Author Topic: Watermen and lightermen Apprenticeships Bindings and licences  (Read 29798 times)

Offline gwendraith

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 4
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Watermen and lightermen Apprenticeships Bindings and licences
« on: Wednesday 25 November 09 21:51 GMT (UK) »
Hi, I hope this is the right place to post. I have several generations of watermen and lightermen listed in the census records of 1841 - 1861. The family name is Evans and the first one with the occupations (sometimes waterman sometimes lighterman)  named on a census and the baptism records of all his children was Samuel Lowden Evans born about 1796. It's possible his father's name was also Samuel. At least two of Samuel Lowden Evans' sons have lightermen listed as their occupation. They were Samuel Evans born 1817 and George Thomas Evans born 1834. They mostly lived in Salisbury Street and West Lane Bermondsey. I don't suppose anyone has the details  of bindings and licences from maybe the 1700s and 1800s and can provide me with a list of all the Evans? Many thanks, Holly :)

Offline Bond1

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 15
  • Non Sufficit Orbis
    • View Profile
Re: Watermen and lightermen Apprenticeships Bindings and licences
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 23 December 09 02:16 GMT (UK) »
gwendraith,
Welcome to the Watermen and Lightermen clann, :)
I have a long line of Watermen and Lightermen in my Bond family and have found others by Marriage.
Have'nt seen any Evans coming into the picture as yet but have found some helpfull people.

Some Watermen and Lightermen info I have found:
Regards Noel :)
 
The Ballad of the Last Lightermen

Well we listened to your stories
Of your days in Greenland Dock
Of barges full of rough goods
When you've been on the job-and-knock

Of pockets full of money
Earned for sitting on a barge
And how you are a race apart
From people by and large

Of hours you've spent in cafes and pubs
Of Woodbines, tea and toast
Of turned up jeans and hobnailed boots
Form guide and winning post

Of the barmaids you've pulled
If only in a dream
Of nights spent on the mucking
When tugs run out of steam

But like the arrowsmiths and wheelwright
Yours is a dying trade
And each day you grow more bitter
As your numbers slowly fade

For The Port of London's dying
Though she's been a grand old girl
And Father Thames no longer
Holds the shipping of the world
They're filling in your docks
Knocking down your wharves and pubs
They're selling all your barges
And scrapping all your tugs

In their luxury apartments
That command a river view
As they sip their dry Martinis
Do they ever think of you?

What do they know of Greenhithe
Blackwall Point and Wapping Stairs
As they talk of liquidation
And watch their stocks and shares

But still you'll have the last laugh
As they're hellbound for their sin
It'll be so full of Lightermen
The buggers won't get in.

