Author Topic: Lane Independent Chapel, Holmfirth  (Read 18262 times)

Offline josey

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Re: Lane Independent Chapel, Holmfirth
« Reply #27 on: Thursday 28 January 16 18:39 GMT (UK) »
between Upp. Lane and the main road, Parkhead Road.
Not nitpicking but isn't the main road Greenfield Road?

with many stones still there, forming the steps, paths and bbq area!
Personally I feel this is an awful thing to do, much time & money was spent, often by people who could ill afford it, on memorial stones. Even if the descendants no longer visit, I feel it is disrespectful to wear away the 'evidence'. Why not stand them all upright around the edge? The same has happened in the small garden by the river in Holmfirth; many stones which have been legible for centuries - even in Yorkshire weather  :o - will be worn away in a few decades by heavy pedestrian traffic. 

I live extremely near to Lane Chapel cemetery & would be willing to photograph stones, with landowner's permission of course, for anyone. Perhaps in the summer I may ask their permission to photograph all the stones & make a file of MIs, although it would be very useful to know if the procedures detailed by Mark & dobfarm were actually carried out.
Seeking: RC baptism Philip Murray Feb ish 1814 ? nr Chatham Kent.
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, WILLIAMS,DUNEVAN Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Halifax & Pictou: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON

Offline dobfarm

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Re: Lane Independent Chapel, Holmfirth
« Reply #28 on: Thursday 28 January 16 19:12 GMT (UK) »
From Street view Google map -zoom in through thr gate of the Lane Chapel graveyard

Note;- The hoes pipe and flowers around, also the old flat stone memorial inscription on a flat stone gravestone in the path. Thus if any older than 1850's gravestone existed there, one would think they would still be there.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.5690738,-1.7923256,3a,53.9y,184.04h,61.2t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sStWkNOUi-8pfuDdUlOGcrQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Any transcription of information does not identify or prove anything.
Intended as a Guide only in ancestry research.-It is up to the reader as to any Judgment of assessments of information given! to check from original sources.

In my opinion the marriage residence is not always the place of birth. Never forget Workhouse and overseers accounts records of birth

Offline josey

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Re: Lane Independent Chapel, Holmfirth
« Reply #29 on: Thursday 28 January 16 19:15 GMT (UK) »
There are chickens in there sometimes as well. I pass it almost every day.
Seeking: RC baptism Philip Murray Feb ish 1814 ? nr Chatham Kent.
IRE: Kik DRAY[EA], PURCELL, WHITE: Mea LYNCH: Tip MURRAY, SHEEDY: Wem ALLEN, ENGLISHBY; Dub PENROSE: Lim DUNN[E], FRAWLEY, WILLIAMS.
87th Regiment RIF: MURRAY
ENG; Marylebone HAYTER, TROU[W]SDALE, WILLIAMS,DUNEVAN Con HAMPTON, TREMELLING Wry CLEGG, HOLLAND, HORSEFIELD Coventry McGINTY
CAN; Halifax & Pictou: HOLLAND, WHITE, WILLIAMSON

Offline dobfarm

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Re: Lane Independent Chapel, Holmfirth
« Reply #30 on: Thursday 28 January 16 19:34 GMT (UK) »
Reminder -Burial record John Cockin died October 1861 and should be in the records

Holmfirth, Lane C WYK1080  burials 1858-1984 held at Kirklees WYAS or on film in the Huddersfield library

Noting he was a long serving minister one would think a memorial would be in the chapel

http://www.archives.wyjs.org.uk/documents/archives/Collections%20Guide%202.pdf





Scroll down the link to numbers 377 & 378

http://www.ebooksread.com/authors-eng/charles-augustus-hulbert/annals-of-the-church-and-parish-of-almondbury-yorkshire-blu/page-34-annals-of-the-church-and-parish-of-almondbury-yorkshire-blu.shtml


John Cockin, 1806, his labours continued longer than any of his pre-
 decessors ; he resigned in 1849. During his ministry the Chapel
 was twice enlarged, the Chapel House enlarged, two Schoolrooms
 built, and additional Burial Ground bought


That addition burial ground maybe the one further up Upperthong lane on the left opposite the Anglican churchyard
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Any transcription of information does not identify or prove anything.
Intended as a Guide only in ancestry research.-It is up to the reader as to any Judgment of assessments of information given! to check from original sources.

