Author Topic: Liffen, Hacon, Bayes - Norfolk  (Read 8563 times)

Offline lizb

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Liffen, Hacon, Bayes - Norfolk
« on: Friday 06 February 09 21:51 GMT (UK) »
I am trying to trace the family of one of my ancestors, Elizabeth Liffen.

ELizabeth was born in Norfolk (per 1851 and 1861 census) but moved to London and in 1836 married Samuel Howe. They continued to live in LOndon but their son Samuel, who was born in July 1847, gives his place of birth as Old Catton, Norfolk.

I have previously corresponded with someone at the Old Catton family history society who was unable to find any trace of Samuel or Elizabeth in Old Catton.
However, in the 1841 census there is a Sarah Liffen living in Catton. So I am assuming that SArah was ELizbeth's mother and that ELizabeth was visiting her when her son was born.

I have not been able to establish anything else about the family. I am aware that the LIffen family originated in Norfolk and Suffolk, but this is a new area of research for me. Hence I would be glad of any advice on tracing them further. Even better, contact with someone who has knowledge of this family.

BEDFORDSHIRE/HERTFORDSHIRE: Coles, Marsom, Hurst
BERKSHIRE/WILTSHIRE: Huntley, Williams,  Maslin, Pinnell, Watson, Gulliver, Penny
DERBYSHIRE: Brinsley
DEVON: Bidgood, Northam, Gillard, Westlake
GLOUCESTER: Abrahams, Pritchard, Washburn
IRELAND: Dean, Bateman
MIDDLESEX: Howe, Leah, Truelove
NEW ZEALAND: Bishop, Frankham, Oliver, Gribble
NORFOLK: Liffen, Hacon
SOMERSET: Bishop, Bridges, Palmer, Newport, Barrow, Hill, Wise, Boyte

Offline Annette7

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 7,267
    • View Profile
Re: Liffen - Norfolk
« Reply #1 on: Friday 06 February 09 22:33 GMT (UK) »
If I've found the right family in 1851 this states Elizabeth was bc.1814 Acle,  Norfolk.

Nothing on IGI but I looked on FreeReg and found:

Elizabeth Liffen bp.22/5/1813 St. Edmund, Acle d. of Henry Liffen and Sarah Hacon.

There are other childrens baptisms there also plus parents married 1790.

Annette
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline lizb

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liffen - Norfolk
« Reply #2 on: Friday 06 February 09 23:23 GMT (UK) »
Thank you very much.

YOu have got me past my stumbling block. I did not recognise the work Acle and did so did not note it when I looked at the census. It shows how useful is a fresh pair of eyes. I am looking forward to taking my tree forward - and improving my knowledge of the geography of Norfolk.

Liz
BEDFORDSHIRE/HERTFORDSHIRE: Coles, Marsom, Hurst
BERKSHIRE/WILTSHIRE: Huntley, Williams,  Maslin, Pinnell, Watson, Gulliver, Penny
DERBYSHIRE: Brinsley
DEVON: Bidgood, Northam, Gillard, Westlake
GLOUCESTER: Abrahams, Pritchard, Washburn
IRELAND: Dean, Bateman
MIDDLESEX: Howe, Leah, Truelove
NEW ZEALAND: Bishop, Frankham, Oliver, Gribble
NORFOLK: Liffen, Hacon
SOMERSET: Bishop, Bridges, Palmer, Newport, Barrow, Hill, Wise, Boyte


Offline lizb

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liffen, Hacon, Bayes - Norfolk
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 08 February 09 10:12 GMT (UK) »
Thanks to the  Acle hint I have taken this family back a couple of generations. But I have got to the stage when some other look up help is needed.

1) I am looking for the birth of Sarah Hacon, ELizabeth's mother. Her parents were Isaac and SArah HAcon who were marrried in NOrwich in1764 . They are the only HAcon family in Acle at the time and they had other children baptised there from 1772 onwards. Sarah  died in 1852 age 81 (?). So I am looking in  between 1765 and 1771. Sarah is not in the ACle transcription but could have been missed off or christened elsewhere. (Note variants of HAcon - Haken etc)

2) I am looking for the birth of Isaac Hacon. I have found possible parents Isaac and Ann who were married in 1748. I have not found any children. If the younger Isaac was born about 1748 he is old enough to have married in 1864. It is an unusual name so likely to be the same family. I wondered if a look up of two marriages would help establish ages.
Isaac Haken and Sarah Bayes were married St Andrews Norwich 23 Jul 1764
Isaac Hakin and Ann Bays were married in All SAints, Salhouse in 1748

3) I am looking for the birth of Sarah Bayes. There are several possible in the period 1734 to 1749. I am hoping her marriage (see 2 above) will provide names of parents or a hint as to her age.


Thank you
LIz


BEDFORDSHIRE/HERTFORDSHIRE: Coles, Marsom, Hurst
BERKSHIRE/WILTSHIRE: Huntley, Williams,  Maslin, Pinnell, Watson, Gulliver, Penny
DERBYSHIRE: Brinsley
DEVON: Bidgood, Northam, Gillard, Westlake
GLOUCESTER: Abrahams, Pritchard, Washburn
IRELAND: Dean, Bateman
MIDDLESEX: Howe, Leah, Truelove
NEW ZEALAND: Bishop, Frankham, Oliver, Gribble
NORFOLK: Liffen, Hacon
SOMERSET: Bishop, Bridges, Palmer, Newport, Barrow, Hill, Wise, Boyte

Offline Itypeslowly2013

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 7
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liffen, Hacon, Bayes - Norfolk
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 13 February 13 10:11 GMT (UK) »
 :D
Hi Lizb, this is so exciting, I've been waiting YEARS to connect with somebody from this line! My ancestor was John Liffen, the brother of Elizabeth. I believe Isaac Hacon's family were Quakers which is why they don't appear in many registers, but I think I may have discovered his birth parish. Hope to hear from you!!

