Author Topic: nz soilder  (Read 1463 times)

Offline lnr

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nz soilder
« on: Tuesday 25 August 09 09:14 BST (UK) »
 looking for newzealand soldier names James NAPIER 1922 father next of kin Kippen Stirling can anyone help thanks lnr

Offline b1gf00t

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Re: nz soilder
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 05 March 20 03:41 GMT (UK) »
Surname   NAPIER
Given Name   James
Category   Nominal Roll Vol. 2
Regimental Number   15587
Rank   Private
Next of Kin Title   J
Next of Kin Surname   NAPIER
Next of Kin Relationship   Father
Next of Kin Address   Burnton Kippen Stirlingshire Scotland
Roll   37
Page   9
Occupation   Ploughman

The Auckland War Memorial Museum register indicates that he was killed in action 14 June 1917 and is remembered at Messines Ridge (New Zealand) Memorial, Messines Ridge British Cemetery, Belgium. I just found his details in the Commonwealth War Graves website.

But I suspect you may know all that.
   
   

Offline Jamjar

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Re: nz soilder
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 05 March 20 03:49 GMT (UK) »
Where does 1922 come from?

How old was he during the war?

Jamjar
Atkinson; Badier; Cameron; Grant; Howie; Jardine; Jenkins; Kerr; Lawardorn; Lee; Linton; Lonie; McConnell; Morgan; Morrison; Murphy; O'Leary; Paton; Pratt; Robb; Williams


Offline Jamjar

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Re: nz soilder
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 05 March 20 03:59 GMT (UK) »
There are two births that for suit enrolment age:

NAPIER JAMES 1880 484/3 Kippen

NAPIER JAMES 1884 484/12  Kippen

However, there aren’t any suitable fitting on the censuses up to 1911.

Jamjar
Atkinson; Badier; Cameron; Grant; Howie; Jardine; Jenkins; Kerr; Lawardorn; Lee; Linton; Lonie; McConnell; Morgan; Morrison; Murphy; O'Leary; Paton; Pratt; Robb; Williams

Offline b1gf00t

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Re: nz soilder
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 05 March 20 06:39 GMT (UK) »
Since writing earlier I have found a copy of the personal record of James Napier and have found a birth date on his enlistment form of 15th November 1890 which his enlistment age as 27 years of age.

On the same document, it gave his father's name as James Napier with the previous address crossed out and an updated address of:
Cassafuir Farm
Ruskie
Perthshire
Scotland

The document also indicated the medal(s) had been forwarded to the father at the Perthshire address.

Offline Jamjar

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Re: nz soilder
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 05 March 20 07:18 GMT (UK) »
Inr logged in after we posted, but didn’t comment on our finding etc.

Possible marriage: NAPIER JAMES to STEWART JANE 1888 484/ 4 Kippen

Then this birth is in the right area for Kippen:

NAPIER JAMES 1890 481/A 14 GARGUNNOCK

1901: 481/A 4/ 1 GARGUNNOCK Stirling
James 36
Jane 37
James 10
Mary 7
Jane 3
John 0

Farm was once in Perthshire: https://scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/digital-volumes/ordnance-survey-name-books/perthshire-os-name-books-1859-1862/perthshire-volume-69/31

This has the farm in Stirlingshire: https://media.onthemarket.com/properties/506218/doc_0_2.pdf

Possible death of father: NAPIER JAMES 70 1935 388/ 8 Port Of Menteith

I don’t see where 1922 fits in.

Jamjar

Atkinson; Badier; Cameron; Grant; Howie; Jardine; Jenkins; Kerr; Lawardorn; Lee; Linton; Lonie; McConnell; Morgan; Morrison; Murphy; O'Leary; Paton; Pratt; Robb; Williams

Offline hanes teulu

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Re: nz soilder
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 05 March 20 09:07 GMT (UK) »
Stirling Observer, 16 June 1917
TURNING FARMER - We understand that Mr Napier, goods porter at Kippen Station, has taken lease of the farm at Cassiefour, Port of Menteith. Mr Napier is well known in this countryside and we are sure everyone will wish him success in his new venture.