Kellys Post Office London Directory 1853: List of Lightermen

Aldridge, Richard & Sons
Allen, Thomas-Chain Lightermen
Arms, William John
Barber, David
Barnard, Richard
Bartholomew,William
Bath, Stephen
Bells's and Taylor
Berridge, T.Worcester
Billingsley, William
Blinko, Mrs C.
Bond, John George
Bostock, John
Bradley, Philip
Bradley, William
Bridge, Sl.
Brown, William
Chantler, Edward
Chapman, Edward William
Chew, Robert
Christey, Alex
Christey, W
Clark, Mrs Mary Ann
Clippingdale Brothers
Cockshott, Mrs D.
Corder, Micah-Granary Keepers
Corsan, Charles-gunpowder
Corsan, Thomas-Gunpowder
Covington, James & Co
Creed, James-gunpowder
Dards, Charles Fk
Dards, George
Dawson, John
Dean, George
Dean, John W
Dennis, J
Dodd, Henry
Dolwin, William-Coal Merchants
Doo, George
Downey, John
Drake, John
Drew, A.
Ducas, Thomas
Dudin, Henry & Sons-Granary Keepers, Wharfingers
Dudin, J-Granary Keepers
Duggan, H.
Duggan, Mrs Louisa
Dunkin, Henry & John-Wharfingers, Corn Dealers
Easton, Thomas C.-Granary Keepers
Edmonds, Aug.Rt & Co
Elliott, Thomas
Elmore, Mrs Esther
Eltham, Matthew
Etheredge, William-Coal Merchants
Fallwell, George
Farlow, Frederick R.
Farmer, Charles F.
Field, Robert
Fifield, Joshua John
Finnis, Mrs Sarah
Fisher, William Alexander-Custom House Agents
Flower, Farnham Henry
Flower, G.J.
Fossett, William J.
Freeman, Joseph
Fuller, John & Sons
Fuller, William Henry
Gardiner, Thomas
Gardner, Thomas-Coal Merchants
Gaywood, John-Coal Merchants, Wharfingers
Gilbert, Mrs M.
Goodchild, John
Granger, Benjamin Bluett & Co.-Custom House Agents
Grey, H. jun.
Grey, James
Groves, Thomas & Son-Granary Keepers, Wharfingers
Hagon, Peter
Hamilton, John T.
Haslip, James
Hawkins, James J.
Hawkins, John
Hay, Charles & Son
Hedges, George
Hedges, William
Hemmings, G.W.
Higgs, J.
Hill, Benjamin
Hill, Benjamin G.
Hindes, Alex
Hinkley, Edmund E.
Hobbs, Fk.
Hopkins, I.I & W.
Hughes, William & Co.
Jacob, Benjamin
Jarvis, James
Jones, D.-Granary Keepers
Joyce, William A.-Custom House Agents
Judkins, Samuel jun.
Kent, James & Son
Kent, Edward
Kinchin, T.John
Kinchin, William
Knight, Joshua-Wharfingers, Granary Keepers
Knight, William Landell, W.W-Corn Dealers, Granary Keepers
Leverett, Henry
Love, John
Lucy, C. & Sons, Custom House Agents
Lucey, William
McClarens, Robinson
Martin, J.B.
Matthews, J.
Matthews, James
Maynard, George
Metcalfe, J.R.
Middlemist & Hammond-Custom House Agents
Moakes, Charles John-Coal Merchants
Moore, T.B.
Neal & Rolles-Wharfingers
Newell, J.&Son
Nisbett, G.
Noehmer, Albert H.-Granary Keepers
Nugent, William
Nutkins, George
Olyett, Edward
Page, S.&Son
Pass, Francis L.
Perkins & Broughton
Phillips, Grave & Phillips-Custom House Agents
Phillips, Mrs Mary Ann
Pillow, Thomas & Son
Pope, W. & Co-Custom House Agents
Rayment, C.
Robbins & Miller-Coal Merchants
Saunders, Charles
Savage, Thomas
Scott, Mrs S.
Shelbourne, William
Shutter, James
Smith, Son & Smith-Granary Keepers
Smith, David W.
Spencer, George Marks
Steel, James
Steel, John
Stevens, James
Still, William
Stollard, Henry Rd.
Strutton, Charles
Stutchbury, James & Sons-Custom House Agents
Stutchbury, C.
Stutchbury, Frederick
Swain, Benjamin
Syms, Thomas
Targett, John
Thomas, J.
Thompson, W.
Thompson, William T.
Tomlin, William & Nephew
Trott, Alfred
Tucker, Joseph
Turnley Brothers-Custom House Agents
Walker, Andrew
Waller & Fisher
Ward, George
Waters, R.
Wears, John J.
Webster, S.J.
Weed, Matthew
Whellock, Arthur & Son-Custom House Agents
Whipps, Arthur
White, Frederick-Chain Lightermen
White, Isaac A.
White, Rd.
Wilkinson & Dawson
Williams, Samuel
Wilson, J.
Wright, G.
Bond, Vivian, , Pepper, Acton, Steers, Badcock.
Vivian Bond, Acton Bond.

