property of 'Cheriton'

[pbhawkin]

I have found a charlotte Hillyer christened 28/10/1810 @ martyr worthy father john hillyer and mother sarah hunt. This is from the Familysearch.org
Now how do we prove that this charlotte Hillyer is the same as the charlotte hillier who married Alexander in 1830?

[dee-jay]

If I remember correctly, in one census return *[1871]* Charlotte HAWKINS actually gave her birthplace 'Chilland'.  In one I already mentioned ~[1851]~ she was absent from husband Alexander and in the household of her mother, Sarah, at Martyr Worthy.      

* *Update:  See RG10 piece 1157 folio 65 page 8

[Little Nell]

You have a baptism for a Charlotte Hillyer in 1810, at Martyr Worthy, parents John & Sarah.

You have Charlotte Hawkins listed as married daughter, born about 1810 in Martyr Worthy listed wither mother Sarah Hillyer in 1851.

Do you have a marriage certificate for Alexander Hawkins & Charlotte Hillyer which gives her age relatively accurately and her father as John, occupation gardener (or similar)? 

And you have a Charlotte Hawkins born about 1810 in Martyr Worthy living with her husband Alexander in a census?

If so, I would say you were well nigh there as far as proof is concerned.

Nell

[pbhawkin]

Nell,
Yes I suppose you are correct
However, their marriage certificate spells Charlotte's surname as Hillier and there is NO dates of birth for either listed. It list his occupation as batchelor and hers as spinster!
Also it says that it was signed in the presence of a John Hillier and a Sarah Parsons.

Dee-Jay
are these references:
RG10 piece 1157 folio 65 page 8
HO107 piece 1673 folio 108 page 7
to the 1871 and 1851 census respectively? and if so what is easiest for me to obtain copies, online or direct from the Archives do you think?
And who is SKS you mentioned above?

regards
peter

[dee-jay]

Hi Peter

Answers to your questions in reverse order:

SKS = Some Kind Soul 

If you are serious about researching your UK family history you need to consider the desirability of subscribing to a genealogy website where you can access the UK Census returns 1841-1911 for a fee and download copies to your computer.

The references I gave will enable you to easily identify the correct schedules for the folks in which you have interests.

As for the spelling of surnames, this was dependent entirely on the interpretation by the parish clerks or incumbents who made entries in the registers.  Most folk were illiterate and it was not until the introduction of compulsory education in the late 19th Century that surnames as we know them today evolved for the majority of the population.  I have some ancestors who provided perfect, legible, signatures at marriage, for whom the 'official' preparatory details distorted their surnames.  If the clerks/clerics could make HITCHCOCK and HISCOX out of HISCOCK, I see no problem with variant spellings that all sound like HILLIER!  It helps a great deal when you can trace a family's presence in a particular village from the late 18th Century through the early-19th and from 1841 onwards.  You should consider yourself very lucky!

I don't know where your family researcher was based but I presume she did not have access to all the facilities we enjoy today ..... ??

[pbhawkin]

SKS 
LOL!
Of course.

My family researcher was my father's sister who died 3 years ago at age 88. But she was notorious for only recording things she thought she be included and has been known to ignore the convicts in the maternal side of the family (in her little book she had published)! She had done some research in the 1970s in England and the rest was from family members I think.

I certainly don't mind paying for the information BUT I want to known that I can get it in one location rather than haveto join a number of sites.
Do you have any suggestions as to if one site is more complete than another containing census and BMD certificates etc?
I have come close to buying into a couple but am unsure if I want a pay for view which is convienient or a 3-6 month subscription but then have to tell them to cancel it after a set period.

Is it fair to say that the 1841, 1861 and 1871 census' have abbreviated information? And I believe that there was no real census before 1841?

regards
Peter

[Little Nell]

A lot of your questions might be answered from looking at topics on the Beginners board.  This topic is about searching pre-1837:

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,54385.0.html

This one is about Civil Registration and Census (see reply no 4 on the thread):

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,428062.0.html

Different topics will cover Scotland and Ireland.

Unfortunately there is no one place which contains all the information you seek.  Not everything is online and there comes a time when you may have to gain access to original records somehow.

If looking for people after 1837, when civil registration was introduced in England and Wales, most people tend to rely on BMD certificates, but to get all the information on them (e.g. mother's maiden name for births, informant of death, cause of death, fathers' names on marriage certificates), you have to buy the certificates and at £9.25 this would mount up.  Some sites, like the new IGI FamilySearch (free!) have some extra information from marriage certificates, but it is not a substitute for the proper entry.  Some sites - Ancestry is one - have images from registers held by London Metropolitan Archives available to view.  This is good if you have London ancestors, not so useful if they come from elsewhere.

Is it fair to say that the 1841, 1861 and 1871 census' have abbreviated information?

Not quite sure what you mean by abbreviated information.  Have a read of the topic I gave the link for about census and see if it answers your questions.  If not, come back and ask or look in the RootsChat Library for other topics which may already cover your question.

As far as subscription sites are concerned e.g. Ancestry and FindMyPast, they offer a two week free trial which would enable you to decide if you wanted to sign up for a longer subscription.  Read the blurb first to make sure you know how to cancel!

Nell

[dee-jay]

Brilliantly handled, Nell!  I was browsing the Beginners Section whilst you were replying.  After 20+ years' research, I could write a book myself but time is very precious at my end of the scale ..... 

I have spent some time on the records of Martyr Worthy at HRO, so many of the names are already familiar to me.  If Peter would like to contact me via the Personal Message facility on here, I'd be happy to correspond direct via his email address.

Peter:  Click on 'dee-jay' in the left margin of my posts to access my profile, from which you can see how to send a personal message to me with your email address, if you so wish.

[pbhawkin]

Nell,
Thanks for the pointers. Please escuse my 'newbee' "leap before you look" attitude

Dee-Jay thanks for the offer. I will contact you later today when home from work.

Just to let you know I have joined Ancestory.com and have located each of Alexander and Charlotte on ALL the censuses (thanks to both your pointers). And printed out the scans and record index for each, as well as the record of his will (and written off for a proper copy of the will from the HRO).

anyway, thanks again and I may still bother you yet!!