Author Topic: help with romany links  (Read 31705 times)

Offline vicky19

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Re: help with romany links
« Reply #36 on: Thursday 03 July 14 13:47 BST (UK) »
Hi

I was talking with someone recently about family history and possibly having romany links, we both have stories in our families, so I thought I would post them here to see if you have an idea where we can begin to look.

It was the last post about gyspy royalty that made me think because the lady I was talking to has a story that they are descended from Spanish Gypsy Royalty on her father's side but she doesn't know which specific family, the surnames aren't particularly unusual.... Snell, Luff, Huntley, Nash, Winter, Facknell and Chamberlain.... Two elderly cousins have separately told her this story but I'm not sure where to start to suggest where we can find out any answers.

My story is my Grt Grandfather Harry Winney apparently 'did the dirty by a gypsy girl and abandoned her' which is why he moved from West Bromwich where he was born in 1880 to Walthamstow (in 1901 census) where he met (but did not marry) my grt grandmother and had my Gran in 1903 and her sister a few years later. Only after my Gran died did I discover that he was already married to an Agnes Troth in 1899 and had a daughter Dorothy in 1900, who he abandoned when he moved south (he did the same again to my Gran and her sister a few years later when he emigrated to Canada). I have been unable to trace what happened to either Dorothy or her mother. I was wondering if Troth is a romany name... and could this be where the story came from?

Thank you

Vicky
Lillywhite, Dwane, Hatchett, Curtis, Giuliani, Payne, Meen, Rockliff, Leopold, Winney, True, Groombridge, Middleton, Agombar, Scanlon, Grice, Vezey, Hindley, Cannell, Welch

Offline rob g

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Re: help with romany links
« Reply #37 on: Friday 04 July 14 07:35 BST (UK) »
Hi. Vicky. There are so many sites to visit. Type romany history in and lots will come up.  Romany genes is very good. Give that one a try first. In this country we are rom. Gypsies in northern Europe are sinte. eastern ones are roma.all quite different. Bit like north American indians.  Anyway winter is  a travelling name  have camped with many definitely a travellers name. Nash. Fracknell. And Chamberlain all have romany connections. But it doesn't mean that they are.  By the way Quite a boy! Your man. There's lots of emigrated gypsies in uk. Has been for hundreds of years. So the Spanish link is likely. But as I say there is no real royalty.  In travelling people. If you can find other travellers surnames in your tree. And jobs etc. Then you can trace those up. But remember that gypsies change surnames. And have lots of nick names. It can be confusing. As for troth. I have not come across it. But that's not too say it is not a travellers name.  Olso as I have said before. Gorgio men marrying romany girls often take her surname.  Not much help. I know. But if you get anything. And want to get back feel free. Cushty bokt..good luck) rob  g.
romany history, mitchell family history. Earthenware. general . And horse. I dealers/hawkers. market trading.  lancashire. cumbria. staffordshire.scotland. paternal, side. wilson. lee. burton. miller .burnside. Smith. varey. howard. Jones. Lowther. Evens. Ward. Dale.maternal, side. miller cumbria, stewert. mitchell. allan. Ireland. donaghue, Kelly. Murphy. Young. Plus many others. .

Offline vicky19

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Re: help with romany links
« Reply #38 on: Monday 07 July 14 10:55 BST (UK) »
Hi Rob

Thank you so much for your reply, thats great as the furthest back this lady has gone is a Meshach Winters abt 1800 in the Bristol area, possibly marrying a Sarah Fracknell....definitely a possible area for her to research more.

Yes my grt granddad was a real character by the sounds of it.... I will keep searching for the Troth link.

Many thanks again. Vicky
Lillywhite, Dwane, Hatchett, Curtis, Giuliani, Payne, Meen, Rockliff, Leopold, Winney, True, Groombridge, Middleton, Agombar, Scanlon, Grice, Vezey, Hindley, Cannell, Welch

Offline tamika88

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Re: help with romany links
« Reply #39 on: Friday 11 July 14 12:20 BST (UK) »
Hi everyone,

I was wondering if anyone can help me with my Romany lines. My main ancestor I am looking for more information on is Snow Alley Boswell also known as Maria/Mary Boswell. She was convicted and sent out to Australia for horse stealing, prostitution, more larceny among other things. She was convicted for the horse stealing in Warwickshire, England with a John Price. She was sent out in 1828 to Tasmania, Australia better known as Van Diemen's Land then.

Her parents were Josiah Boswell and Hannah (surname unknown). He was a tinkerer travelling in the Nottinghamshire area when she was convicted. As stated on her record. She was one of three girls born to the pair.

As far as I have been able to tell Josiah was the son of Richard Boswell and Phyllis Blewitt. Along with his siblings: Absolom Boswell; Israel Boswell; Lucy Boswell; Trinity Boswell; and Zachariah Boswell. I think they were his only siblings as I'm trying to find more research on them.

