Author Topic: Hardy..an australian enigma  (Read 5145 times)

Offline sapphireblue67

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Hardy..an australian enigma
« on: Saturday 31 July 10 12:44 BST (UK) »
 ???  Hi...I have an English Relative that is causing all researchers into his history stop at him..NO ONE has been able to find out WHERE or what his DOB exactly is

His name is Richard Hardy...he married Suvina (Sabina) Hill in 1844 in Dungog NSW.  They had a very large family

No one knows HOW he got to Australia, there is a record of a Convict to Australia but if we go on his headstone and family stories...this man died just 3 days off his 117th Birthday.  He was 116 at time of death 1.9.1913....putting his dob at 4.9.1797
HOW do I go finding this as the FREE BDM uk do not go back that far...one other story was he was actually 112 at time of death and  later on his death certificate his daughter Ada Jane marked it as 102. 

Very confusing.

I hope this is in the right place for posting as I am new to this site and relatively new to family history.  I am basically on my own as all the "keepers"of our history are all now passed on

Thanks in Advance

Sapphire
ENGLAND clarke Lincolnshire, Arthur?, Neighbour, Hardy, Holden, Ringer, Hill, GERMANY Hohmann Vogt, Auer, Metz, IRELAND Fitzgerald

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Offline cath151

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Re: Hardy..an australian enigma
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 31 July 10 13:20 BST (UK) »
Hi Sapphire,
Welcome to Rootschat.
I expect you may have this information already but have you looked on Familysearch.org?
There are records for Richards marriage, wife and children and possible father , submitted by three people with their addresses.
As the records are submitted rather than extracted they are not really reliable as to details as they rely on Submitters details, not necessarily actual records.
There are about six records in the criminal registers before 1844 with two Richard Hardy s being transported.
Richard Hardy age 31 born c 1809, trial 25 May 1840 at Lancaster, transported 7 years.
Richard Hardy no dob  trial Nov 1832 Old Bailey, Middlesex. Transported 7 years.

Hopefully someone may come up with hard evidence,
Best wishes
 Cathy :)
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Offline AMBLY

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Re: Hardy..an australian enigma
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 31 July 10 13:47 BST (UK) »
Hi



The following website ages him as b abt 1818 London, died 1913 Nabiac NSW
http://users.tpg.com.au/bbolitho/RichardHardy/Index.htm

The NSW Death Index (1913 in Stroud district) , gives his father as "James"

Do  you mean Ada (the youngest child of many)  was the informant for the death certificate and stated his age 102? Or did the cert say he was 112 and she has made a note later to say he was actually 102?

The age on the headstone - does very clearly state he was 116?
Edit - added: Answer: Yes it does  ;D
http://austcemindex.com/inscription.php?id=5250805

Does his death cert. say how long he had been in Australia?

Cheers
AMBLY
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Offline sapphireblue67

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Re: Hardy..an australian enigma
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 31 July 10 14:30 BST (UK) »
the listing on the bblithe website is one lead that was dismissed with research later by another and as yet we haven't seen his death certificate...yes ada was the one who amended it to 112 then later 102 so even the daughter wasn't sure...apparently someone had his birth certificate but wouldn't let anyone see it...not sure why but now no one knows what has happened to it...maybe poor richard didn't know himself...LOL  I have actually got  a copy of his marriage certificate but not of his death certificate so maybe I will have to get a copy of it and start back from that.  I also have got the entire book that was researched from him to earlier time but they also couldn't shed any more light on it for me
ENGLAND clarke Lincolnshire, Arthur?, Neighbour, Hardy, Holden, Ringer, Hill, GERMANY Hohmann Vogt, Auer, Metz, IRELAND Fitzgerald

Offline Valda

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Re: Hardy..an australian enigma
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 31 July 10 14:53 BST (UK) »
Hi

I might have thought considering his advanced years, whatever quite they were, the local newspaper would have run an obituary on him as he had lived such a long life and if so there would be some reference to his origins in it?


