STOYLE & LEE Carpenters & Builders US lookup

[johnnyboy]

Hi all, especially Ambra: Welcome to Rootschat. Could you post any additional information on Edward Stoyle? I searched the New York City Death Index for his death in 1930, but found nothing.

I also searched for him in the 1920 U.S. census (on FamilySearch Pilot, which is not the best site to for the 1920 census). I found nothing there either.

I'm wondering: If Edard Stoyle is identified, then could his partner be Tom (or Thomas) Lee? "Tom" is mentioned on the postcard as the manager.

If Edward Stoyle was living in Manhattan in 1910, then there is a possibility that the house in the picture might also be in Manhattan, and I'd say Upper Manhattan, since row-house development and taller buildings were being constructed at that time in Midtown and Lower Manhattan.

One thing that puzzles me is the height of the windows of the house above the ground. One would expect, with New York's winters being as snowy as they are, that the window sills would be much further off the ground.

I will be at the New York Public Library this week and will find out if there are any commercial directories for New York for the period 1910-1920.

Regards,
John 

[001uk]

This could be a photo of Edward Stoyle, born in 1864 in Scotland, where his father, John Clarke Stoyle, was stationed as a soldier.   Edward followed him into the army for several years:  his army record can be seen on "Findmypast".    He appears in the 1901 census as a carpenter in Bedwelty, Wales.   He married there in 1904 but left his wife and went to the U.S.A., apparently before the 1911 census, when he did not show up in Britain.   He is said to have married again in the U.S.A.   At the end of his life he was ordered ashore to hospital in New York when about to return to Britain and he died in March 1930.

The man in the photo looks tall, and this Edward was over 6 feet in height (and dark-haired), according to his army papers.    The language in the postcard sounds a bit military, too.

Certainly this Edward was the "unmarried" Edward, aged 46, whom Erato found in Manhattan in the 1910 census.

Hello Ambra,
I'm impressed! What a selection of info: very many thanks for taking the time & trouble.I think we're homing in on him.
Thanks again.

[001uk]

Hi all, especially Ambra: Welcome to Rootschat. Could you post any additional information on Edward Stoyle? I searched the New York City Death Index for his death in 1930, but found nothing.

I also searched for him in the 1920 U.S. census (on FamilySearch Pilot, which is not the best site to for the 1920 census). I found nothing there either.

I'm wondering: If Edward Stoyle is identified, then could his partner be Tom (or Thomas) Lee? "Tom" is mentioned on the postcard as the manager.

If Edward Stoyle was living in Manhattan in 1910, then there is a possibility that the house in the picture might also be in Manhattan, and I'd say Upper Manhattan, since row-house development and taller buildings were being constructed at that time in Midtown and Lower Manhattan.

One thing that puzzles me is the height of the windows of the house above the ground. One would expect, with New York's winters being as snowy as they are, that the window sills would be much further off the ground.

I will be at the New York Public Library this week and will find out if there are any commercial directories for New York for the period 1910-1920.

Regards,
John 

Hi John,
Thanks for your contribution every extra bit of info helps and i look forward to seeing anything you might turn up after visiting the NY library. It's becoming a fascinating inter-continental story.
Appreciate your help.

[Lisa in California]

The front of the house is a bit odd (I thought).  It wasn't until John mentioned the height of the windows in reference to snow that now makes me wonder if the house (and property) is actually lower than the level of the road?

If you look at the door and frame, it is just "there", there doesn't appear to be a threshold.  What is next to the man, the two supports with a bar?  It could be used for horses, or maybe not.  Looking at the man in relation to the gate behind him, allowing for differences between items in the background, he still seems a bit tall to be standing on the same level as the gate.  Could there be a step down to the front door, and a step down to the driveway (which would be a good reason to have the railing across the front of the house, where there might not be a step down)?  There appears to be a line on the ground where the man is standing, that runs from him to the next building.  Could this indicate that the property is lower than the road?  Also, if the man is on the same road level as the door, still allowing for distance and perspective, he seems too tall for the door.   

PS  Hi Ambra, welcome to RootsChat. 

[Lisa in California]

Looking at the 1910 Manhattan census that Erato found, perhaps it is just coincidence, but living next door to  Edward Stoyle, age 46, born England, immigrated 1895, Carpenter, Automobile is:
Leahy?, Thomas, age 28, married (family is listed on the image), born Ireland, immigrated 1902, Carpenter, House.

Update:  Thomas lived two houses away, sorry.

[johnnyboy]

Hi all: I checked microfilm copies of a few directories for Manhattan (1911, 1912, and 1924) and Brooklyn (1913, I think). Manhattan directories include the Bronx.

I found no listing for any individual named Stoyle nor for any business named Stoyle and Lee. Is it possible that the business might have been Lee and Stoyle?
Ignore the last sentence. The card says Stoyle and Lee.

Regards.
John 

[Erato]

I agree, it does look like there’s a step down to the front door and a railing protecting the excavated space in front of the window.  To me, that’s one more thing that makes me think it’s not the Northeast.  To me it looks more like the South - say North Carolina.

[johnnyboy]

Hi again: Lisa, your mention of a step down to the front door made me take another look at the picture. You're right. There is a step down, and that reminded me that I lived on the ground floor of a Brooklyn brownstone for several years that had a step down to the entrance. "English basement" is the term used to describe that sort of layout--partially below and partially above the grade of the street.

My windows on the street side of the brownstone were about the same height off the ground as the windows in the picture. In 1996 we had 17 snowstorms, with a total of 87 inches of snow. The largest single accumulation was 20 inches, the drift were about halfway up the window.

The shutters were what threw me off in the picture. I didn't have shutters on my windows. And I didn't have them because there were steel bars over the windows, which made it impossible to open and close shutters. Now I'm inclined to think that this house is New York.

Regards,
John 

[Erato]

I’ve seen those step-down-a-bit constructions in Boston, too, but in more urban settings.  That little bit of unfenced front yard [looks like dirt] and the roofline suggest the south to me. 

I’ve blown up the bark and the leaves but I can’t make out what they are.  It looks like there are many branch scars going all the way up - as if it were some self pruning species; that's probably what suggested Eucalyptus to me in the first place.