In my opinion the marriage residence is not always the place of birth. Never forget Workhouse and overseers accounts records of birth


Offline dobfarm

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Re: Lane Independent Chapel, Holmfirth
« Reply #31 on: Friday 29 January 16 07:20 GMT (UK) »
http://catalogue.wyjs.org.uk/advanced.aspx?src=CalmView.Catalog

2nd post 1857 burial ground - exact location where - ? (reminder John Cockin died 1861)

I am told, by Law that on/with Property Deeds, a record of everyone buried there MUST be recorded, so if the planning authority have granted permission (after the change in this Law) for the Chapel to become a dwelling and no Burial Register/s covering the whole burial period, is/are known. The Planning Dept., MUST have commissioned an authorised Survey of all the headstones, BEFORE any work commenced.

Also, council's have planning responsibilities to record Memorials at and around the property, when a planning application comes before them, whether the building is Listed or not and also make any planning conditions about what can/cannot be done in the future as well, with the memorials.

You should also find in the chapel conversion planning application, a 'change of use' from Cemetery to garden, where the pre application Survey might be, if not with the main planning application.

If the council try to argue, there is no change of use application to garden, then the Memorials in the garden, ought to be exactly as they were - pre planning application.

I would be most surprised and shocked indeed, if some are now under a patio and nobody has an authorised record of the memorials. You could say a 'grave failing', if you pardon the pun.

Regards Mark


http://catalogue.wyjs.org.uk/Record.aspx?src=CalmView.Catalog&id=WYAS4197%2f2%2f1%2f21&pos=6

Read bottom paragraph in link below

http://catalogue.wyjs.org.uk/Record.aspx?src=CalmView.Catalog&id=WYAS252&pos=4
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Any transcription of information does not identify or prove anything.
Intended as a Guide only in ancestry research.-It is up to the reader as to any Judgment of assessments of information given! to check from original sources.

In my opinion the marriage residence is not always the place of birth. Never forget Workhouse and overseers accounts records of birth

Offline BushInn1746

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Re: Lane Independent Chapel, Holmfirth
« Reply #32 on: Tuesday 02 February 16 03:27 GMT (UK) »
Hello BlackpoolBelle, dobfarm and All

I am most interested in your Rev. John Cockin being an Independent, because a "Jane Cockin" (according to another FindMyPast scan) appears as a Witness to my 4 times Gt. Grandfather George Hood's marriage at Selby Yorkshire 18 July 1815 (George born Yorks per 1841 Census) and we can find no Parish of Selby September 1845 burial record (including Society of Friends, Quakers), or no Selby Parish baptism either, suggesting George might be a dissenter.

It's a long shot, but if checking, if you come across George Hood who died 18 September 1845 or other Hood burials up to November 1879 (Sarah Hood), please let me know?
_________________________________________________________

Regarding Grave Memorials, they are considered important ...

Memorandum by English Heritage (CEM 80)
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200001/cmselect/cmenvtra/91/91m85.htm
It is interesting the importance that the Secretary of State's advisor English Heritage (now Historic England) was placing on graveyard memorials, see preamble (quoted below) on the above Parliament UK link. Also see part 2 (on link).

1. PREAMBLE

  1.1  English Heritage welcomes the opportunity to submit a memorandum to the Environment Sub-committee expressing our views on cemeteries. Our comments are restricted to England although many of the general observations we make apply more widely. The heritage value of cemeteries is enormous. The issues they raise are wide-ranging and complex and involve ethical and religious considerations, respect for our ancestors, archaeological, architectural, historic and wildlife importance, open space, tourism and amenity value. Most of these issues and the management decisions that result from them are best dealt with at local level. It is in local cemeteries in the main that local people's loved ones, relations and ancestors lie and where they too will lie in time (as inhumations or cremations). It is also local communities that benefit most directly from the amenity value that cemeteries provide. But the future of cemeteries is not solely a local issue. Genealogists and descendants of buried people have an interest, even though they may now live far away from the cemetery in which their families lie. And national bodies have a responsibility to identify the most significant cemeteries when judged against national scales of importance, and participate in discussions about their future.

