Evan EVANS, miller, Newtown

[devonblue]

My Great Grandfather was Evan EVANS a miller who variously said he was born at Abergethy/Newtown/Montgomeryshire depending on which census you read.  His father was also Evan EVANS also a miller. I have no knowledge of any of his family whatsoever other than his father's name on his marriage certificate.

Now with a name like that I can't find any clue as to which of several mine is. I have searched the 1851 census of Newown and there appear to be several.  There are also several born in 1844 with similar father's names.  The place name Abergethy does not appear to exist and I can't find anything similar.

By 1871 Evan jnr was living in Birmingham and went on to have grocer's shops.  The story fed down through the family was that he walked to Birmingham to find work.

He has been my brick wall for over 10 years so anyone's ideas to  help me find the real Evan Evans would be most welcome.

[silvery]

1871  RG10/3147/78/58

He is a lodger with Richard Bull 55 adn Sarah Bull 54
Evan Evans 27, flour miller b Abermele, Montgomeryshire
David Evan 23, flour miller b Abermele, Montgomeryshire


The birthplace in the 1881 census is unclear, at the end, indicated by the dots.   
Name:    Evan Evans
Spouse:    Ellen
Birth:    abt 1844 - Abergethy..., Montgomeryshire, Wales
Residence:    1881 - Aston, Warwickshire, England

Did you follow up this suggestion?
http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/POWYS/2008-01/1201015883

[silvery]

I would think David Evans is his brother.   If you could get his marriage certificate it would confirm the name of the father.  I am wondering if, on the marriage cert for Evan, he has given his own name and occupation instead of his fathers.  It has been known to happen.

So following David through

1881  RG11/2967/66/29

David Evans 33 master baker b Newtown Montgomeryshire
Mary 32 b Shrewsbury
Ernest J 1 b Birmingham

1891  RG12/2463/97/5
David Evans 43 baker b Newtown Montg
Mary 42 b Shrewsbury
Ernest 11 b Birmingham
Sidney 9 b Birmingham

1901 RG13/2923/120/8
David Evans 53 baker and confectioner b Newtown
Mary 52 b Shrewsbury
John E 21 baker b Birmingam
Sidney H baker b Birmingham

births
Sept 1879 Birmingham 6d/30    John Ernest Evans

March 1881 Birmingham 6d/17  Sidney Herbert Evans

One of these would give the maiden name for Mary, and you could get the marriage cert.   

[devonblue]

Thanks for that.  I have him on the all censuses from 1871 but I have never been 100% sure that the 1871 record is definitely him.

As for the previous suggestion on the Powys list I have never been in a position to follow this up, ie I am unable to go to Wales and look at the PRs myself.  However,  I discovered yesterday that Powys library service now do look-ups for a fee so I have ordered a search of the records for Llamyrewig online.

Just got to sit tight and wait for the results which should come in about a month's time.

I'd still be interested in any other information anyone else might have about EVANS millers in this area.

As I typed this I have just seen your new reply and I had never thought of trying to get David's marriage cert for the father's name. Thanks for the idea.

[silvery]

If you get any other information do come back and let us know, we're always keen to hear 

[devonblue]

Well an amazingly quick reply from Powys County Archives unfortunately revealed nothing.

They searched Llamyrewig, Betws Cedewain and Llandysul PRs  between 1838 and 1850 - no sign of an Evan Evans with a father being a miller.  They also searched Llamyrewig 1851 census and found none (I had already done that).  As the person pointed out the 1851 census of Wales has loads of Evan Evanses born in Montgomershire so you can't tell which one is which.

The only suggestion they made was to widen the search to other parishes around Abermule.

Time to get the certs for brother John now I think.

[devonblue]

OK.......

Next link in the chain:

Birth cert for John Ernest EVANS b 4 Aug 1879 Birmingham reveals father David EVANS and mother Mary Evans nee ROGERS.

FreeBMD has a marriage in Sept Q 1878 in Kings Norton District so I am now awaiting that cert.  This should tell us who David's and possibly Evan's father was. I ordered it directly from Birmingham and as the last one was here in under 48 hours I shouldn't have that long to wait!

Interestingly Albert Davis EVANS's (Evan's son) marriage cert has a witness Ernest Evans whom I have never been able to trace.

[silvery]

Here's  hoping 

It will be interesting to see what is on the marriage cert, for sure.  The witness Ernest Evans is very intriguing, I wonder if it is John Ernest.   It sounds very possible.

[silvery]

Just having a bit of a look, 

http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/MGY/indexpars.html#A

could the place they were trying to say (in a Welsh accent, say, in Birmingham) be this  -    Aberrhiw - see Berriew.   About 13 miles from Newtown.   

May be no help of course ........