Trait of Muckalee Kilkenny

[kenneth cooke]

I've just noticed the last four messages. I was not notified about them. I've just fixed that and will now answer them.
I've been in touch with my second cousin, Evelynne, by phone.
Thanks to Seanmac for the info about the graves & the tithe defaulter.
Tithes were an annual sum paid to the established church (C. of Ireland) by all landholders, regardless of religion. Naturally there was great resentment  among Catholics, especially when times were bad. (Correct me if I'm wrong about this)
Kyren Trait, tithe defaulter in 1841 (5 years before the famine started) was the father of Kyren, b. 1835, who came to Australia in 1853. He made his way to Geelong, Victoria, where his uncle Michael (my ancestor) then lived.
Kyren snr, I believe died before 1849, as his wife Mary was then listed as the tenant.
Re the headstones of Butlers & Byrnes. So far I have not sorted out the Butlers
or Byrnes. As for Lyons of Knockshanbally, that is where our Lyons ancestor, Daniel c. 1830-1893, came from. (He came to Australia and his daughter Anne married Michael, grandson of 'old' Michael Trait.)
So, the other Daniel Lyons 1828-1902, of the same place was probably our Daniel's cousin.
Ken

[maxalf]

Check wandesforde estate records. Wandesfordes brought many english to castlecomer/muckalee area.

[kenneth cooke]

Thanks Maxalf
You write “ Wandersfordes brought many English to Castlecomer/Muckalee  area”. That would be a plausible explanation for the Traits’ arrival in Ireland.
I wonder what period that would have been, and what the sources are.
I have had a look through the summary of the Prior-Wandersforde papers and found one reference, “Traight’s holding, Castlecomer” from 1843, but no details.
There were references to assisted emigration of tenants from Ireland, 1840s & 1850s, but I found nothing about bringing people from England.
It would have to have been in the mid-1700s or earlier.
Traits were noted in England from 1544, first in the south-west, then spreading to London and beyond. The first record from Ireland was the marriage of Catherine Van Treight to Thos Scott, Diocese of Ossory (Kilkenny) in 1762, then one in Dublin (C of I) 1782, the rest in Kilkenny.
Later there was a Charles Traite, bapt. 28.1.1836 at St Mary’s Kilkenny, father Mr Traite (received into RC church),  mother not named, sponsor Eliz Murphy. (This entry shows, I believe, the last Trait to convert.)
Ken

[maxalf]

Prior wandesford papers in national archives have name of tennants leasing land. they brought english skilled workers in from mid to late 1600s. mainly iron workers and miners. They became the middlemen by re letting their land to locals. The family I am researching also came in this way. The Wandesfords had estates in Yorkshire in england.

[kenneth cooke]

Apparently some landlords assisted their tenants to emigrate. Sounds like Christian charity, but there was one condition- they could not transfer the lease to friends or relatives, it reverted to the landlord. In this way, landlords eliminated middlemen, and collected rents direct from tenants.
I don’t know if our Traits were ‘assisted’ to emigrate in 1852, but I do know that they were not on Wandersforde land. We find them in Griffiths Evaluation 1849-50, in the Parish of Kilmadum, townland of Ballyfoyle, owned by an absentee English landlord, Vice Admiral Sir Josiah Coghill:
Thomas Trait, Michael Trait and Mary Trait.
They each rented a house, land (about 17 acres), & office (barn) for L7.10sh to L8 p.a.
Michael was our ancestor, Thomas was his brother (stayed in Ireland) and Mary was Kyren’s (another brother) widow. Her son, Kyren jnr came to Australia.
However, there were Traits in Castlecomer. They may have started there, and then spread to other parts.
Ken

[maxalf]

Their immediate landlord may have been as you named but he may have been a middle man. Check the landowners of Ireland list 1876,
PS. I know Traits of Kilkenny. Thomas Trait is an electrician locally.

[kenneth cooke]

Thanks for that Maxalf
Coghill was no middleman. He died in 1850 and his son Sir Jocelyn got the land. He is noted in the list you quoted, 1876.
Sir Jocelyn Coghill of Belvidere, Drumcondra, 4564 acres, L2622 p.a.
I met some of the Traits in 2010. I think Thomas was one of them.
His late brother was Patrick, whose wife Marie I met too. Lots of people in Kilkenny town knew the Traits. Even the receptionist at the hotel was related.
Ken

[maxalf]

Did you check out the new database on findmypast.ie........petty sessions courts and prison registers. and others......Traits mentioned

[maxalf]

Trait .......Tithe defaulters list......Testament of collector   


 Memorialist having appointed a Proctor for the year 1831, was prevented from taking the usual proceeding of valuation of crops, the said Proctor being then immediately seized, after leaving Dunmore Glebe House, by a party of men threatening to have blood, who swore him never to value crops again, and compelled him to cut his Valuation Books before them, an Affidavit to this effect was sworn before T. Green Resident Magistrate. No further steps were taken by Memorialist to recover his tithes for 1831 as it would have been attended with unhappy results, loss of property or perhaps of life, the Parish being in a very unsettled state in consequence of which, the Local Authorities have established a Police Station in Dunmore Park, not far from Glebe House, Memorialist has been noticed by White Feet to desist from endeavouring to recover Glebe Land, under threat of having the Glebe House burned, and was obliged to desist (crossed out) relinquish law proceedings in consequence. Any attempt, it may be seen, from this statement would have been equally fruitless to recover tithe. The country here is in a state of anarchy or barbarism.