  1.2  English Heritage's concerns and responsibilities, as the lead body within the historic environment sector, revolve primarily around the following: the evaluation of the historical and landscape significance of cemeteries and the individual components within them (such as cemetery chapels or memorials); the archaeological importance of the human remains they contain; the provision of guidance on evaluating historical and archaeological significance; providing advice on repair, maintenance and management; and the disbursement of grants for repair within available resources and our statutory remit. English Heritage also has a well-respected education service which, among other activities, actively encourages teachers and tutors to make effective curriculum use of the historic environment.

2.  THE CULTURAL SIGNIFICANCE OF CEMETERIES


You will find more advice, by typing in the words ... historic England advice "Grave memorials" in your search bar.

If the council Planners, council's Conservationist, or Council's HER did not give the subject, the importance it deserved when considering the application, ask them why not and quote the bits which support your letter and that their actions may have thwarted your research to see whether there was a memorial or not and what information the Memorial contained.

Check the Legal requirement (the BBC News claimed there was one) about those being buried should be recorded on property Deeds and if so, you might suggest that there ought to be a record of the 'Grave Memorials' before work commenced, because Grave Memorials often contain more information, than the Burial Register (some of which are not available) and therefore Memorial information surveys are of immense importance.

Did you also note, in one of the West Yorkshire Archives links (by dobfarm), the link refers to grave registers ...

Includes baptisms 1949-1999, grave registers 1858-1984, minutes 1933-1999, church accounts 1974-1989, portraits and photographs of ministers 1806-1994

Laying Memorials as paving should be banned, due to foot erosion, extra weathering, being dug up and further damaged, disposed of by Utility companies.

Regards Mark (retired council officer)

Offline BushInn1746

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Re: Lane Independent Chapel, Holmfirth
« Reply #33 on: Thursday 04 February 16 02:11 GMT (UK) »
Sorry, just noticed the 'grave registers' listed are not early enough >:( , Kind regards Mark

EDIT: Sorry about my comment immediately above, according to West Yorks online catalogue, grave registers start 1858.

Kind regards, Mark

Offline dobfarm

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Re: Lane Independent Chapel, Holmfirth
« Reply #34 on: Thursday 04 February 16 10:29 GMT (UK) »
Sorry, just noticed the 'grave registers' listed are not early enough >:( , Kind regards Mark

Burial ground opened  25 Sept 1857 Rev John Cockin died 1861 4 years later

http://catalogue.wyjs.org.uk/Record.aspx?src=CalmView.Catalog&id=WYAS4197%2f2%2f1%2f21&pos=6
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Any transcription of information does not identify or prove anything.
Intended as a Guide only in ancestry research.-It is up to the reader as to any Judgment of assessments of information given! to check from original sources.

In my opinion the marriage residence is not always the place of birth. Never forget Workhouse and overseers accounts records of birth

Offline BushInn1746

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Re: Lane Independent Chapel, Holmfirth
« Reply #35 on: Friday 05 February 16 00:25 GMT (UK) »
Sorry, just noticed the 'grave registers' listed are not early enough >:( , Kind regards Mark

Burial ground opened  25 Sept 1857 Rev John Cockin died 1861 4 years later

Oops!

Thanks for correcting me dobfarm.

In one of the West Yorkshire Archives links by dobfarm in reply #31, the link refers to grave registers from 1858 ...

Includes baptisms 1949-1999, grave registers 1858-1984, minutes 1933-1999, church accounts 1974-1989, portraits and photographs of ministers 1806-1994

Kind regards, Mark