Author Topic: Different birth places  (Read 6050 times)

Offline wilcoxon

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Different birth places
« on: Sunday 13 June 10 18:18 BST (UK) »
I have a William Edwards b c 1837.
In all these years he is living Brymbo area and I`m almost sure he`s the same  one all along.
The family names match quite niclely BUT , what about all the various places of birth , are they close enough to be a safe bet  ???


1901 William Edwards head 64 coal miner b Dyserth
1891William Edwards, head 54, coal miner, b. Treffynon
1881William Edwards head  44 coal miner b Holywell
1871William Edwards head 34 collier b Holywell
1861 William Edwards son 24 carter b Llanasa ( Father also William)

This may be the family in 1851, but William b 1837 ish is not  there
1851
Penisa Dyserth
William Edwards 48 willow carter b Ysceifiog
Elizabeth wife 43b Wrexham Mwywn glawdd ( Minera )
Mary 4 ? 11? b Holywell
Miriam 9   b “
Elizabeth    7 b Newmarket
Margaret    6b Cwm
Elias 5 b Dyserth
Joseph 4   “

Census information is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Offline Rah1980

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Re: Different birth places
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 13 June 10 18:30 BST (UK) »
Holywell/Treffynon are the same place however Llanasa is a fair few miles from Holywell, and Whitford parish is inbetween them, as for Dyserth that is even further away to the west and doesn't fit in at all and I am not aware of one closer to Holywell, although all three are in Flintshire. I don't suppose in the 1901 he was living in Dyserth? If not i'd say he isn't related to the other guys, and likewise if he wasn't living in Llanasa in the 1861 I wouldn't think he was the same guy as those from Holywell. The one thing I would say for Holywell is that it also incorporates Brynford, Bagillt, Greenfield, and a place I can never remember beginning with a C (as well as having the Welsh name of Treffynon) perhaps your Mr Edwards is hiding in one of those villages I have just mentioned?

Sarah

Ps sorry didn't take in the in all these years living in Brymbo. I think not being decisive between two different parishes is within the limits of possibility however I think it unlikely it is the same guy who can't decide between 3. 
Flintshire Parry, Price, Lloyd, Jones, Williams, Roberts, Ellis, Holland and Davies. Mostly from Brynford area.
Denbighshire Hannam, Evans
Scotland Clark, Duff, Ferrier, Cruikshanks, Robertson, Anderson, Mciver, Finlayson, Hodge, Galloway and Barrie
Midlands Shaw, Davenport, Skidmore, Ball
Ireland Mccaffery

Offline wilcoxon

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Re: Different birth places
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 13 June 10 19:16 BST (UK) »
You may as see the whole lot and see what you think, looking at 1851 & 61  I think William took his whole family around on his cart  ::)

The son.
1901 5 Nant Road . Bwlchgwyn
William Edwards 32 coal miner b Brymbo c 1869
Mary Jane wife 29 b Brymbo c 1872
William Jas. son 7   “
Hugh Owen  “6 “
Emlyn “3   “   
Moses “1   “

His parents
1901 15 Tanyfron Road  .
William Edwards 64 coal miner b Dyserth
Elizabeth wife 60  b Rhuddlan
Jane dau    22   b Brymbo

1891 RG12/4616/78/21
Ty Celyn, Ruthin Road, Minera 
William Edwards, 54, coal miner, b. Treffynon
Eliza, 50, b. Rhyddlan
William, 22, coal Miner, b. Vron Brymbo
Moses, 21, stoker - railway engine, b. -do-
Elizabeth, 16, dressmaker, b. -do-
Jane, 12, b. -do-

1881 Lower Road Summerhill
William Edwards 44 coal miner b Holywell
Elizabeth wife 36 b Holywell
William son 12 b Brymbo   
Moses “11 "            
Elizabeth dau 6 “               
Jane “2   “                 

1871 Pentre Fron
William Edwards 34 collier b Holywell
Elizabeth wife 29 b Rhuddlan
Mary dau    4 b Brymbo
William son 2 “
Moses “1   "

1861 RG9; Piece: 4277; Folio: 67; Page: 51;
Glanrafon Brymbo
William Edwards 53 lab b Caersrws Flints
Elizabeth wife.52 b Wrexham
William son 24 carter b Llanasa
Moses son 23 lab   b “
Margaret dau 17 b Conwy
Miriam dau 19 b Holywell
Elias son    15 b Dyserth
Joseph son 12 b “
Ellinor dau 7b “
Robert Williams son   4 b Dyserth   

