Author Topic: carolan and jones - Mayo: lynch, kelly and magee - Dublin  (Read 6298 times)

Offline diddymiller

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Re: carolan and jones - Mayo: lynch, kelly and magee - Dublin
« Reply #9 on: Friday 19 June 09 08:52 BST (UK) »
Carol, was just about to post - also on the pilot site!!
was looking for birth/death of PJ. also found patrick joseph. great minds and all that.

we need confirmation of his proper name. dermot the site we are looking on is:

http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#c=1408347;p=collectionDetails;t=searchable

Diddy
Cooks -(Clackmannanshire); Erskines - (fife); Youngs - (Dunfermline); Charltons - (Tyneside ); Skillings - (N.Norfolk); Legg - (N.Yorks, Tyneside) ; Carter - (Durham); Miller -(suffolk); Pattinson -(Lincs)

Offline diddymiller

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Re: carolan and jones - Mayo: lynch, kelly and magee - Dublin
« Reply #10 on: Friday 19 June 09 09:05 BST (UK) »
Dermots daughter has PJ birth as 1925 westport - may be a guess. but trhat fits with the one on the pilot:

patrick Joseph carolan oct - dec 1925 westport,mayo. 101229  4/347

there is also a death 1930 saying birth1925 but the child is only 5.

think we need to wait for dermot.  Diddy
Cooks -(Clackmannanshire); Erskines - (fife); Youngs - (Dunfermline); Charltons - (Tyneside ); Skillings - (N.Norfolk); Legg - (N.Yorks, Tyneside) ; Carter - (Durham); Miller -(suffolk); Pattinson -(Lincs)

Offline carol8353

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Re: carolan and jones - Mayo: lynch, kelly and magee - Dublin
« Reply #11 on: Friday 19 June 09 09:11 BST (UK) »


think we need to wait for dermot.  Diddy

Great minds Diddy  ;)
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Offline dermot lynch

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Re: carolan and jones - Mayo: lynch, kelly and magee - Dublin
« Reply #12 on: Friday 19 June 09 23:41 BST (UK) »
G'day to you Carol and Diddy...First, let me apologise if it is inappropriate to respond to both of you with the one posting.  As you  will have been gathering, I am a neophyte when it comes to this form of communication.  Although I have been involved with computers since the mid 1970's, this side of computer use is relatively new to me.  I can only assure you that anything I might do, such as displaying my email address (which I have removed as instructed [thanks Carol]), will be from ignorance, not arrogance.  Carol, you gave the marriage details as Brandon P Lynch.  Can you confirm that it reads Brandon, not Brendan?  Just so that when I follow up your leads I am on the right trail.  As far as following those leads and suggestions that you guys (I hope you use the term "guys" the same way we do over here) have provided, I will do so.  Its just that I have very little free time at the moment and just responding to your efforts and questions is all I can achieve at the moment.  As far as PJ is concerned.  I don't know what the PJ stands for but have always thought that Patrick Joseph would be a strong possibility.  I was in my very early teens when I saw the newspaper clipping, so that would mean the latest he could have been murdered would have been 1968.  I seem to recall that the clipping was quite aged, so a number of years can be taken from that date.  That would put the latest date at around 1960.  I suspect that my mother brought the clipping with her when we immigrated to Australia in 1959, so that should peg it back another year.  I gather that my mum and her brother PJ were very close, so I am assuming that they close in age too.  I also seem to recall that the article mentioned a young man having been murdered, not a boy.  This would put his age at death between 18 and 30 perhaps.  Mum was born in 1929 (now finally confirmed thanks to your efforts) and so PJ was probably born between 1924 and 1934.  Mum spoke very little about her youth but did mention that her and PJ would take the truck after the farm hands had finished for the day and she would drive around while PJ would be jumping and diving into the hay in the back of it.  Given that mum went to boarding school in England as a teenager, I would imagine that she would have been around ten years of age when her and PJ would be doing this.  Also, given that she was driving and not PJ, it suggests to me that she may have been the older of the two.  I don't recall actually reading anything in the clipping that pinpointed where PJ was murdered but thinking back on it, for some reason I get the impression that it was in England, possibly London itself.  I suspect that PJ was in England at the same time as my mother was there at boarding school.  So putting all that together, it would seem that the earliest that PJ could have been murdered would have been around 1942 and the latest 1959.  Of course all this is conjecture and reliance on memories as a child.  As a starting point I have been concentrating on that period, as yet to no avail.  Of course my failure to uncover any reference to this event is probably only an indication of my inexperience given what you guys have uncovered that I also failed to find.  I also feel that mum probably wouldn't have agreed to immigrate to Australia if it meant leaving PJ behind.  As we immigrated in February 1959, I suspect his death must have been in 1958 or earlier.  I wonder if PJ was alive when mum got married and if so, if he might have witnessed her marriage.  I will have to follow up on getting that certificate.  If he is listed as a witness then it would narrow the dates even further.  Nicole (my daughter), put in the year 1925 and Westport as a guess.  We have an old photo of mum and her sister standing either side of a young man, all three linked arm in arm and we suspect that the man in the photo might be PJ.  He appears to be in his early twenties.  If this photo is indeed of PJ then the dates would have to be between 1946 and 1958.  Can't think of anything else I can add about PJ that would be of assistance.  Finally, I have to say that your efforts have touched us.  I told my daughter about the info on mum's birth and marriage and when she asked how I knew, I told her about this site and your endeavours.  She was quite overcome that strangers would go to such an effort to be of assistance and wanted me to pass onto you her sincere thanks.  I have always told her that the Irish are a very friendly and helpful, as well as charming, witty and intelligent people and your response to us has confirmed this.  Thank you!  Thank you for your assistance and for adding to the richness of my daughter's inheritance by showing her the quality and the value of having an Irish bloodline.  Cheers to you both....Dermot

