Help Request : William Edwards (Ysgeifiog)

[ChrisEdwardsUSA]

I have traced my paternal lineage back to William Edwards, born in Ysgeifiog in 1811.

1841 Census records indicate he was married to Sarah, and by the 1851 census to Sophia, still residing in the village.

Can anyone please advise how I can trace the family line back beyond William? I have been using Ancestry.com & it seems getting back early than 1837 is not possible?

Any advice gratefully received 

[Rah1980]

How sure of the date are you? (as 1841 can be a few years out) I have transcribed copies of Ysceifiog Parish Church but only up to 1812. Possible baptisms are

William baptised 11/6/1811 born on 8/6/1811 s/o Goodman & Mary
William baptised 2/9/1809 born 1/9/1809 s/o John & Ann (Luke)
William baptised 15/9/1808 born 14/9/1808 bastard s/o Robert Lloyd & Sarah Edwards

Do any of his childrens names match with possible parents names? To get confirmation, I would suggest that you order the cert/request look up of Williams marriage to Sophia to confirm his fathers name, or a look up request for his first marriage. Is it def the same William Edwards in both census?

Sarah

[Megran]

The NWBMD has a marriage 1838 at Ysceifiog, St Mary for a William Edwards to Sophia Parry.

Is the name clear on the 1841 census as Sarah?
HTH,
Megran.

[Jo Harding]

The details in the 1841 and 1851 census returns suggest it is the same William Edwards.

1841 has William married to Sarah, the name is distinct. They have children who include John, aged 2 and Richard aged 1 month. The family is living at Ffynnon Lon... William is shown as aged 30, Sarah, 36.

In the 1851, William is shown as aged 40, married to Sophia, aged 42. Their chidlren include John, aged 12 and Richard, aged 10. The family are living in Bryndengan (??)

The names and ages of John and Richard, suggest this is the same family.

It appears that Sarah died between 1841 and 1851. I have checked BMD but there are a number of deaths registered for a Sarah Edwards in that period. The registration should have been in Holywell district.

Some of the records for Ysceifiog are on Freereg but I couldn't find anything for him, or them, on there. http://www.freereg.org.uk/

Have you found them on the 1861, or later census returns? There may be more clues there.

The problem with genealogy in the Ysceifiog area is that there were so few surnames and it is very difficult deciding who is the right person. I have this problem myself with a 4xgt grandmother by the name of Mary Williams born 1790. I looked at the parish registers to find a total of 5 possible Mary Williams all born there at that time. I shall never know who was "my" Mary.

Jo.

[Jo Harding]

You may like to read the details on Ysceifiog on the Genuki site:

http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/FLN/Ysceifiog/

Jo.

[KGarrad]

1841 has William married to Sarah, the name is distinct. They have children who include John, aged 2 and Richard aged 1 month. The family is living at Ffynnon Lon... William is shown as aged 30, Sarah, 36.

Actually, no it doesn't!

The 1841 census did not show any relationship to Head of Household, nor places of birth.

You can usually infer that a couple enumerated in the same house were man-and-wife, but it isn't proof that they were!

[ChrisEdwardsUSA]

Thank you for the response to my request! It has exceeded my expectations.... I went to bed last night wondering if I would get anything useful back, now I have some leads to follow-up ( it seems the marriage certificates hold the key to the earlier generation ), and thank you also for the links to information on Ysgeifiog. It was interesting to see another William Edwards mentioned in the BBC link 1790-1855, referred to as the "Bard of Ysceifiog", probably a uncle or brother of "my" William...

Personally I was born in Chester, but have not lived in the area for over 10 years, if was not living in New Jersey, I would have been taking a trip to Ysgeifiog this weekend!

The last 24 hours have been fascinating, I am hooked!, thanks again....

Chris

[Jo Harding]

Quote from KGarrard earlier today:

The 1841 census did not show any relationship to Head of Household, nor places of birth.

You can usually infer that a couple enumerated in the same house were man-and-wife, but it isn't proof that they were! Grin

I accept that the 1841 census didn't show relationships and my mistake in the post quoted. My main point was that Sarah's name was clear, this followed a suggestion in a previous post it may not have been. There was no suggestion that it showed place of birth.

It is accepted that the census does not represent proof of a marriage between William Edwards and Sarah. They are shown in the same household as is pointed out.

I did not mention the fact that ages were rounded up, or down, to the nearest five years in the 1841 census. Given the age of Sarah being shown as 36, I wonder if this was applied by the enumerator in Ysceifiog.

Jo.

Jo.

[KGarrad]

Sorry, Jo.
It wasn't personal!   ChrisEdwardsUSA made the same point in the original post, but I was too lazy to scroll all the way there!!

And, in light of Megran's post regarding a possible marriage to Sophia in 1838, maybe the Sarah quoted was mis-written by the enumerator, or Sarah wasn't William's wife? Or it's a different William?!

I just didn't want anyone falling into the trap of thinking that William and Sarah were married.
True, they might be - but there is no proof!