Regards

Valda
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Offline Annette7

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Re: Hardy..an australian enigma
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 31 July 10 23:04 BST (UK) »
There is a somewhat detailed tree on Ancestry showing that is name was Richard Burcham Hardy b.14/12/1817, bp.5/4/1818 City of London.   Having checked on IGI this was at St. James Garlickhithe, London - son of James and Mary.   Another son Henry Stuart Hardy b.12/5/1814, bp.29/5/1814 same place.

Marriage records show a James Hardy married Mary Palmer 20/2/1812 St. James Garlickhithe, London.

He was transported on the Charles Kerr 6/6/1837 having been convicted on 19/9/1836 Old Bailey, London.   There's a quite lengthy note attached - when he arrived in Australia he and 3 other convicts (all named) were assigned to a W. E. Cormack of Williams River, Dungog.   Various physical details are given.

Two separate people spoke up for him at his trial - he lived in the Bethnal Green area of London.   One person was a weaver from Bethnal Green, the other was his father's employer who offered Richard a job if he was able to serve a custodial sentence rather than transportation.   His fathers employer being a James Watson, Cabinet Maker and Timber Merchant of Bethnal Green Road.   Richard Hardy at his trial said to be a cabinet maker for 3 1/2 yrs.

How accurate this is I can't say but reading through it all it does seems quite thorough.     I wouldn't have thought he'd have been much older (regardless of the gravestone) because his youngest Ada was born 1871!!!    If he'd been born c.1797 he'd have been 73/74 when she was conceived.   I doubt that very much.   There's also a picture of him and his wife although it's not dated.

Certainly, the arrival in Australia 1837 and his assignment to someone in Dungog all fits.

Annette

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Offline sapphireblue67

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Re: Hardy..an australian enigma
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 01 August 10 01:35 BST (UK) »
I all...As I said I am relatively new to this research part as well so to have other ppl able to come up with so much whereas I felt it was a very frustrating brickwall is to say the least...STUNNING...thankyou so much I would love to see this picture of Richard Hardy and his wife as there is a picture somewhere of him and his great grandson around somewhere and they match then yes it definately is him and this puzzle over here can be put to rest.

How and where have you all been able to find such info...I have searched the net for weeks trying to work it all out with many a headache.  I would love any help or I should say tips to help me keep going in this endeavour.
This site you are able to get this info I would love to see as well and I will print it off and yes as you said Annette it does all fit
Yes Valda I have his obituary details and they do say advanced yrs of 116yrs as well
Thanks once again you ppl are so wonderful
Sapphire
ENGLAND clarke Lincolnshire, Arthur?, Neighbour, Hardy, Holden, Ringer, Hill, GERMANY Hohmann Vogt, Auer, Metz, IRELAND Fitzgerald

Offline Annette7

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Re: Hardy..an australian enigma
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 01 August 10 02:46 BST (UK) »
Hi again

I found the information on a public tree on Ancestry.com.   The tree is named Fenning/McDonald Family Tree (there are some others for him but this was far more exact) with photo and detailed story.   The only strange thing was that the entry was just Richard Hardy with birth date 1818 Yorkshire - however, when I brought it up it was as Richard Burcham Hardy with full 1818 date shown as London.
I guess whoever put the tree on has found out more since initial entry and when they've amended it something hasn't quite followed through amending original name/birthplace.

Very late here so must go to bed now.

Annette
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline SuzM

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Re: Hardy..an australian enigma
« Reply #8 on: Saturday 14 August 10 03:57 BST (UK) »
Hi Everyone

I have some information on Richard Burcham Hardy.

I have a copy of his Baptism Record. It is clearly written that he was born on the 14 Dec 1817 to parents James and Mary Hardy. He was Baptized on the 5 Apr 1818 at St James Garlickhithe, City of London.

Hope this helps.

Suz
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