Author Topic: James Rodgers Belfast  (Read 3768 times)

Offline lucybella

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Re: James Rodgers Belfast
« Reply #18 on: Saturday 11 August 18 09:56 BST (UK) »
The address for Thomas on the will is the same as Catherine's when she married James.

Thank you! So the marriage is correct, I am wondering if Catherine died between 1912 and 1915/20. Which would explain a sister in law Mary in the division of the 'effects' of James.
Can I ask where you found Catherine's address. I Amon Ancestry.co.uk but there is no image for the marriage.
Thank you again!
Rodgers/Rogers N Ireland and Australia
Myers  N Ireland
Rose Ann Daly N Ireland
McKissick  N Ireland and Scotland
Susanna Hall  Belfast N Ireland
Heaney and Dargan Co Down N Ireland
Rose Anne Savage Belfast 1904

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Offline gaffy

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Re: James Rodgers Belfast
« Reply #19 on: Saturday 11 August 18 10:07 BST (UK) »

... I am having trouble attaching a copy of this, but if anyone can access it, I would be grateful to know what the writing in red says, above his brother Thomas name.
Thank you


The words in red above 'Thomas' look like 'Bro Part Leg.', which on the basis of other examples on neighbouring pages, I'm interpreting as 'Brother, Part Legatee'.

I could be wrong, but my reading of this entry in the Register is that his effects were destined to be divided equally between brothers Thomas and John, in line with the will, however, the actual distribution of money was half of the overall amount to brother Thomas, then a few months later the other half was divided equally three ways between brothers Thomas and Edward and the 'mystery' sister-in-law Mary.  The implication being that brother John was deceased.


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Online Sinann

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Re: James Rodgers Belfast
« Reply #20 on: Saturday 11 August 18 10:25 BST (UK) »
Marriage
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1912/09927/5609045.pdf
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Offline gaffy

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Re: James Rodgers Belfast
« Reply #21 on: Saturday 11 August 18 10:29 BST (UK) »
Are the folk you mention the children of William Rodgers and Mary Jane Myers who m. 1880, shown below in 1901? 
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Cromac/Market_Street/970290/

As regards a possible in-law Mary, the only other sons I can see who aren't shown in that census return were Isaac and 2 previous Johns, all of whom died early.  James married Catherine McGivern, presumably Edward and Thomas are ruled out as you know what happened to them, so that leaves William (b. 1885) and John #3 (b. 1900).

Is there any family lore about a mixed marriage?  Might be nothing, but the reason I ask is that a 17 year old bachelor John Rodgers of 23 Howard Street South died in a Belfast hospital in 1917, note that address:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1917/05210/4440535.pdf

A William Rodgers and Mary Johnston got married in May Street Presbyterian Church Belfast in July 1915...
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1915/09817/5564731.pdf

... shortly after a couple with the same names had a daughter Agnes Rodgers - note the address, 23 Howard Street South:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1915/01370/1564782.pdf

A soldier William Rodgers of 10 Bn. Royal Irish Rifles was killed on 21 March 1918, his will left his effects to his wife Mary of 23 Howard Street South:
https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/1587623/rodgers,-william/
http://soldierswills.nationalarchives.ie/reels/sw/1918_22/RodgersW_E764906.pdf


Offline gaffy

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Re: James Rodgers Belfast
« Reply #22 on: Saturday 11 August 18 10:35 BST (UK) »

... So the marriage is correct, I am wondering if Catherine died between 1912 and 1915/20. Which would explain a sister in law Mary in the division of the 'effects' of James ...


Catherine (McGivern) Rodgers went on to marry a James Carr in 1916:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1916/09776/5548540.pdf


Offline gaffy

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Re: James Rodgers Belfast
« Reply #23 on: Saturday 11 August 18 11:00 BST (UK) »

... shortly after a couple with the same names had a daughter Agnes Rodgers - note the address, 23 Howard Street South:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1915/01370/1564782.pdf


Daughter Agnes of that couple died in January 1918:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1918/05197/4435888.pdf

https://dof.belfastcity.gov.uk/burialsearch/BurialRecordDetails.aspx?RecordID=6159.42808

And Mary (Johnston) Rodgers remarried in 1920, husband Thomas Montgomery.


Offline lucybella

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Re: James Rodgers Belfast
« Reply #24 on: Saturday 11 August 18 13:23 BST (UK) »
Sinann and gaffy, I can't thank you both enough!

In one short morning you have sorted out so much that I have been wondering about for so long.
Yes, it is the family of William Rodgers and Mary Jane Myers. How you found those births so quickly amazes me, because it took me weeks back in 2010 searching through many records.. When both parents died in 1904 three of the youngest were put into care of the Catholic Church. I have never been able to find out where Edward, Thomas and John spent their early years.

The story in my mind was that three of grandfather Edward's brothers were lost in the war.  It seems that was correct ; William, James and Thomas .
Sadly, there seems no doubt that the 17 yr old who died at Lisburn Rd was indeed my grand uncle John. I doubt he joined the army at any stage.

I always heard that William had become a Protestant, and that there were cousins who were Protestants. I am wondering if there were any other children apart from poor Agnes who died so young. It is likely there may be.

I have spent a lot of time in past years looking for Thomas, who disappeared from the Australian Army Hay NSW in 1941. I have now accepted that I will never find out.

It is so good to have the information I got this morning. I am very thankful to you both.

Rodgers/Rogers N Ireland and Australia
Myers  N Ireland
Rose Ann Daly N Ireland
McKissick  N Ireland and Scotland
Susanna Hall  Belfast N Ireland
Heaney and Dargan Co Down N Ireland
Rose Anne Savage Belfast 1904

Online Sinann

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Re: James Rodgers Belfast
« Reply #25 on: Saturday 11 August 18 16:42 BST (UK) »
The children you have are

William Joseph
James
Edward
Thomas
John

There is also another Thomas born 1881
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1881/02832/2038420.pdf
died 1883
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1882/06387/4833842.pdf

Parents married 1880, Thomas born 1881 and William 1885 so there could be another child in between.

Offline gaffy

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Re: James Rodgers Belfast
« Reply #26 on: Saturday 11 August 18 17:52 BST (UK) »
Just heading out for the night, but posting the following speculation in case it generates leads...  Is the following link possibly William Rodgers and Mary Johnston pre their marriage, in the 1911 census (ie. did they get married just before he went off to war)?
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Windsor_Ward/Charlotte_Street__Little/168445/

Look at this birth (note parents and address):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1910/01563/1631007.pdf

And note this 1911 Charlotte Street census entry, which fits Mary Johnston's background (father Thomas for the shown children)...

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Windsor_Ward/Charlotte_Street__Little/168453/