Author Topic: lost,lost,LOST! - completed -  (Read 3206 times)

Offline sandie

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Re: lost,lost,LOST!
« Reply #27 on: Wednesday 30 March 05 20:03 BST (UK) »
Sorry, I'm back, still looking for Charles Welch.

Sadly my uncle passed away last week, but his daughter told me she had spoke to him again about my grandfather and asked if there was anything else he could remember.  He told her that he knew little of him because he never spoke about his life and kept himself to himself, umm... not very helpful of him!  Anyway, as no one seemed to think the '91 stepson was the correct Charles, I thought I would try again to find his father WILLIAM WELCH, LIGHTERMAN in either 1891 or 1901 censuses.  I thought if the occupation had been 'upgraded' then perhaps he had a lesser job on the docks, canals.  Guess what?  I cannot find a William Welch with a son Charles Henry.
Please, pleeease, can anyone help me find these two people living at the same address in Camberwell/Peckham/Bermondsey areas in either 1891 or 1901?

Regards
Sandie
Lewis & Davies in Glam.
Richards & Roberts,  in Carmarthen & Glam.
Bowen & Morgans in Carm.
Walters & Mort in Glam.
Dinmore, in SE London (prev.Surrey & Kent), Lowestoft & Yorks.
Collier/Collyer, Tyler & Welch in SE London(prev.Surrey)

All census transcriptions are Crown Copyright

Offline Bryant

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Re: lost,lost,LOST!
« Reply #28 on: Thursday 31 March 05 00:29 BST (UK) »
Sandie

You have definitely become a lovable pest...so this is my best shot.........it's not only my best shot......its what actually happened.....it just needs you to dot the eyes and cross the tees

Charles when he married declared his father as William.........but he wasn't referring to William Welch, he was referring to William Arnall who is probably a barge lighterman in 1891......he is definitely a barge lighter something but it is getting late and i'm modifying this every 5 minutes when I realise something else!

1885...Dec qtr...St Saviour Southwark, vol 1d, page 48........William Arnall marries Louisa Welch