Occupation's: Lightermen, Watermen, Corn Merchant's, Ship Wright's, Master Mariner's.

Wise, Lafferty, Hume, Donaldson, Boyd.

Offline Bond1

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 15
  • Non Sufficit Orbis
    • View Profile
Re: Watermen and lightermen Apprenticeships Bindings and licences
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 19 January 10 14:16 GMT (UK) »
You will fined some information at this link, http://www.parishregister.com
Bond, Vivian, , Pepper, Acton, Steers, Badcock.
Vivian Bond, Acton Bond.

Occupation's: Lightermen, Watermen, Corn Merchant's, Ship Wright's, Master Mariner's.

Wise, Lafferty, Hume, Donaldson, Boyd.


Offline behindthefrogs

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,756
  • EDLIN
    • View Profile
Re: Watermen and lightermen Apprenticeships Bindings and licences
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 19 January 10 15:55 GMT (UK) »
The Watermen and Lightermen's Company is a City Livery Company and you will find their records in Guildhall Library London.  These include amongst many many others the apprentice bindings from 1655 to 1944.  They are unfortunately not on-line

David
Living in Berkshire from Northampton & Milton Keynes
DETAILS OF MY NAMES ARE IN SURNAME INTERESTS, LINK AT FOOT OF PAGE
Wilson, Higgs, Buswell, PARCELL, Matthews, TAMKIN, Seckington, Pates, Coupland, Webb, Arthur, MAYNARD, Caves, Norman, Winch, Culverhouse, Drakeley.
Johnson, Routledge, SHIRT, SAICH, Mills, SAUNDERS, EDLIN, Perry, Vickers, Pakeman, Griffiths, Marston, Turner, Child, Sheen, Gray, Woolhouse, Stevens, Batchelor
Census Info is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline martywillis

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 52
  • I've not edited my PROFILE yet
    • View Profile
Re: Watermen and lightermen Apprenticeships Bindings and licences
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 04 May 10 02:08 BST (UK) »
Hope that this helps you

Evans  Samuel Lowden 06/08/18012 Bermondsey Samuel Evans 10/02/1820

Source: The Company of Watermen & Lightermen of The River Thames
Bindings Index
1783 - 1823
by R.J Cottrell

Evans Samuel 10/05/1832 Bermondsey Samuel Lowden Evans 11/07/1839

Source: The Company of Watermen & Lightermen of The River Thames
Bindings Index
1823 - 1861
by R.J.Cottrell

I had a look at the 1742 -1783 & there is a Samuel Evans listed there at Rotherhith..is this place with the name familier?


Researching - Brinkwood, Chapman, Kirby & Swan from Kent, Marsh (Mash in some records) from Buckland Brewer, Devon, Williams, Dobson, Thurgood from London, Hanks from Nailsworth

Also Irish search - Bradford, Bradley, Conroy, Russell, Sheridan.
 
Also Scottish search-  Berrie, Miller, Munro/Munroe, McKenzie,

Offline Keston

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 104
    • View Profile
Re: Watermen and lightermen Apprenticeships Bindings and licences
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 20 June 10 09:42 BST (UK) »
H

I am looking for information on member of the Corsan family, whom were variously listed as watermen or lighterman.

In particular, I have information that a Thomas Munday Corsan, b. c. 1770, d.  14 July 1816, living in East Smithfield, Whitechapel was a lighterman and waterman.

He was followed into the trade by at least one of his sons, John Corsan, b. 1803, Stepney area London.

I am not sure whether earlier generations were also involved in the trade.  I ee a Thomas Corsan and Charles Corsan are listed in the Kellys Post Office Directory of 1853 as Lighterman and/or watermen.

Can anyone help with references to Corsans in the Bindings Index?