Offline carol8353

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Re: carolan and jones - Mayo: lynch, kelly and magee - Dublin
« Reply #13 on: Saturday 20 June 09 08:22 BST (UK) »
Eileen P Carolan married Brandon J Lynch in Coventry in Dec 1/4 of 1950 ref 9c page 1498


Dermot

I have just taken another look at the entry and it does indeed say BRANDON J LYNCH. Although the GR(general registry office) indexes are not always 100% correct! Or with the irish accent the registrar or priest heard it incorrectly.
Or maybe could read his own writing  ;D

If you got the cert you are indeed correct that you would get witnesses who may perhaps be PJ. So are you thinking that he too lived around Coventry or did he die in Ireland?

Carol
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Offline dermot lynch

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Re: carolan and jones - Mayo: lynch, kelly and magee - Dublin
« Reply #14 on: Saturday 20 June 09 08:58 BST (UK) »
G'day Carol
I will send for the certificate now that I know what name it is registered under.  I suspect that PJ was in England at the same time as mum and she met dad in Coventry, where they were eventually married.  It may be that she went to a boarding school in Coventry.  I think, given that mum and PJ were close, that if she was getting married and he was in England at the time, he would have attended the wedding.  If he is not one of the witnesses it doesn't really lead anywhere as he may not have been there at the time but if he is listed as a witness then it narrows the dates.  I may be wrong about where he died but I feel it was probably in England.  It was so long ago that I read the clipping that I really can't be sure of much.  The mind sometimes plays tricks on you when you try to fill in gaps in memory.  It may be filling in gaps with whatever will fit, rather than with actual memory.  I am not sure if this is a mind fill or a true memory but I think the clipping might have said that he was stabbed.  Don't put too much weight to that as it could be just a mind trick.  I gather that you chase all sorts of information for a variety of people.  How do you manage to keep all the information from blending together?  I find myself sometimes searching for mum's relatives with dad's surname and visa versa or looking for dad's relatives in mum's hometown etc.  I couldn't imagine trying to track information for a number of family trees at the one time.  One tree is more than enough.  Especially given that as you go further and further back it branches into more and more surnames.  It's almost as bad as pyramid selling.  You start with looking for a couple of parents and then you have one parent's parents and the other parent's parents and then each of those parent' parents....Ahhhh!  The brain is already going into overload just thinking about it.  Cheers Dermot

Offline carol8353

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Re: carolan and jones - Mayo: lynch, kelly and magee - Dublin
« Reply #15 on: Saturday 20 June 09 09:03 BST (UK) »
My gran and grandad were first cousins,so they had the same grandparents.
That narrows my tree down a little !
Even so after 20+ years of doing my own tree I get confused over which surname belongs to which side of my tree.....a trusty computer programme helps though.

It's my hubby's Irish lot(Co Clare) that I have the most trouble with.
They name everyone the same.......and yes he's a Patrick  ;)

Carol
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Offline dermot lynch

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Re: carolan and jones - Mayo: lynch, kelly and magee - Dublin
« Reply #16 on: Saturday 20 June 09 09:15 BST (UK) »
Now that's a rarity.  We are finally talking in real time.  Nine o'clock Saturday morning for you and six pm Saturday evening for me, give or take a bit.  Usually, I get up in the morning and find you have posted whilst I was asleep and I imagine it has been the same for you.  Twenty years of doing your family tree.  I don't think I will pass that onto my daughter, it might scare her off.  It's kinda giving me a scare.  How far back have you traced and how extensive have you managed to make your tree over twenty years?  My daughter has been doing it for just a few months and has currently three hundred and eleven names, how many do you have?  Are you your family's historian or do other members also do it?  Do they all show an interest in it?  Can I ask, did you come across many surprises as you uncovered your tree?  Cheers Dermot

Offline carol8353

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Re: carolan and jones - Mayo: lynch, kelly and magee - Dublin
« Reply #17 on: Saturday 20 June 09 09:39 BST (UK) »
HI again Dermot( on saturday!)

Well PJ didn't die between 1950-60(inclusive) as I have just trawled through the death indexes.

I have to go now but will try some more earlier dates later unless someone else can do some before I get back.

Carol
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