Offline lizb

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liffen, Hacon, Bayes - Norfolk
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 13 February 13 23:03 GMT (UK) »
It's good to hear from you. I have not got much further on this line since my post. Your comment about the HACUN (HAKEN) family being Quakers makes sense. The earliest I have found them is a marriage in Norwich in 1748. However I have noted that there were family in the Netherlands circa 1680. And I have found references to the family roots possibly being in Norway. I am waiting for a prompt of some sort to start me searching again!
BEDFORDSHIRE/HERTFORDSHIRE: Coles, Marsom, Hurst
BERKSHIRE/WILTSHIRE: Huntley, Williams,  Maslin, Pinnell, Watson, Gulliver, Penny
DERBYSHIRE: Brinsley
DEVON: Bidgood, Northam, Gillard, Westlake
GLOUCESTER: Abrahams, Pritchard, Washburn
IRELAND: Dean, Bateman
MIDDLESEX: Howe, Leah, Truelove
NEW ZEALAND: Bishop, Frankham, Oliver, Gribble
NORFOLK: Liffen, Hacon
SOMERSET: Bishop, Bridges, Palmer, Newport, Barrow, Hill, Wise, Boyte

Offline Itypeslowly2013

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 7
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liffen, Hacon, Bayes - Norfolk
« Reply #6 on: Friday 15 February 13 15:17 GMT (UK) »
The Hacon family were long established in Norfolk and Suffolk, I believe they were Danes originally, for instance, the Lord of the Manor of Swaffham was a Dane named Hacon. But I think there is also a connection with Lincolnshire in the mid medieval period.

I'm not sure whether the Isaac Hacon who married Ann Bayes is the same man who married Sarah Bayes some years later. It's not impossible, though, of course it could be his son. Ann was buried at Ashby by Loddon in 1761, so Isaac could have remarried in 1764 to Sarah. Ann was the daughter of Thomas and Ann Bayes, she had a brother named Thomas, living in Salhouse. Isaac was 'of Acle' when they married in 1748. When I was visiting the Norfolk & Norwich FHS Library I was given the advice that Isaac and Sarah's allowed move and settlement from Acle to the parish of Salhouse meant that he was probably a key worker and that I should research the local lord of the manor for estate records.

At Acle there are burial records for Isaac Hacon died 1805 and his widow Elizabeth who died in 1807, so did he marry for a third time, or was this his son?

I wish more Norfolk parish information was online as I can't get up to Norfolk to do research. I did find a little info in the Society of Genealogists holdings: I found Isaac Haykin (brn c1725) with wife Ann at Ashby. This is Ashby by Loddon where Quaker Hacons lived, and the earliest Hacon baptism I have recorded is in 1620 of Robert, son of Robert and Rebecca. They have links too with Norwich and Sco Ruston. It seems that there were three Hacon brothers Robert, William and George. Possibly the sons of Edward who was an inhabitant of the village in 1603. As a note to that, the first name 'Edward' isn't used at all by other Hacon families in Norfolk.

I own a document dated 1725 which shows a connection between the Ashby family and cousins (I assume) in Roughton, Yelverton, and thence back to Gawdy Hacon (and his wife Bridget Gosling) at Topcroft, whose line goes back in that parish to c1491.

Our Sarah Hacon married Henry Liffen in 1791. Her sister Mary married Samuel Barber (or Barker) in 1786 and I believe she remarried in 1817 to John Rix at Upton. The other sister Ann married Peter Browne in 1796 but I find no more references to them....they may have moved away or she died. Browne is too common a name to be sure of anyone. Sarah Liffen died in 1852 at Old Catton by Norwich where she lived with her daughter Sarah Lambert (wife of Edward) and her granddaughter Mary Anne Liffen.

My ancestor is Sarah's younger brother John who moved to London and married there in 1826.

Have you researched the Liffen line at all?

Offline lizb

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liffen, Hacon, Bayes - Norfolk
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 20 February 13 14:10 GMT (UK) »
I have assumed that two Isaacs, father and son, married Ann and Sarah Bayes. But it could  be as you suggest.

I traced Sarah in Old Catton because her daughter Elizabeth was there when her son Samuel Howe born in 1847.

I have not been able to visit Norwich Records Office but can visit SOG occasionally. However I am driving through Norfolk  next month and have requested we stop to have a look at Acle to look at the church. Have you been there? If not are you interested in pictures?

I have not got very far on the Liffens either. I have assumed our Henry was son of Robert Liffen who was buried in Acle in 1795 and ELizabeth who was buried in 1805. Need to trace connection with Liffen families of Lowestoft and great Yarmouth. How far have you got?
BEDFORDSHIRE/HERTFORDSHIRE: Coles, Marsom, Hurst
BERKSHIRE/WILTSHIRE: Huntley, Williams,  Maslin, Pinnell, Watson, Gulliver, Penny
DERBYSHIRE: Brinsley
DEVON: Bidgood, Northam, Gillard, Westlake
GLOUCESTER: Abrahams, Pritchard, Washburn
IRELAND: Dean, Bateman
MIDDLESEX: Howe, Leah, Truelove
NEW ZEALAND: Bishop, Frankham, Oliver, Gribble
NORFOLK: Liffen, Hacon
SOMERSET: Bishop, Bridges, Palmer, Newport, Barrow, Hill, Wise, Boyte

Offline Harwood

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 46
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Liffen, Hacon, Bayes - Norfolk
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 20 February 13 21:44 GMT (UK) »
You might find these two sites useful:-
www.tinstaafltranscripts  & www.norfolktranscriptionarchive