Many thanks
KESTON.
- Anderton - Walton le Dale & Heskin / Eccleston / Croston / Bispham Green areas Lancashire; Bombay NZ
- Smith - Harworth, Nottinghamshire; Ashton under Lyne, Shaw, Lancashire; Cape Colony, Natal, South Africa
- McDowell - Raloo, Antrim; Garthland, Galloway; Drury, Maketu, NZ
- Hall - Cavan, Ireland
- Bell - Fermanagh, Ireland; Papakura, NZ
- Hanna - Tyrone, Ireland & West Coast NZ
- Burns, Johnston(e), King and Moffat - Peebles, Traquair, Selkirk, Scotland
- Rugg - Kumara, NZ
- Dick

Offline martywillis

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 52
  • I've not edited my PROFILE yet
    • View Profile
Re: Watermen and lightermen Apprenticeships Bindings and licences
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 20 June 10 12:27 BST (UK) »
In The Company of Watermen & Lightermen of The River Thames
Bindings Index 1742-1783

there are
John Corsan 23/09/1748 Wappin John Sheavell 12/02/1756
George Corson 30/07/1762 St Georges Middx James Corson 19/12/1776
James Corson 10/07/1752 Hermitage Robert Finlayson 14/09/1759
Thomas Corson 01/07/1757 Wappin John Corson 02/08/1764

Bindings Index 1783-1823
James Jeffreys Corsan 01/07/1819 Hermitage James Buxton 14/09/1826
John Corsan 13/02/1817 Hermitage Amelia Corsan 04/03/1824
Thomas Corsan 02/11/1809 Smithfield John Corsan 00/00/0000
Thomas Corsan 21/11/1793 St George East James Corsan 01/04/1802
Thomas Munday Corsan 30/11/1786 Wapping Thomas Corsan 16/01/1794

Bindings Index 1823-1861
Charles Corsan 19/08/1824 Aldgate John Jeffrey Corsan 13/10/1831
Charles Freeman Corsan 13/10/1853 Wapping John Corsan Dead
Henry Albert Corsan 08/11/1855 Rotherhithe Jacob Sinclair jr 14/05/1867
John James Corsan 14/10/1847 St George East John Corsan 00/00/0000
Thomas John Corsan 11/08/1853 Erith Henry Edward Cory 11/09/1860
William Jacob Corsan 22/06/1826 Wapping William Turtle 10/04/1834
William Thomas Corsan 13/06/1850 Shadwell William Jacob Corsan 11/03/1858

Bindings Index 1861-1884
Thomas William Corsan 12/02/1878 Erith Thomas John Corsan 13/02/1883
William Corsan 08/02/1881 Erith William Thomas Corsan 09/10/1984

Bindings Index 1884-1908
George Corsan 14Th Jan 1890 Erith Joseph Sayers 12th Feb 1895
George Stanley Corsan 11th Oct 1887 Southwark Ralph Nowell Hasler -------
Henry Corsan 12th March 1889Erith Thomas William Corsan 14th June 1898
Walter Richard Corsan 13th June 1893 Erith Thomas John Corsan 9th August 1898
William Frederick Corsan 8th Nov 1898 Erith Thomas William Corsan 9th Feb 1904

The Company of Watermen & Lightermen of The River Thames
Binding Dates & Affidavit birth proofs
1898-1949


Henry Frederick John Corsan Bound 8th Nov 1927 born 10th Sept 1913 Woolwich
William Frederick Corsan bound 8th Nov 1898 born 29th Dec 1881 Dartford

The Company of Watermen & Lightermen of The River Thames Admissions List for Pensioners
1794-1837