Several New Zealand newspapers, July 1917, reported -

KILLED IN ACTION
Canterbury Infantry
Napier, James (Mr James Napier, Stirling, Scotland, father (next of kin))
S. Wales, Somerset, Devon - Oxenham

Aberavon - Hopkin/s, Jenkins, Thomas
St. Brides/Wick - Jenkins
Llanblethian -  Price
Abergwynfi -  Han(d)ford
Pontardawe -  Lewis.

Offline hanes teulu

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Re: nz soilder
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 05 March 20 09:14 GMT (UK) »
Stirling Observer, 30 Jun 1917

"KIPPEN
The Toll of the War - to the already long list of those fallen on the field we  have this week to add other two names from our Roll of Honour - Private James Napier, Burnton, New Zealand Contingent, who was at one time employed at the Dasher ...."
S. Wales, Somerset, Devon - Oxenham

Aberavon - Hopkin/s, Jenkins, Thomas
St. Brides/Wick - Jenkins
Llanblethian -  Price
Abergwynfi -  Han(d)ford
Pontardawe -  Lewis.

Offline Forfarian

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Re: nz soilder
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 05 March 20 09:54 GMT (UK) »
Farm was once in Perthshire: https://scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/digital-volumes/ordnance-survey-name-books/perthshire-os-name-books-1859-1862/perthshire-volume-69/31
This has the farm in Stirlingshire: https://media.onthemarket.com/properties/506218/doc_0_2.pdf
The second one is wrong.

Port of Menteith is in the parish of Menteith in the historic county of Perth, also known as Perthshire. See this map https://maps.nls.uk/view/74400119 which quite clearly shows that neither the Lake of Menteith nor Port of Menteith are in Stirlingshire. Or https://maps.nls.uk/view/91553691 which shows the boundary between Perthshire and Stirlingshire passing south of the Lake of Menteith.

Or take a look at the valuation rolls at Scotland's People, which clearly list Cassafuir in Perthshire (County of Perth).

In 1975, local government was reorganised around a set of new boundaries that in many cases don't relate at all to the historic county boundaries. The historic counties remain unchanged for ceremonial purposes which means that the boundaries of the new local authorities are not the same as those of the historic county if it happens to have retained the historic name. (For example the present Aberdeenshire council area includes most of the historic county of Aberdeenshire plus Kincardineshire and part of Banffshire, but both Kincardineshire and Banffshire, the rest of which is in Moray, remain unchanged for ceremonial purposes.)

Since 1975 there have been no local authorities in Scotland whose name includes the word 'county'.

Menteith came under the new Stirling District, which was grouped with others to form Central Region. In 1995 there was another reorganisation which abolished the regions and made many of the former districts into standalone local authorities. However this reorganisation did away with the term 'district' as a local government unit, so one now has to refer to the land that comes under a particular local authority as "xxx council area".

As you can see from Stirling Council's web site, it does not refer to its area as 'Stirlingshire'. Nor does Perth and Kinross Council refer to itself as 'Perthshire'. Both of those are historic and ceremonial counties whose boundaries remain unchanged since 1975.

Therefore the estate agent who wrote that advertisement made the error of assuming that Stirlingshire and Stirling council area are synonymous. They are not. Port of Menteith is in the Stirling council area but it is not, and never has been, in Stirlingshire.

The change in local government is a perfect pest for historical research including family history, but all you need to remember is to stick to the historic counties and parishes, because that is how information was recorded until the change just 45 years ago.

All very confusing, even to most Scots!


Researching

AITKENHEAD, Lanarkshire; BINNY, Forfar; BLACK, New Monkland; BRYSON, Cumbernauld; BURGESS, North-East Scotland; CRUICKSHANK, Rothes; DALLAS, Botriphnie; DAVIDSON, Oyne; GUTHRIE, Angus; HOGG, Larbert; LESLIE, Rothes/Mortlach; MENDUM, England; MOLLISON, Lethnot; PATERSON, Larbert; RHIND, Forfar; SANG, Scotland; SCOTT, East Kilbride; STOR(R)I/E/Y, Shotts; THORNTON, Shotts; WADDELL, New Monkland; WILKIE, New Monkland; WILKIE, Tannadice; WYLLIE, Angus; YOUNG, Keith