1891 Census
318 Rolls Road, Bermondsey
William Arnall   head   44  cony lighterwide barge  ???   Horsleydown, Surrey
Louisa     "       wife     42                                                Middlesex
Fred  Welch    stepson 20  lab                                        Bermondsey
George  "            "        19  g lab                                            "
Percy     "            "        15      "                                              "
Charles  "            "         7                                                      "
Eleanor Arnall   daur      5                                                      "
Ethel         "          "        2.5                                                   "
Edward     "       son       1.5                                                   "
~~~~~~~~----------------
This means that whoever Charles father is died/disappeared when he was no older than one or two or possibly before he was born!.........he knew no other father than William Arnall...he died in 1896 aged 50...St Olave Southwark, Dec qtr, vol 1d, page 155

This is his blood father...........
Frederick P Welch married Louisa Glover at Lambeth in the June qtr of 1866, vol 1d, page 434.............did he die and leave Louisa a widow? ....did he divorce?....did he or her just leave?

1871 census
112 Abbey Street, Bermondsey
Frederick J Welch  head  25   Cooper    Brackley, Buckinghamshire
Louisa          "        wife   23                  Hackney, Middx
Frederick J    "        son     6 months      Bermondsey

1881 census
78 Paradise Street, Rotherhithe
Fredk. J.P.Welch  head  34   cooper   Buckingham
Louisa Alice    "    wife   33                 Finchley
Fredk. Joseph "    son    10                Bermondsey
Geo. Edward  "      "        8                          "
Percy Edmond "     "        6                          "
Rose Louisa    "   daur     7 months             " 

*Rose Louisa Welch was born Sept qtr 1880 St Olave.............she could well have had a baby named Rose Louisa Welch in the Sept qtr of 1899 Camberwell.........and she married the following year...1900 June qtr Camberwell

*George Edward Welch was born Dec qtr 1872 St Olave
*Percy Edmund Welch was born Dec qtr 1874 St Olave
*Frederick Joseph Welch was born Dec qtr 1870 St Olave

1901 and Charles?............ Arnall is a surname made for transcribing wrongly! but I reckon he is in the Forces somewhere...........his father died (William Arnall) in 1896...he is the oldest child as his older brothers have all left the nest and he has now become the breadwinner........he joined the forces

.........over to you

Bryant  8)   
Researching names BRYANT (Camberwell), PASTERFIELD (Essex and all), RAY (Holborn/Islington areas back to Brentford), POWELL (Glouc & beyond?)
Fletcher (Glouc into Warwickshie into Lancs?), BUCKLEY (Chatham area), Watson (Chatham area).


Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline sandie

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Re: lost,lost,LOST!
« Reply #29 on: Thursday 31 March 05 10:44 BST (UK) »
Bryant

You are an angel!
You are also the only person who seems to agree with me that William Welch is actually William Arnell.
The info. you have given is more or less what I gave to my cousins, with the exeption of Frederick and Louisa's marriage, I found a Frederick Joseph P Welch and Louisa Bateman in Bermondsey in Dec. 1869.  The main reason for my optimism was the sibling names - my father, William Henry Welch had brothers, Frederick, George, Edward and Charles.  The elder of my two cousins dismissed it outright, saying the names meant nothing, why would he use the same names?  You can tell she isn't into family history can't you?  The second cousin agreed with me.  She changed her mind when I told her the only Charles Welch born in St. Olaves was Charles William.  That's why I had to go back to square one.  Personally I still think I have the correct one I just don't know why anyone would alter their middle name!!
At least now, if I can't find a William and Charles together, I can tell my doubting relatives that I'm not alone with my theory.
Thank you very, very much

Regards
Sandie
Lewis & Davies in Glam.
Richards & Roberts,  in Carmarthen & Glam.
Bowen & Morgans in Carm.
Walters & Mort in Glam.
Dinmore, in SE London (prev.Surrey & Kent), Lowestoft & Yorks.
Collier/Collyer, Tyler & Welch in SE London(prev.Surrey)

All census transcriptions are Crown Copyright


Offline Bryant

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Re: lost,lost,LOST!
« Reply #30 on: Thursday 31 March 05 11:00 BST (UK) »
Sandie

You have the right marriage with Louisa Bateman as the spouse in 1869 ....a far better year..........and personally.....that is as correct as your going to get it and somewhere in the family files their must be something to confirm the findings? get searching.........

Bryant
Researching names BRYANT (Camberwell), PASTERFIELD (Essex and all), RAY (Holborn/Islington areas back to Brentford), POWELL (Glouc & beyond?)
Fletcher (Glouc into Warwickshie into Lancs?), BUCKLEY (Chatham area), Watson (Chatham area).


Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline sandie

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Re: lost,lost,LOST!
« Reply #31 on: Thursday 31 March 05 14:00 BST (UK) »
Bryant

Thank you very much, I needed to hear that someone agreed with me, now for that digging.

Regards

Sandie
Lewis & Davies in Glam.
Richards & Roberts,  in Carmarthen & Glam.
Bowen & Morgans in Carm.
Walters & Mort in Glam.
Dinmore, in SE London (prev.Surrey & Kent), Lowestoft & Yorks.
Collier/Collyer, Tyler & Welch in SE London(prev.Surrey)

All census transcriptions are Crown Copyright

Offline simon8783

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Re: lost,lost,LOST! - completed -
« Reply #32 on: Monday 28 September 20 11:53 BST (UK) »
I know this thread is long dead but the marriage between Susan Williams and George Tyler doesn't exist.  Thats because Susan Williams was at that point Susan Greenaway (and a widow).  There is a marriage between Susan Greenaway and George Tyler and a death certificate for Richard Greenaway who was married to a Susan Williams......
Camberwell

Smith
Welch
Richardson
Tyler
Sullivan