Author Topic: National Probate Calender Query  (Read 2149 times)

Offline Ewan

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National Probate Calender Query
« on: Tuesday 05 October 10 20:22 BST (UK) »
Just a small query regarding the National Probate Calendar 1861-1941 if anyone can help please.

On the left of the index there is the deceased name and directly beneath that it says Personal Estate and an amount in pounds.

What I am asking does is mean the personal estate plus the monetary amount or is it just the monetary amount?

Thank you for any help.
Ewan

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Offline Daisy Loo

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Re: National Probate Calender Query
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 06 October 10 00:33 BST (UK) »
Hi :)

I believe that it means the Personal Estate was the value of the amount in £'s

Daisy Loo
All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


BARNETT- Buckinghamshire, Bedfordshire, Dorset HILSDEN/HILLSDEN/HILLSDON- Buckinghamshire, Berkshire, Canada PRESTIDGE/PRESTAGE- Warwickshire, Northamptonshire, Islington PINNIGER/PINEGAR/PINNEGAR - Wiltshire       Brambleby - Kent, Middlesex     
LEACH- Norfolk   BUTTERWORTH - Lancashire   OTTON - Somerset  LAWRENCE - Berkshire

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Offline Jebber

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Re: National Probate Calender Query
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 06 October 10 10:21 BST (UK) »
As a general rule, prior to 1898 it refers to just the personal estate.  From  the 1st. January 1898 EFFECTS refers to both real estate and personal estate.

Jebber
CHOULES All ,  COKER Harwich Essex & Rochester Kent 
COLE Gt. Oakley, & Lt. Oakley, Essex.
DUNCAN Kent
EVERITT Colchester,  Dovercourt & Harwich Essex
GULLIVER/GULLOFER Fifehead Magdalen Dorset
HORSCROFT Kent.
KING Sturminster Newton, Dorset. MONK Odiham Ham.
SCOTT Wrabness, Essex
WILKINS Stour Provost, Dorset.
WICKHAM All in North Essex.
WICKHAM Medway Towns, Kent from 1880
WICKHAM, Ipswich, Suffolk.

Offline Ewan

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Re: National Probate Calender Query
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 07 October 10 18:27 BST (UK) »
Thanks Daisly Loo and Jebber for your replies.

So have I got this correct?  Personal Estate £300 in 1886 would mean that the deceased belongings, personal possessions would amount to £300 and that is what would be left in the will.

Ewan

Offline Daisy Loo

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Re: National Probate Calender Query
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 07 October 10 21:08 BST (UK) »
ah...now...this is where I come unstuck!

My ancestor left a will, which stated Gross vaule of Personal Estate £254:4:0, yet the will went on to leave close on 80 houses that he had built, plus workshops/yards/building etc in Ipswich - so I couldn't quite get my head round that.  This will was dated 1884.

then another: referred to Gross value of estate: £722:0:0 and net value of personal Estate: Nil !  (1927) - yet the will went on to detail property and "ready money" (cash?), and was a will belonging to a spinster, whose occupation was a dressmaker, working from home.

I haven't yet managed to find answers that make sense to me!  ;D ::)
All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


BARNETT- Buckinghamshire, Bedfordshire, Dorset HILSDEN/HILLSDEN/HILLSDON- Buckinghamshire, Berkshire, Canada PRESTIDGE/PRESTAGE- Warwickshire, Northamptonshire, Islington PINNIGER/PINEGAR/PINNEGAR - Wiltshire       Brambleby - Kent, Middlesex     
LEACH- Norfolk   BUTTERWORTH - Lancashire   OTTON - Somerset  LAWRENCE - Berkshire

Offline Valda

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Re: National Probate Calender Query
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 07 October 10 21:26 BST (UK) »
Hi

Once a person dies the bills have to be paid - any debts, the costs of the funeral and the 'Death Duties' now called 'inheritance tax' would come out of 'ready cash' if possible.


The Death Duty Registers held at The National Archives 1796-1903

...'show what happened to someone's personal estate (not freehold) after death; and what it was actually worth, excluding debts and expenses'.

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=107



Over the years various laws have changed on the amount of death duties collected and who has to pay them.


The 1897 Land Transfer Act (came into force 1st January 1898) seems to be the law that changed the probate index

http://www.rootschat.com/links/09ym/

scroll down to Death Duties



Further information from a law book written in 1899 on death duties and paying debts

http://www.pbenyon1.plus.com/Shilling_Law/Executors_etc.html#Death Duties



Regards

Valda
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Offline Ewan

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Re: National Probate Calender Query
« Reply #6 on: Friday 08 October 10 18:43 BST (UK) »
Thank you for those links Valda and Daisy Loo for your experiences, I think I will ::) send off for one, at the moment I have the dad's and the daugter's will details, so will  ::) make a decision.

Ewan

Offline Nifty1

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Re: National Probate Calender Query
« Reply #7 on: Saturday 09 March 19 20:42 GMT (UK) »
Please can somebody post the Probate details of E. E. Kirtland ?
d. 25 11 1968 • Winkfield Row, Berkshire.
Kirtland (Oxfordshire Windsor, Berkshire)
Lipscombe (Longwick Berkshire 1825- 1960)
Marsh (Co Durham+Berks  Bucks post 1935, Wokingham 1990)
Reynolds (Buckinghamshire)
Green Berkshire)
Brown (? Co Durham)
Wilson ( ? Buckinghamshire)

Online Mckha489

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currently concentrating on NUTCHER & MARSHALL families, Hampshire.
and family of Thomas ANDERSON a Tailor of Perth, Scotland