1851
Penisa Dyserth
William Edwards 48 willow carter b Ysceifiog
Elizabeth wife 43 b Wrexham Mwywn glawdd
Mary 4 ? 11? b Holywell
Miriam 9   b “
Elizabeth    7 b Newmarket
Margaret    6 b Cwm
Elias 5 b Dyserth
Joseph 4   “
   


Census information is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Offline Rah1980

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Re: Different birth places
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 13 June 10 19:41 BST (UK) »
Why do our ancestors insist on making life difficult! In my opinion :-

1851 and 1861 family are the same

1871, 1881 and 1891 are the same and probably the 1901

whether the 1851 + 1861 is the same as the family in the later census I'm not sure, there certainly seems similarities with the family name Moses but it doesn't seem conclusive to me.

Sorry, I'm probably not much help  :'(
Flintshire Parry, Price, Lloyd, Jones, Williams, Roberts, Ellis, Holland and Davies. Mostly from Brynford area.
Denbighshire Hannam, Evans
Scotland Clark, Duff, Ferrier, Cruikshanks, Robertson, Anderson, Mciver, Finlayson, Hodge, Galloway and Barrie
Midlands Shaw, Davenport, Skidmore, Ball
Ireland Mccaffery


Offline wilcoxon

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Re: Different birth places
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 13 June 10 21:22 BST (UK) »
A second opinion always helps, next problem - they were Wesleyan at least after 1891. ::) ::)
Census information is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Offline Rah1980

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Re: Different birth places
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 13 June 10 21:25 BST (UK) »
Wrote this before I saw your new message!

Hopefully this helps but I have checked my records and there are no William Edwards baptised in Holywell St James between 1832 - 1840 which should cover the date of birth for William.

I can look for William seniors baptism in Ysceifiog if it will be of any use?

Sarah
Flintshire Parry, Price, Lloyd, Jones, Williams, Roberts, Ellis, Holland and Davies. Mostly from Brynford area.
Denbighshire Hannam, Evans
Scotland Clark, Duff, Ferrier, Cruikshanks, Robertson, Anderson, Mciver, Finlayson, Hodge, Galloway and Barrie
Midlands Shaw, Davenport, Skidmore, Ball
Ireland Mccaffery

Offline wilcoxon

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Re: Different birth places
« Reply #6 on: Monday 14 June 10 08:13 BST (UK) »
Any help at all will be very much appreciated. Thank you  :)
Census information is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Offline wilcoxon

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Re: Different birth places
« Reply #7 on: Monday 14 June 10 11:40 BST (UK) »
 I have been kindly sent this, it looks promising.

The Cocking Index of Non Conformist Baptisms in Flintshire shows the Baptism of a William Edwards at Holywell-Chester Rd Wesleyan Chapel on the 13th of November 1836 to Parents William Edwards(Carter) and Wife Elizabeth given as the daughter of William and Margaret Williams
William and Elizabeth Edwards are said to be living at Sarn,Llanasa Parish.

 I can`t find William Jnr ,Moses  or Margaret in 1851, 

This looks like the family in 1841
Holywell . Wellston ???
Nant Mill.
William Edwards 25 carter Y
Elizabeth Edwards 30 Y
Sarah " 8 Y
Aaron 6 Y
William 5 Y
Moses 3 Y
Mary 11 months Y
Census information is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Offline Rah1980

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Re: Different birth places
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 22 June 10 08:07 BST (UK) »
Sorry I haven't got back to you sooner. Unfortunately my Ysceifiog records stop at 1812 and the 1841 census has him born 1816, so even if they rounded him down he shouldnt have been born pre 1811 there is this one possibility however I think it unlikely with no children named Freeman.

William Edwards born 8/6/1812 s/o Goodman and Mary

Have you had any more luck since last post?
Flintshire Parry, Price, Lloyd, Jones, Williams, Roberts, Ellis, Holland and Davies. Mostly from Brynford area.
Denbighshire Hannam, Evans
Scotland Clark, Duff, Ferrier, Cruikshanks, Robertson, Anderson, Mciver, Finlayson, Hodge, Galloway and Barrie
Midlands Shaw, Davenport, Skidmore, Ball
Ireland Mccaffery