Why can't I find records of voyages to South Africa?

[maryd]

Dear All

I don't often post but...here goes....my paternal grandparents Philip Charles DENVIR b27.05.1886 Whitehaven Cumberland m Annie LOWERY b 1887 Whitehaven. They married at Norwich (!) on 11.07.1919 (4b 438) - a 'runaway marriage' as he was catholic and she was protestant. They travelled to South Africa on at least 1 possibly 2 occasions. I have lace tableclothes from Madeira en route and stories of being robbed on the quayside losing passports etc. To cut a long story short, Annie didn't like it there and they returned home. They were loaned some money by her brother to start a bakery when they got back to Whitehaven (all documented in letters, but a very elderly and lately deceased aunt's memory not quite as reliable). I cannot find ANY record of their voyages - either on passenger lists or incoming passenger records on ancestry. I think they might have travelled around the time of their marriage and have tried searching for them as married/ single/ as Ann/ Charles/ Charlie etc)....no luck! Can anyone please point me in the right direction?
Many thanks
maryd

[CaroleW]

They had 3 children born 1921,  1922 and 1924 according to freebmd

John b 1921 died 1921
Annie b 1922 died 2001
Philip b 1924 died 1975

Philip snr died 1948 so the timescale for any travelling would be 1924-1948 as Annie did not die until 1964

Also a possible "quick trip" between 1919 and 1921

[maryd]

Thank you!!!Yes, they did have 3 children - John d aged 1 day and Philip was my father. Annie, the other child, told me that her parents went to South Africa before they had children (neither she nor my father went there). John was b and d in Whitehaven. I have looked for their voyage/s as a married couple and as single people (thinking maybe they had 'eloped' before they married to SA). They did elope to Norwich to marry (I have the certificate). Given that I also have various memorabilia from their travels, I have no doubt they went there but when????Could they have travelled overland? At some point they stayed in Madeira which my grandmother loved. 
Thanks
maryd

[meles]

Ancestry is giving a few days of free immigration records to all. Ends very soon. That might help.

meles

[CaroleW]

If they went before their first child was born - that shortens the timescale considerably.  July 1919 - when they married - to June qtr 1921 when son John was born

[maryd]

Thanks for the amazingly fast responses!
Meles: I have ancestry subscription and search regularly (as more records are added) but no sign of them. I thought someone might know which ships regularly sailed to South Africa between 1919 and 1921, then I could browse the whole manifest to see if they are there (transcribing can be so very difficult at times)...I might be able to spot them.

I wondered whether they might have gome immediately after they lost their first child aged just 1 day? Their second child, Annie was definitely born in Whitehaven - I have her certificate. The 1911 census firmly places Philip Charles Denvir at home with his family - consistently noted as a dental mechanic. I note they were relatively 'late' to marry - and neither had been married before - puzzle!!!???
thanks everyone
maryd

[CaroleW]

I am wondering if it may be one of those family "myths" that has expanded over the years?  Lace tablecloths from Madeira but  I have absolutely no idea what route a ship to SA would take but it may be worth checking if it was feasible that it would stop in Madeira for a sufficient time to allow passengers time on land.

I wondered whether they might have gome immediately after they lost their first child aged just 1 day?

Given the birth and death of her child (and her age) - I wonder how many women back then (or even today)  would have felt like embarking on a long sea voyage after those events??  Also - Annie was born in the September qtr 1922 so she became pregnant again fairly quickly

[maryd]

Thanks for your comments and ideas - hugely welcome!
Madeira was en route from UK to SA and story substantiated (or repeated???) by the brother who lent them the money to set up a bakery when they returned. Both the brother (Harry FS Lowery) and their daughter (Annie Denvir) both now deceased, told me about their trips to SA. I initially thought they might have set off to the mining areas in SA as Whitehaven was heavily mined at the time for coal, but Philip Charles was a dental mechanic both before he allegedly went out to SA and on his return. The timescale for a journey  must have ended before 03.04.1921 when Annie's widowed brother James died because she 'adopted' her brother's orphaned daughter. Her first child John was b 02.05.1921 and d 03.05.1921. She had to be continually in Whitehaven from 03.04.1921.
Will have to keep looking! Thanks everyone
maryd