Elizabeth Corsan admitted 1st May 1821 from Bermondsey

The Company of Watermen & Lightermen of The River Thames
Reassignments 1688-1908

Henry Albert Corsan Bound 8th Nov 1855 Reassigned 8th Oct 1861 to Rachel Corsan
Thomas Corsan Bound 21st Nov 1793 Reassigned  5th May 1796 to Thomas Corsan
Thomas John Corsan Bound 11th August 1853 Reassigned 13th Jan 1859 to William Thomas Corsan
Thomas Munday Corsan Bound 30th Nov 1786 Reassigned 20th Jan 1791 to Richard Reeves
William Corsan Bound 8th Feb 1881 Reassigned 11th March 1890 to William Hoskins
William Jacob Corsan Bound 22nd June 1826 Reassigned 26th April 1827 to Jacob Mills
William Thomas Corsan Bound 13th June 1850 Reassigned to Rachel Corsan
John Jefferies Corson Bound 28th July 1784 Reassigned to Henry Hall

I hope that this assists you


Researching - Brinkwood, Chapman, Kirby & Swan from Kent, Marsh (Mash in some records) from Buckland Brewer, Devon, Williams, Dobson, Thurgood from London, Hanks from Nailsworth

Also Irish search - Bradford, Bradley, Conroy, Russell, Sheridan.
 
Also Scottish search-  Berrie, Miller, Munro/Munroe, McKenzie,

Online BumbleB

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 11,196
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Watermen and lightermen Apprenticeships Bindings and licences
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 20 June 10 12:36 BST (UK) »
How interesting to see women on the list - might that be because they've carried on the business following breavement?

My particular interest is Mrs Mary Ann Clark - I'm sure she is the wife/widow of Thomas Clark (Lighterman) - both named in her uncle's will dated 1846 and proved in 1851.  Mary Ann is, I believe, the daughter of Thomas Archbell, Mariner of Wapping Street, baptised on 16 March 1794 at St John, Wapping, and the niece of James Archbell, Ship's Chandler and Sailmaker, also of Wapping.  The marriage appears to have taken place at St Giles, Camberwell on 4 May 1814 - no occupations or parents listed.

Any news of them in an Index would be much appreciated.

BumbleB
Transcriptions and NBI are merely finding aids.  They are NOT a substitute for original record entries.
Remember - "They'll be found when they want to be found" !!!
If you don't ask the question, you won't get an answer.
He/she who never made a mistake, never made anything.
Archbell - anywhere, any date
Kendall - WRY
Milner - WRY
Appleyard - WRY

Offline Keston

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 104
    • View Profile
Re: Watermen and lightermen Apprenticeships Bindings and licences
« Reply #8 on: Monday 21 June 10 10:29 BST (UK) »
Many thanks Marty or coming back to me so quickly.

I have some short questions. 

Firstly, for the Binding Index, can you confirm, is the second date the date they received their licence.

Secondly, as the other poster has said, it is interesting to see the women listed.  In particular, the Amelia Corsan listed beside John Corsan who was bound in 1817 is I think my gggg grandmother.  The date that John was bound is directly after the death of Amelia's husband Thomas Munday, I would guess therefore that she took over the business / boat on his death?  Is that a reasonable conjecture?

Finally, Amelia's daughter, also Amelia married a James Owen Rugg.  I am wondering if he was also of the trade, given that her father and brothers were all involved, as was the James Buxton listed, who was the second husband of her mother.  Is there anyway you could do a search for me on Rugg?  James Owen was b. 1808, and d. 1841, both in Rotherhithe.

Many thanks for your help
KESTON.





 
- Anderton - Walton le Dale & Heskin / Eccleston / Croston / Bispham Green areas Lancashire; Bombay NZ
- Smith - Harworth, Nottinghamshire; Ashton under Lyne, Shaw, Lancashire; Cape Colony, Natal, South Africa
- McDowell - Raloo, Antrim; Garthland, Galloway; Drury, Maketu, NZ
- Hall - Cavan, Ireland
- Bell - Fermanagh, Ireland; Papakura, NZ
- Hanna - Tyrone, Ireland & West Coast NZ
- Burns, Johnston(e), King and Moffat - Peebles, Traquair, Selkirk, Scotland
- Rugg - Kumara, NZ
- Dick