My great grandmother used to tell us all stories about her family being Gypsies when we were all little.

Any information would be greatly appreciated if anyone has any.

Kind regards

Tamika Phillips
(Victoria, Australia)


Offline rob g

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Re: help with romany links
« Reply #40 on: Sunday 13 July 14 23:46 BST (UK) »
Hi.  Tamika. Well you have done some research. I tend to give information on recent romany life.  And family . I can say that the Boswells are a really old gypsy people. I have camped with them on and off all my life. They travelled all of the UK. I live in the north. And there's lots
In this area.  It's not possible to give names etc of those I know. But yours is a interesting story. I am sure that you will find lots of people with info.try looking at the lancashire on line parish clerk sit (lanc opc) as lot's of Boswells lived in Lancashire. It's free. And with your information you may find something. Or try romany genes site. .rob..
romany history, mitchell family history. Earthenware. general . And horse. I dealers/hawkers. market trading.  lancashire. cumbria. staffordshire.scotland. paternal, side. wilson. lee. burton. miller .burnside. Smith. varey. howard. Jones. Lowther. Evens. Ward. Dale.maternal, side. miller cumbria, stewert. mitchell. allan. Ireland. donaghue, Kelly. Murphy. Young. Plus many others. .

Offline tamika88

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Re: help with romany links
« Reply #41 on: Monday 14 July 14 05:48 BST (UK) »
Hi Rob,

Thank you for your information! It was nice to meet someone who is still in touch with the Romany culture.

Tamika
Victoria, Australia

Offline TerriG

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Re: help with romany links
« Reply #42 on: Tuesday 17 March 15 15:45 GMT (UK) »
Hi Rob.  I've just posted this on the following topic:  http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=310556.18 and then I discovered your post and wondered if you may be able to help.

"My Gran's adopted sister was Lilian (Lily) Boswell born on 6 April 1904 in Birkenhead, and adopted by Walter & Mary Jane Lyon (nee Poole) of Barnton, Cheshire.  I know her birth mother was Mary Ellen Boswell from the birth certificate, and her residence at the time of birth was 24 Livingstone Road, Tranmere.  When Lily was a few weeks/months old, Mary Ellen sent a letter to the Lyons from where she was staying in Llanfairfechan.  From what she said, it seems that she was in service, and the letter was signed "E Boswell", so I'm assuming that she went by Ellen.

I've got a posting on the Cheshire board looking into all the possible Mary Ellen Boswells in the region, plus you can view the letter there: http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=648730.0

I've also posted on the Caernarvonshire board, and you can find they topic here: http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=649105.0

I would appreciate any help in determining where Mary Ellen Boswell was born, who her family were and what happened to her.  I've not looked at the gypsy angle before, so maybe this is where I'm going to find some answers - fingers crossed!

Thanks for reading, and do have a look at the letter on the Cheshire board - I think it's lovely."

Terri


McLeod, McKean, Hepburn (Fife)
McGowan, Gowan (Dumfriesshire, Ireland)
Nelson, McKean (Lanarkshire)
McKean, Mulgrew (Lethbridge, Alberta)
Boswell, Plumb, Lyon, Stokes, Pemberton, Crawford, Threadgold (Cheshire)
Tierney (Scotland/Ireland)

Offline rob g

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Re: help with romany links
« Reply #43 on: Wednesday 18 March 15 07:42 GMT (UK) »
hi. t.g. read the letter. sad really. but seems to have turned out ok. there are a few things that make me think there's no Romany connection. 1. she was educated. 2. there are no occupations. that fit gypsies. 3.apart from Boswell I don't recognize the surnames as travellers. if you want to learn a little more on the subject. contact me on pm. but whatever as allways nice to hear from you.and a lovely letter.thanks for sharing it.sorry I can't help further. yours rob.
romany history, mitchell family history. Earthenware. general . And horse. I dealers/hawkers. market trading.  lancashire. cumbria. staffordshire.scotland. paternal, side. wilson. lee. burton. miller .burnside. Smith. varey. howard. Jones. Lowther. Evens. Ward. Dale.maternal, side. miller cumbria, stewert. mitchell. allan. Ireland. donaghue, Kelly. Murphy. Young. Plus many others. .

Offline TerriG

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Re: help with romany links
« Reply #44 on: Saturday 21 March 15 22:03 GMT (UK) »
Thanks Rob for your reply.  I see where you're coming from with your arguments against her being a traveller, but it's good to explore all avenues when you hit a brick wall!  I just wish I could find out who gave birth to this lovely lady who was my (Great) Auntie Lily!
McLeod, McKean, Hepburn (Fife)
McGowan, Gowan (Dumfriesshire, Ireland)
Nelson, McKean (Lanarkshire)
McKean, Mulgrew (Lethbridge, Alberta)
Boswell, Plumb, Lyon, Stokes, Pemberton, Crawford, Threadgold (Cheshire)
Tierney (Scotland/Ireland)