner (wonder why but will prob never get answer to that unless I find descendents that have a family story or skeleton in the cupboard)

Isnt it funny that I managed to trace a pile of Jones' to 1730's but with a name like Glasspoole I could barely get past 1911.

Thanks
elaine

[Laini]

Hi everyone

The 1911 wales census finally made the connection i was looking for so thanks to you all for the help along the way

[Rowlandson]

Hi Elaine,

Just stumbled across your posting regarding Ellen/Catherine Parr~Glasspoole~Williams. 

I'm currently researching her second husbands family, the Williamses. John Edward was a 1st cousin to my great grandfather.

Have a couple of obits etc, should you like copies, Just PM me.

Regards,

Rowlandson

[GrumpyLing]

Hi all,

I discovered your research into my family when arriving at this site

R W Glasspoole was my great grandfather on my mothers side and Ethel Cecilia Glasspoole was my maternal grandmother.  I have not previously been able to trace a wife to RWG or a mother for ECG.

It would make sense that Ellen Parr ( it does not help that there are other Ellen's in the family )
is the mother of RWG (although I have never seen birth/marriage certs or the like).  The other information I have seen with regard to census seems all correct.  Note that ECG was born in 1905 with a marriage reported (by Elaine) for RWG and EP as 1904, maybe this was one of those (9 month) events that in those days were kept hushed up.  I think that EP could have been in service with the family?

Anyway let me know if you need more info on the family in general, particularly for the "more modern" era.

Reds

Dinga