Marriage look up please - Cheltenham - Update

[RuthT]

not having much luck finding this marriage would someone help please?
This is what i know;

1851 census
Cheltenham
High Street
district 1N image 41

John Davies married 25 baker
Eliza 3 scholar
Charles 2
John 1

cant find wife anywhere
.........................

1861 census
10 vaughton street
Aston birmingham

John Davis 41 head norfolk
eliza davis 40 wife glos
eliza davis 13 dau glos
john davis 11 son glos
william davis 10 son glos
george davis 5 son glos
ann davis 4 dau birmingham
joseph davis 3 son birmingham
thomas davis 4mths son birmingham


1871 has Eliza with extra initail P
1881 census she is Eliza patience Davies

Eliza the daughter was born in 1st q 1847 Cheltenham

can anyone find there marriage please? thank you for your interest
ruth

[Helina]

Hope these entries will help


Marriages

Dec 1846 Eliza Buck and John Davies Bristol 11 170
Dec 1846 Eliza Smith and John Davies Bristol 11 190
June 1847 Eliza Knight and John Davies Clifton 11 354
One entry for Cheltenham June 1852 but FreeBmd stated the entry was unreadable, but abit late for your couple.

helina

[ChasH]

Ruth,

If you are clutching at straws, there were two death registrations in Cheltenham for the names Charles Davis - Sept qtr 1851 and March qtr 1852.  You might learn something from one of them but it is not very likely.

I suppose there's a possibility that the 1851 and 1861 families are not the same and in Free bmd there's an Eliza Ann death registered in 1850.  It would not be unusual for children to share the names of parents so there's a possibility that John was a widower in the 1851 census.

You need to purchase some birth certs to resolve the problem one way or the other.

Regards

Chas

[Liz in France]

Hi Ruth,

It is possible that Eliza was away from her home at the time as she must have been very close to giving birth to William.  Maybe she was in the Poorhouse Infirmary or somewhere llike that or perhaps even with her parents.

I have tried looking for William to see if he was born at the date of the census but nothing positive.

With the name being Davis or Davies and the  inclusion of Monmouth into Gloucestershire records, you could find it very difficult to be sure of finding the right one.

It would be safer to buy the birth certificate for Eliza if you are sure the one you have identified is the right one and find the mother's maiden name from that.  You can then search for the marriage details with more confidence.

I too had found those marriage entries but as the majority were in Bristol, I think Eliza would have said Bristol on the census and not Gloucestershire.

Not very helpful I'm afraid.

Best of luck,

Elizabeth

[RuthT]

many thanks for all the replies. You have made me think outside the box and as i know they had a son with the name isaac i will send for his birth cert and perhaps that will give me her maiden name.
 Regards Ruth

[RuthT]

Hi
 I am now even more confused! i received Isaacs birth cert htis morning
father John occ baker but mother is given as martha davies formerly taylor !?! Dont get what this means as she was Eliza or Eliza p on all census i have looks to be same family have searched for another isaac with father john who is a baker with no successs any thoughts anyone?

[Liz in France]

Hi Ruth,

That is bad luck.  Now we are in a bigger muddle than before.

Can you give us some later information that you  know to be correct so we can trace it back ourselves.  I think you may have muddled up a couple of different families and the confusion is just getting increased.

When was Isaac born?  He does not appear on the 1851 and 61 census with Eliza  so perhaps he is the result of a second marriage.

It can be very confusing at times and it is the easiest thing in the world to go off on the wrong course and spend a lot of time and money researching the wrong family.  A  lot of us have done that at some time or another but it does teach you to check and double check and to only use accredited records and even then there are mistakes.
If you give us the best information you have, I am sure we will do our best to help you out.

Best wishes,
Elizabeth

[Liz in France]

Hi Ruth,

I have found Isaac in 1871, 1881 and 1891 and he follows his father and becomes a baker.  Up to 1891 he is living with his mother ELIZA PATIENCE Davies.  So the mother on the birth cert is a real mystery unless of course it isn't the right cert or someone has copied the details  incorrectly.

I wonder if it is the name of Eliza's mother?  Just a thought. Or maybe it is the informant and not the mother's name.  I'm baffled.

I cannot find a marriage in Gloucestershire for Martha Taylor to John Davis but as Eliza is there from 1841, I didn't really expect to find one.

I don't know what to suggest except to find the birth for their earlier children and get one of those certs.

Regards,
Elizabeth

[Keziahemm]

As regards the marriage of John Davis, free bmd has one in Gloucester March qtr. 1846 one of the females is Elizabeth Lane  

Also in Cheltenham December qtr. 1845, one of the females is Elizabeth Hiles  

Wondering if the name on the birth certificate is a clerical error.  Did you get this from the GRO?   Certificates in the original register were copied by hand every quarter and passed to the GRO, so what you get from the GRO is not an actual photo copy of the original.  Mistakes do happen!

Maybe worth contacting Birmingham Register Office to see what the original says. http://www.rootschat.com/links/07zu/

Keziah